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Thread: Flight Stands with built in Altitude rings

  1. #51

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    Quote Originally Posted by Col. Hajj View Post
    Ed, should be the end of the month. Bryan is cutting the flame/smoke and rulers this weekend and will be ordering the acrylic for stands next week.
    Thats great news Keith!

  2. #52

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    Default Questions always questions

    As this is my first time here, on this fourm.(which i found after i googled W O W.)I am very impressed with this site,and as my first question.Do you have a update on when the flight stands will be ready for sale i would love to get my hands on some of those standsAlso could a person place a order ahead of time,say 5 to 10 stands at a time,just a thought,thanks

  3. #53

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    They will be back in stock around the end of the month. I've turned off back ordering in the store site until they have actually shipped to me.

  4. #54

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    On the subject of pegs, In my experience most model shops sell lengths of clear plastic rod in various diameters.
    All you would have to do is by a couple, cut them to fit, drill out the ends, then glue in a bit wire or a cut down paperclip in one end to make the pegs.
    Or if you must have clear pegs just use some thinner diameter rod.
    One rod would probably do to make enough for three or four models and some of larger diameter might be useful for making special wider heavy duty pegs for models like the Skytrex Staaken or Gotha.
    Last edited by Rabbit 3; 04-07-2011 at 03:20.

  5. #55

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    You know.
    It wouldnt be all that hard to produce paper/card versions of the dials for use with the standard WoW aircraft stands that fit over the pegs.
    They could even be customised for individual types.
    Quote Originally Posted by Col. Hajj View Post
    You might find it hard to move the dials around when you need to adjust them with out bumping the base around too much.
    Some experimentation with bits of card suggest that, provided the holes in the needle cards are large enough to allow a bit of play and the card is strong enough to take a bit of punishment then there is not all that great a problem.
    Laminating the things before cutting them out might help as well!
    I think I just might be on to something here, I`m thinking now more along the lines of creating dials based on original altimeters rather than just copy the dials on the aeroplane stands.
    They should still be compatable though.
    Just to give you a basic idea I`m thinking of basing them on these real instruments. Attachment 11290Attachment 11291
    Last edited by Rabbit 3; 04-09-2011 at 11:49.

  6. #56

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    Keith,

    What are the chances of adding just the altitude rings to your product line?

  7. #57

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    Those could be cool Robert.

    I have thought about releasing just the dials, but that would require the large altitude ring to also be a dial. The whole reason I got rid of my Litko bases and made my own was because of that very thing. It was always spinning around and never even stayed close to what you had put it on. I still might consider making them after all of my other products and projects are up on the site.

  8. #58

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    Quote Originally Posted by Col. Hajj View Post
    Those could be cool Robert.

    I have thought about releasing just the dials, but that would require the large altitude ring to also be a dial. The whole reason I got rid of my Litko bases and made my own was because of that very thing. It was always spinning around and never even stayed close to what you had put it on. I still might consider making them after all of my other products and projects are up on the site.
    An adhesive paper outside dial maybe? Or a Decal?
    Then you just have to make the two inner dials.
    Sneaky thought, If you printed the decal backwards for application to the underside of the base that would mean that it wouldn`t interfere so much with the info printed on the top of the WoW stand.

    (Further Update on the paper disc idea.) After some more intensive playtesting, I`ve concluded that the idea of multiple paper discs is just unworkable.
    I have found however that a single paper disc with the altitude levels marked round the side, placed under the `0` peg actually works reasonably well to show the base flight level.
    You just designate the number facing the forward marker as the reading, or use a felt tip or something to mark the zero point on the stand.

    It can be turned quite freely with the fingers or by rotating the peg above it without being too fiddly, a slightly larger diameter disk the same width as the base should be easier to read in the Mk2 version.

    (Further update)
    I`ve had one of those `Eureka` moments!
    If the main disc is mounted on the UNDERSIDE of the WoW base rather than on top then it can use the central bush as the main pivot.
    It no longer interferes in any way with the flight pegs, rotates reasonably freely, can be seen and read through the transparent base while allowing the writing on top to still be visible and tends to remain firmly in place.
    The only downside is that the base has to be lifted off the table in order to reset it!
    It looks like the Mk II will consist of a bigger disc mounted on the underside to record altitude and a smaller one on top to show altitude counters to give compatibility with the Aeroplane Accessories stands.
    Last edited by Rabbit 3; 04-30-2011 at 02:50.

