A&A ANGEL 20 - New WWII air combat mini game on the market.
Kind of competitive game.
A new game of aerial fights has just hit the market. I saw it today and have ordered a copy of the starter set to check it out.
Comments on BGG are quite enthusiastic.
http://www.boardgamegeek.com/boardga...ures-angels-20
I wonder if anyone of you have tested it already?
Last edited by Nightbomber; 03-12-2012 at 10:29.
"We do not stop playing when we get old, but we get old when we stop playing."
Ask Hunter, Andrzej.
He bought a starter set Angel 20 at a convention.
Voilą le soleil d'Austerlitz!
I have 2 starter sets and one booster case for a total of 36 planes. The models are very nice. I haven't played but looking over the rules I much prefer Wings. Wings is simple and easy to play. The other is a bit more complicated, firing angles, armor, dice rolls etc. If you have played either of their other games (War @ Sea and the ground minis) then you are use to these rules. I would say the models a equal but for me as I said the Wings rules and play are better. Just my view.
This will give you an idea of the planes. A Wings Hurricane and an Angles Hurricane.
A BIG difference in size indeed. THX for posting
"We do not stop playing when we get old, but we get old when we stop playing."
I think you'll find the Angels 20 models are 1/100 scale.
I haven't tested this, and won't be even though it sounds like they would be perfect scale for Flames of War (15mm), since that game decided to bring out their planes in 1/144th even though the armour and infantry are all 15mm. My concern with Angels is the whole Hasbro attitude, as they ruined Axis & Allies by issuing out of scale models (the monster Hellcat of the first issue), disasters like the "Messerspitz" (where they used the same model painted in British and German schemes!) and the "rare" models that one has to purchase multiple packs to get a specific plane. I prefer the WOG approach where one can buy the plane that is wanted without any question, and the great customer service that this game has had in the past and will hopefully continue. I'm sure theat Angels will be fun for a while, but I sure regretted my investment in Axis & Allies when I finally gave up after the 4th or 5th installment with new, and unrealistic, "properties" for the pieces.
Spitfire.Originally Posted by BobP
Voilą le soleil d'Austerlitz!
I saw them down at CincyCon and talked to some of the guys that got it and they said that the planes are too big for the maps that come with the game. and that you need a large area to play the game due to the size of the planes. Right now with Wings of Glory WW2 you need a larger area than the WW1 version. Just because of the turning radius. Can't imagine that with those larger planes. I guess I will stick with WGS for now. Maybe with two maps you can play the game easier.
Thomas
Yep, I saw them last night at The Family Game Store, along with the new Ares planes, and I have to admit to my eye the Ares planes are 1000 times nicer.
I bought a starter and a couple of boosters for my 10 year old son. With the hard plastic 1/100 scale aircraft he can play the game then just play with them as toys without antennae or props breaking off. It is not a bad game, but not as engaging as WGS.
Does it work on the map that comes with it or could you use a larger one?
Yes the maps don't seem to be big enough to have a good battle. The base is 2 1/2 ". The maps are 30" X 20" so two together are 30 X 40.and since you move by hex not very large. The are designed to be used with the A&A minis. I do thing they would be good with Flames as they are the same scale (15mm). As I said before the models are good but I much prefer Wings for playability.
Map
Here is what a part of the map looks like. I do like the maps.
Here is another section of a Angles map. As I said I do like the maps.
Thanks for the info.
What are the hexes 3 inches?
Here is another section of a Angles map. As I said I do like the maps.
Thomas
The hexes are bigger, 5 inches (125mm) across, point to point. If you can ignore the hexes the maps are a good size for a decent WGS Battle of Britain stoush.
Cheers,
Carl.
Yes as I said good maps.
Good point! I see they are like misty... from hights.
"We do not stop playing when we get old, but we get old when we stop playing."
Sorry guys. Don't know why no one called me on the photo. Must have had to many drinks. As all can see those models are Spitfires. How could i make such a dumb mistake?
Well, elsewhere there's a discussion of how easy, or hard, it is for someone like Saburo Sakai to mis-ID Grumman Avengers.... :)
Bob I was being polite. I figured you would see it and edit your post.
My game arrived today. I have no idea what it's playability is, but - looks promising. The 6 models in the box are impressive, I must admit. Their size, durability and painting make one wanting to play. The mechanics of manouvers is completely different from WoG (more complicated and luck dependant), I think- a very much dice dependent which is strange at first glance. But a value for money is far beyond standard. And the funny thing is - it's a complete game. Even without any boosters, BoB scenarios may be played with many configurations. There is one unique model inside: Bf 110 and one which is much more precious for me: A Hurricane from 303rd Polish squadron with a nice info stat card included.
"We do not stop playing when we get old, but we get old when we stop playing."
What about the map of the starter pack?
Big enough for a WW II playmat?
Voilą le soleil d'Austerlitz!
"We do not stop playing when we get old, but we get old when we stop playing."
I bought a starter and two boosters, and now I'm having buyers remorse.
I haven't played the game yet, so these are merely first impressions:
- The models are so-so. I find WGS models to be far higher quality. I realize that leaving the propeller off lowers production costs, but the planes look wrong to me without them or a prop disc.
- Energy tactics are modeled well.
- Not enough room to play this game - the maps are too small/models too big.
- I know! It's a game, and it's supposed to be fun, but I would like to see a game capable of modeling more than a small aerial skirmish without taking the better part of a week.
I will post again after I've played the game a few times, but my initial reaction after opening the Angels 20 box and reading the rules was to go buy all the WoW2 and WGS minis I could find.
Good, bad or indifferent, I was saddened to hear that the designer for this game was "let go" by Wizards of the Coast/Hasbro/Avalon Hill just before Christmas.
