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Thread: Balancing A vs B damage cards

  1. #1

    Default Balancing A vs B damage cards

    In our upcoming game tomorrow night one plane is a B firing one and I was wondering ..... If one of your planes gives A damage and the opponent gives B, what do you do:_

    1. Make them both A or B
    2. Beef up the B plane with Ace skill cards.
    3. Remove a heap of the zero cards from the B deck.

    Wotcha think guys?

  2. #2

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    You have not said what the planes involved are, Gary. It may be that at some point in their history, some of the B firing planes were experimentally fitted with an extra gun. Making both planes A damage is the simplest solution. I have played in games where this solution has been used. However, if the pilot of the B damage plane is a more experienced player, then option B might be interesting to try.

  3. #3

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    Sorry

    The planes are:-

    Hanriot HD1 firing B gun
    Spad XIII A guns
    Albatros D.III A guns

    The scenario is play 3 balloons and the first plane to down a balloon gets a medal and is the winner.

  4. #4

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    Depends on if you're using incendiary ammo and how many decks you use in game play. A single A deck has one fire card, B deck has two. Most people play with double A deck (70 cards) so will have two fire cards. If using incendiary ammo the single A deck will also benefit from having a couple of 5 damage cards amongst its number as each of those will also cause a fire on a balloon.
    Historically the HD.1 could have twin guns, or, you could just claim the 11mm Vickers rates an A deck, so that might be an easier option.

    "He is wise who watches"

  5. #5

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    Source: Point System for Wings of Glory

    Hanriot (Single Gun, B Deck): 67 Points
    Hanriot (Dual Guns, A Deck): 87 Points

    Albatros D.III: 79 Points

    SPAD XIII: 85 Points

    Giving the Hanriot two guns will disadvantage the Albatros, but not help the Albatros against the SPAD XIII. It will equalize things between the Hanriot and the SPAD XIII.

    An Ace Skill worth 6 points would help the Albatros, but you could consider up to 20 points of skills on the single gunned Hanriot, or go with a dual gunned Hanriot, and still give an Ace skill to the Albatros.

    20 Points of skills could be: Bullet Checker (8 pts), Daredevil (6 pts), and Itchy Trigger Finger (6 pts). This plane would be dangerous to go against, even with dual guns.
    Mike
    "Flying is learning to throw yourself at the ground and miss" Douglas Adams
    "Wings of Glory won't skin your elbows and knees while practicing." OldGuy59

  6. #6

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    Thanks for your input guys. I am thinking an 11mm A upgrade for the Hanriot is the way to go. All planes are firing incendiaries and the object is to be the first to shoot down a balloon. Each balloon to have 2 defending machine guns. Each plane has a balloon target.

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by Baxter View Post
    In our upcoming game tomorrow night one plane is a B firing one and I was wondering ..... If one of your planes gives A damage and the opponent gives B, what do you do:_

    1. Make them both A or B
    2. Beef up the B plane with Ace skill cards.
    3. Remove a heap of the zero cards from the B deck.

    Wotcha think guys?
    In an adversarial game I wouldn't "beef up" anything - particularly with those planes.

    The Hanriot is both faster and more manoeuvrable than the Albatros D.III, so should beat it even with 'B' guns.

    The Spad XIII is MUCH faster, and has 2 extra hit points, than the Albatros D.III, and almost the same manoeuvrability, so should beat it easily.

    Yet more proof that the Points System doesn't work.



    If all three planes are each chasing a separate target balloon, the Much Faster SPAD will get there first, so will get shots in before the others.

    The Faster Hanriot will get there next, so will fire after the SPAD but before the Albatros, but once in range it's superior manoeuvrability should give it more consecutive shots than either of the others.

    The poor old Albatros will get there last, so will begin firing last, and will not get as many consecutive shots in as the Hanriot will.
    I laugh in the face of danger - then I hide until it goes away!

  8. #8

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    Hey its down to the pilots and how they fly their planes and the draw of the damage cards, Oh just like it was in 1914/18


    I'm learning to fly, but I ain't got wings
    Coming down is the hardest thing

  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by Flying Helmut View Post
    In an adversarial game I wouldn't "beef up" anything - particularly with those planes.

    The Hanriot is both faster and more manoeuvrable than the Albatros D.III, so should beat it even with 'B' guns.