  9. #59

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    I am out of flight pegs, yet have more stands and minis. Since pegs are not available, does anyone know what size Litko posts will fit in the flight stands?

    Thanks!

  10. #60

    Rabbit 3's Avatar Squadron Leader Scotland.
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    Quote Originally Posted by pstapleton53 View Post
    I am out of flight pegs, yet have more stands and minis. Since pegs are not available, does anyone know what size Litko posts will fit in the flight stands?

    Thanks!
    Unfortunately the answer to that is none of them since LITKO make them to a different diameter to the Nexus flight pegs.
    You could try using pieces of transparent plastic rod from Plastruct or others of the right diameter, cut to size then drill out the end so a flight peg will fit.
    Most model shops seem to have that sort of thing on sale quite cheaply.

  11. #61

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    Very nice stands,good quality.as far as loose pegs,I got tired of picking up a plane and having the base fall off, so I put a drop of clear silicone on the peg. it keeps it in place but you can remove it if you need to

  12. #62

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    This might sound like a retrograde step, but do you do any of the flight stands without the altimeter built in? I have an idea for altitude pegs, but I don't need the altimeter, and I don't want to hack at my OEM bases...

  13. #63

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    If you want bases that don't have a built-in dial, I think you could use the Litko bases and just drill them out to fit the WOW/WOG pegs?

  14. #64

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    Yeah, I saw them, and they are much cheaper (just over Ł1 each for a pack of 10!), but I like the etching on the AA versions better as the front line and back arrow look the same thickness as the ones on the cards, whereas the Litko ones are simply very fine scribed lines...

  15. #65

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    Agree, as I have some of the Litko's for the F-Toys planes, and they are not as nice as the original WOW stands, but the AA were not out at the time.

  16. #66

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    Quote Originally Posted by spin_doctor View Post
    the front line and back arrow look the same thickness as the ones on the cards, whereas the Litko ones are simply very fine scribed lines...
    One of the reasons I started making my own line of bases. How many of the custom bases do you need? In my next order I will be doing some other customs for a different member and could possibly fit yours on the same sheet.

  17. #67

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    I'd probably want half a dozen scout bases, a couple of 2 seater bases and say a gotha and a 0/400 base, so 10 in all, two of them large (despite the fact I've only got the 4 RDS minis so far ).

    But it would all depend on pricing and carriage to the UK. It might be more cost effective to just get something made up in the UK...

  18. #68

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    I like your bases Kieth, but it is the pegs that are the problem as we are constantly changing altitude in our games (part of the fun of the game) Right now I am reduce to buying excess Areas models just for the pegs alone! (However not all the planes are unused I put them on Likto flight stand and put them in the display cabinet).

  19. #69

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    Quote Originally Posted by Doug View Post
    I like your bases Kieth, but it is the pegs that are the problem as we are constantly changing altitude in our games (part of the fun of the game) Right now I am reduce to buying excess Areas models just for the pegs alone! (However not all the planes are unused I put them on Likto flight stand and put them in the display cabinet).
    Let me know if there's any you don't want any more...

  20. #70

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    Quote Originally Posted by spin_doctor View Post
    I'd probably want half a dozen scout bases, a couple of 2 seater bases and say a gotha and a 0/400 base, so 10 in all, two of them large (despite the fact I've only got the 4 RDS minis so far ).

    But it would all depend on pricing and carriage to the UK. It might be more cost effective to just get something made up in the UK...
    When I do custom bases with a normal order of mine, I can do them for the standard prices as listed on my site. It's when someone needs them right away that extra charges are incurred. So, you could add the normal bases to your shopping cart on the site and use the shipping quote function there to get what your total would be... all with out having to commit to anything.