Thanks for not being critical of my dumb mistake. With kind of error I might have shot my wingman down.
Brad I agree with you about the props. I saw a few things about props on a thread. I guess you could use some round clear plastic to look like the prop is spinning.
Size (cm)?
Maybe I buy a starterset for the maps...
Voilą le soleil d'Austerlitz!
I'm funny about props, I guess. The other thing that sort of started me off on the wrong foot with Angels 20 is that there is only one Spitfire, and it is cast wrong - the sliding canopy is actually smaller than the windscreen in front or the rear non-sliding canopy. Seems like a rookie mistake to me, and Axis&Allies should be over this by now, with all the mini's practice they've already had.
I'll admit that the thought has occurred to me to play Angels 20 with gimbal-mounted WGS airplanes...I'd have to find new bases and a map, though.
Brad I had an idea of how to use these with the Wings cards. I guess you could enlarge the manouver cards and adapt them somehow.
2 maps, 50*75 cm each.Size (cm)?
Maybe I buy a starterset for the maps...
"We do not stop playing when we get old, but we get old when we stop playing."
Got my second booster and have all but one plane (lend least Tomahawk).
I'm on the fence with this one....could someone give me a push either way.
Chris I perfer Wings. Much simplier play. I posted once before that there are a number of actions for Angles and dice rolls. I like the models and maps but Wings is a 1-2-3 deal.
I don't have any DOW/WGS as I feel the mechanics are better suited to WWI. From what I've seen/read the drawbacks to angels 20 are:
1) Randomized booster packs....there are sellers on ebay offering the planes individually so you can get just the planes you want. (A 150 investment will get you everything from online retailers with free shipping.)
2) Gaming area too small...individual maps can be had via ebay as well but I don't know if this interferes with the rules.
3) Scenarios from starter set limited to Battle of Britian ?....I don't know if there are others availiable.
4) Is the game suitable for solitare ?
5) More cumbersome mechanics...don't know if this is a dealbreaker for me.
Still on the fence...considering a purchase of the starter set to give it a whirl. Would still welcome additional comments. Thanks
The game IS more complicated than WGF/WGS, but it has an interesting way of modelling energy tactics. I agree that the playing area is too small and the airplanes (as nice as they are) are too big. It is strange to me that the starter has ALL the airplane cards for the whole release, but the boosters don't have ANY airplane cards at all. I don't like how the planes are described on the cards. For example:
Expeditionary C.200 Saetta
Veteran
I would rather see something like:
Macchi C.200 Saetta
364a Squadriglia, 150o Gruppo Autonomo
1942
Pilot quality should be independent of the aircraft used.
I am still trying to figure out if this game could be played with DOW/WGS minis on gimbal mounts.
Forgot to ask about the map quality. What is it made from ? I see creases in some of the pix.
I guess it is just made of glossy paper.
Daniel you are correct it is a glossy paper. Don't know how durable it would be after long periods of play (folding and unfolding). I guuss you could mount it on foam board and put those together. I also have to agree with Chris about the cumbersome mechanics. Angles 20 is about the same as their other games ( I have all 6 sets of the War @ Sea game). I much prefer the ease of Wings.
Because my 10 year old son will mostly be playing Angels 20 with friends I have laminated the aircraft cards as well as the maps.
I am used to the gameplay as I too have all the Axis and Allies miniatures game and War At Sea products. It is a 'you-go, I-go' game, which in some ways plays more quickly than WGS, but as Brad indicated the aircraft cards have special abilities (SA) that provide 'flavour' the playing pieces. The SA's can be both positive and negative, with some portraying the characteristics of the aircraft and some the tactics used by the pilots that flew them.
Their are two Hurricanes for example, the Battle of France average pilot verison has 'Steady Shooter - When attacking enemy targets, if this aircraft attempted no difficult maneuvers this game turn it rolls one extra attack die.' The SA simulates the characteristic of the Hurricane that it was a steady gun platform.
The veteran pilot Battle of Britain version Hurricane, called the 'Kosciuszko Hurricane' has the SA 'Point Blank - This aircraft can make a range 0 attacks using its range 1 attack value. Determine the target aspect as if this aircraft were in the last hex it occupied before moving into its current hex.' This simulates the tendency of the Polish 303 Squadron pilots to engage the enemy at extremely close range as opposed to RAF training which taught pilots to engage between 200-400 yards.
Angels 20 and WGS are both WW2 air combat games but that is where the similarities end. In my opinion WGS is the superior system, with Angels more a beer and pretzels game.
Carl with the beer part I don't think I could play Angles 20 but then that depends on the amout of beer I consume.
I'm leaning toward taking the plunge...again !!! I know if I buy the starter set I will end up buying the boosters. Must resist, must resist, must resist....
Funny...they look like Spitfires.
This will give you an idea of the planes. A Wings Hurricane and an Angles Hurricane.Sorry, couldn't resist. Haven't played it yet but the planes are not as nice as the ARES I have received.
Last edited by Hunter; 03-21-2012 at 03:50.
Yes Hunter I deserve that. I must have had a few pints to make that mistake.
Chirs as the BORG said RESISTANCE IS FUTILE. I bought 2 starters and 2 boosters. Still missing the Lend Lease Tomahawk. Have to buy a single as I don't think I need another 24 planes but then you never know.
Ok ammends for the Spitefire. So here are the Hurricanes.
Front view.
I'm getting closer....but I'm a little sidetracked tonight as I'm working on a deal to fill up Willi's Wunderhaus.
Bob,
Was that a picture from a recent "what if" game? That looks like a giant German wabbit sneeking up on the Hurricanes!
"Watch out for dat nasty wabbit in the sun!"
James
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