    The Spad XIII is MUCH faster, and has 2 extra hit points, than the Albatros D.III, and almost the same manoeuvrability, so should beat it easily.

    Yet more proof that the Points System doesn't work.



    If all three planes are each chasing a separate target balloon, the Much Faster SPAD will get there first, so will get shots in before the others.

    The Faster Hanriot will get there next, so will fire after the SPAD but before the Albatros, but once in range it's superior manoeuvrability should give it more consecutive shots than either of the others.

    The poor old Albatros will get there last, so will begin firing last, and will not get as many consecutive shots in as the Hanriot will.
    OK.
    The Hanriot against a stationary target, using the F Maneuver deck, is a much better option.

    Both the Albatros D.III (J Maneuver deck) and the SPAD XIII (A Maneuver deck) are flying what I refer to as "Boom and Zoom" decks, which are severely limited in turn choices. The SPAD XIII has the widest turn circle in the game, IIRC. When attempting to hit something like a balloon, or ground target, doing Immelmann runs are pretty much the only way to get shots on the target in rapid succession.

    Just a quick look at the options:

    SPAD XIII:
    Name:  MATE-A1.jpg
Views: 177
Size:  39.1 KB

    Hanriot HD.1:
    Name:  MATE-F1.jpg
Views: 170
Size:  38.1 KB

    Albatros D.III:
    Name:  MATE-J1.jpg
Views: 159
Size:  34.6 KB

    PS: The Points System is, IMHO, a guideline, not the be-all end-all for the game. There is absolutely no accounting for the random damage draws in this game. The SPAD XIII is the one of the fastest and toughest planes in the game. Again, IMHO, it has the velocity and maneuverability of a bullet, and it is the worst plane in the game for dogfighting. A very subjective opinion, but if you start with the Duel Packs, the planes are not too badly matched for flying profiles. I'd much rather dogfight with the D.1 vs F.1 pack than the XIII vs D.III pack, though.

    In the planes above, I'd rather the Hanriot, even with the B Damage deck, too.
    Last edited by OldGuy59; 05-17-2021 at 12:26.
    Mike
    "Flying is learning to throw yourself at the ground and miss" Douglas Adams
    "Wings of Glory won't skin your elbows and knees while practicing." OldGuy59

  10. #10

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    You guys are mines of information! Thanks for all this quality information, it is very much appreciated.

  11. #11

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    You could fly the Albatros as an OFFAG 153 with a B maneuver deck. Would close the speed difference but not change it's maneuverability.

  12. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by Teaticket View Post
    You could fly the Albatros as an OFFAG 153 with a B maneuver deck. Would close the speed difference but not change it's maneuverability.
    Or fly the SPAD XIII as a SPAD VII, which will drop the guns to a 'B' firer, and slow the plane to a 'B' manoeuvre deck...
    It would now match speed and guns (but not manoeuvrability) with the Hanriot, and it would now have only a 1 hit point advantage.
    It would still be faster than the Albatros, and have 1 more hit point, but would lose out on 'B' guns vs 'A' guns.
    I laugh in the face of danger - then I hide until it goes away!

  13. #13

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    Balancing different encounters in this game has endless possibilities. I love it.

  14. #14

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    Two seaters (two B guns).
    Ace skills.
    Two gun options (E.g. Nieuport 17, Hd.1).
    Asymmetrical plane count (three Nieuport vs. two Albatros).
    Asymmetrical scenario requirements/set up/conditions.
    Advantaged plane crippled in some fashion from previous fight, bad mechanic, incompetent factory worker, balky machine gun. Disadvantaged plane helped by brilliant mechanic reinforcing wing (gains damage points), tunes engine, works miracle with spit and baling wire, flying ace goes out carousing while diligent mechanic polishes bullets. I mean, story-telling devices can balance anything!

  15. #15

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    Well the game was played and the Pfalz (not Albatros) won. The Spad was too fast to get multiple shots into the balloon and copped a lot of damage fron an AA gun as it tried.. The Hanriot went off the edge of the mat after setting his balloon on fire. The Pfalz managed to kill an AA gun early and ended up giving his balloon two explosion cards.

    I decided not to do an AAR as the table was too busy with 3 separate battles going on at the same time.

    Gold medal went to Wayne the Pfalz driver!

  16. #16

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    That was a real mixed bag - one down, one off and one won!

  17. #17

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    Sound like an underdog win

    "He is wise who watches"



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