    Quote Originally Posted by Doug View Post
    I like your bases Kieth, but it is the pegs that are the problem as we are constantly changing altitude in our games (part of the fun of the game) Right now I am reduce to buying excess Areas models just for the pegs alone! (However not all the planes are unused I put them on Likto flight stand and put them in the display cabinet).
    I'm working on the peg problem, it's just a long process.

  21. #71

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    Quote Originally Posted by spin_doctor View Post
    Let me know if there's any you don't want any more...
    Doug I have only WW2 aircraft but if you are still intrested I will post a list.

  22. #72

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    My mate got the WWII version at the same time so we could split delivery... I'll let him know!

  23. #73

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    I will sort them out tonight and post a list in the morning, remember it's just the plane and it's card.

  24. #74

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    Glad you guys are helping each other out. Alastair, please post them in the For Sale/Trade section or PM them to him to keep this thread on topic. Thanks!

  25. #75

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    Will do Heer Oberst

  26. #76

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    Hey Keith,

    Now that the altitude rules are changing (from level 0 to 16 to level 1 - 17) will the altitude dial be adjusted moving forwards?

    Cheers,
    Michael

  27. #77

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    Quote Originally Posted by celticgriffon View Post
    Hey Keith,

    Now that the altitude rules are changing (from level 0 to 16 to level 1 - 17) will the altitude dial be adjusted moving forwards?

    Cheers,
    Michael
    We still need level 0 for planes on the ground. With the regular bases you represent grounded aircraft by putting it on the base with no peg, but you can't take the last peg out of the dialed bases, so we'll need that 0.

  28. #78

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    I'm still deciding what to do about the move to 1-17. I already have a good amount of stock showing the 0-16, so nothing is going to happen any time soon. Fitting another number in the ring will make things a little tight and/or the numbers much smaller. The best option might be to leave things as they are. As mentioned, we do need level 0 for planes on the ground (because at level 1 you are flying) and there are only two planes that can even reach level 17. So, the likely hood of actually needing level 17 is pretty slim. In those rare cases, I think it would be easy to just move the dials to 0/0 to indicate it is at level 17 (everyone will know it's not actually at level 0).

    Thoughts??

  29. #79

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    Col. Hajj I would leave the bases as they are then. Both of your suggestions would be easy to implement. Actually I would be way more in favour of making the altitude bands smaller.

    In the burning Drachens booklet the top altitude of the lowest flying planes (i.e. the Halberstadt D.III, LEG Roland CII, and the Nieuport 11) is 10. The highest altitude of the highest flying planes (i.e. the Sopwith Snipe, Hanriot HDI, Spad XIII, Fokker DVII) is at level 14.

    Dropping every planes top altitude by even 5 spaces would likely give the same desired effects and increase the chances of "fighting/action" in most games. So if we were to do this the lowest altitude planes would have a ceiling of 5 and the highest a ceiling of 9. Same respective ratios and way more action imo. And less likely for the huge stacks of pegs to start swaying as well.

    Thoughts?

    Cheers,
    Michael

  30. #80

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    As I have invested in over 150 of the Oberst's bases to date, I would not welcome the change to a new system.
    How many of us actually fly aircraft at max altitude? I have never personally seen it done.
    Most gamers seem to fly within two or three levels. I have sometimes flown at five or six pegs, and eight for my Giant Bombers. Any higher than that and you spend all the game climbing to get into action, unless you start off higher and drop down onto your foe.
    I would be interested to hear from any pilots who find the upper limits of use, and the reasons that they use them.
    Rob.

  31. #81

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    Wow, have you ordered that many bases Rob? In the hundreds of games I've played, I've never seen anyone max out altitude. Typically is someone is trying to escape by climbing, it's done by the climb rate of the planes in question and not actual max altitude. If you have a faster climb rate, all you have to do is give above them and it's game over. If you have a slower climb rate, you should diving instead! lol

  32. #82

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    Quote Originally Posted by Oberst Hajj View Post
    Wow, have you ordered that many bases Rob? In the hundreds of games I've played, I've never seen anyone max out altitude. Typically is someone is trying to escape by climbing, it's done by the climb rate of the planes in question and not actual max altitude. If you have a faster climb rate, all you have to do is give above them and it's game over. If you have a slower climb rate, you should diving instead! lol
    Yes Guv.
    It actually suprised me when I thought about it. But I have a base for every one of my aircraft, plus bombers, and spare stock to do the re issues, the next series of fighters and the two seaters after that lot. So even if you do change the numbering system, I should be O.K. for a couple of years, except for any repaints, but I will address that problem with my next order.
    Got to keep the supply base in funds to help finance your new lines.
    Rob.

  33. #83

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    Quote Originally Posted by Oberst Hajj View Post
    I'm still deciding what to do about the move to 1-17. I already have a good amount of stock showing the 0-16, so nothing is going to happen any time soon. Fitting another number in the ring will make things a little tight and/or the numbers much smaller. The best option might be to leave things as they are. As mentioned, we do need level 0 for planes on the ground (because at level 1 you are flying) and there are only two planes that can even reach level 17. So, the likely hood of actually needing level 17 is pretty slim. In those rare cases, I think it would be easy to just move the dials to 0/0 to indicate it is at level 17 (everyone will know it's not actually at level 0).

    Thoughts??
    Stick with 16 Keith, on those very few occasions this may come into play I'm sure the players involved will cope!

    Cheers,

    Carl.

  34. #84

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    Any idea when the two seater stands might be back in stock - and the altitude pegs?

    BTW, I was thinking of making the very same suggestion as this one from a couple of years ago - ie sell the two dials and a decal/transparent sticker for 0-16 so that the stock bases could be modified to use this well designed altitude system. I like the stock bases as they have the basic plane info on them - actually, has anyone made themselves transparent labels with aircraft info to stick on the AA (or Litko) bases?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rabbit 3 View Post
    An adhesive paper outside dial maybe? Or a Decal?
    Then you just have to make the two inner dials.
    Sneaky thought, If you printed the decal backwards for application to the underside of the base that would mean that it wouldn`t interfere so much with the info printed on the top of the WoW stand.

  35. #85

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    I was thinking of the film Top Gun, when they are at Mirramar (spelling probably wrong) for each flight they have a top ceiling and lower hard deck. I agree that most combats would take place within about 1-2000' of each other. Some planes took a short time to get to an optimum height but to get to their actual ceiling would take another 30-40 minutes. So the system as stands is good for that, however if the larger dial decal was made in 50m increments (I know this would be 20 steps) then the smaller could be used for 1,000's of metres instead of feet. That would cover the min/max height in metres and an increment step of 50m per climb. This would also give you an accurate rate of climb and dive. It is going to be hard to convert a game in its second life by a radical change in bases design. That said I have all my planes with their original bases, I have converted 10 litko bases with litko altitude discs as I rarely have more than 10 planes on the table at once.
    From a club point of view you then need to convince your club members to adopt the same system, then their is the problem of inter-club, show tournaments etc. The changes would be drastically radical to an already established game. I would say, leave as is and come up with a workable dive rate to compliment the climb rate for the WoG/WoW bases and altitude discs already available.

  36. #86

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    Quote Originally Posted by NZgunner View Post
    Any idea when the two seater stands might be back in stock - and the altitude pegs?

    BTW, I was thinking of making the very same suggestion as this one from a couple of years ago - ie sell the two dials and a decal/transparent sticker for 0-16 so that the stock bases could be modified to use this well designed altitude system. I like the stock bases as they have the basic plane info on them - actually, has anyone made themselves transparent labels with aircraft info to stick on the AA (or Litko) bases?
    I have fitted all my existing bases under the Oberst's ones. This not only gives the information panel but a much heavier more stable base for the aircraft, especially when using more pegs for added height to atack bombers.
    I also use the Oberst's bases for non official planes, and print out the info on OHP. sheets which I sandwich between the Oberst's stand and a 4mm piece of acrylic. You can see some of these in the files section, although they may not all be correct, as they were done long before th stats committee was formed. I must update them and add some new ones when I get the time.
    Hope this helps. For examples look at the pictures in any of my AARs.
    Rob.

  37. #87

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    Quote Originally Posted by Flying Officer Kyte View Post
    I have fitted all my existing bases under the Oberst's ones. This not only gives the information panel but a much heavier more stable base for the aircraft, especially when using more pegs for added height to atack bombers.
    I also use the Oberst's bases for non official planes, and print out the info on OHP. sheets which I sandwich between the Oberst's stand and a 4mm piece of acrylic. You can see some of these in the files section, although they may not all be correct, as they were done long before th stats committee was formed. I must update them and add some new ones when I get the time.
    Hope this helps. For examples look at the pictures in any of my AARs.
    Rob.
    Thanks Rob, I hadn't thought of that, and the pictures in your AARs are making me green with envy - you must've spent a small fortune on this game!!!

  38. #88

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    The two-seater stands should be back instock next week. The pegs are currently out of print and I don't now when or if I'll be getting any more.

  39. #89

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    Any information on when you will be ready to embark upon WW2 Special orders for bases yet Herr Oberst?
    Rob.
    "Courage is the art of being the only one who knows you're scared to death."

  40. #90

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    Soon, very soon. With a easy to use web based tool for you guys to submit the layouts.

  41. #91

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    Thank you sir.
    Rob.
    "Courage is the art of being the only one who knows you're scared to death."

  42. #92

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    Just a post to thank Aerodrome for my bases and solo template that just arrived, excellent kit. (Small confession, when they arrived, I took them out of the package and thought....what? They're made of wood!!!!!! Until I took the protective covering off....... Oh well no wonder I'm only allowed a plastic knife and fork!)
    Thanks again

  43. #93

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    Glad they made the transatlantic flight safely Nigel. And don't worry about the confusion on the paper mask on them, you are not the first!

  44. #94

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dowters View Post
    Just a post to thank Aerodrome for my bases and solo template that just arrived, excellent kit. (Small confession, when they arrived, I took them out of the package and thought....what? They're made of wood!!!!!! Until I took the protective covering off....... Oh well no wonder I'm only allowed a plastic knife and fork!)
    Thanks again
    What, they let you have a plastic knife and fork? They only gave me a wooden spoon.

  45. #95

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    I just received my first order if these bases recently. I have found that the altitude and climb counter dials spin too freely on the peg and are easily jarred out of position. Does anyone else have this problem? If so, what are some solutions? I would like to get more of these but not if this isn't solved. Thanks!

  46. #96

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    Quote Originally Posted by Roland19 View Post
    I just received my first order if these bases recently. I have found that the altitude and climb counter dials spin too freely on the peg and are easily jarred out of position. Does anyone else have this problem? If so, what are some solutions? I would like to get more of these but not if this isn't solved. Thanks!
    Hi Joe,

    Do you have the peg pushed all the way up in the base? If not, the taper to the peg will make them spin to easily. I actually have the opposite problem most of the time, to hard to spin them. But with the pegs not being 100% the same from peg to peg and it depending how far the peg is pushed up into the base, it's almost impossible to get them exactly right when I make them.

  47. #97

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    Quote Originally Posted by Roland19 View Post
    I just received my first order if these bases recently. I have found that the altitude and climb counter dials spin too freely on the peg and are easily jarred out of position. Does anyone else have this problem? If so, what are some solutions? I would like to get more of these but not if this isn't solved. Thanks!
    you could get a small o ring to hold the indicator needle down to create some more resistence

  48. #98

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    Keith - Thanks I will check them and give that a try. I really like the bases and they make the altitude rules a bit easier to track! Thanks again.

  49. #99

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    Quote Originally Posted by milcoll73 View Post
    you could get a small o ring to hold the indicator needle down to create some more resistence
    Thanks Phillip - that's a good idea if fiddling with the pegs doesn't do it!

  50. #100

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    Quote Originally Posted by Roland19 View Post
    I just received my first order if these bases recently. I have found that the altitude and climb counter dials spin too freely on the peg and are easily jarred out of position. Does anyone else have this problem? If so, what are some solutions? I would like to get more of these but not if this isn't solved. Thanks!
    I used a tiny dab of the altitude glue inside the black climb counter dial and that works pretty well. I'll have to try pushing the peg into the base a little further as that solution would be better.

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