I'm starting this thread for new plane stats pending the release of the V2 table. Please keep discussion to the point, and uncluttered.
Thank you.
New planes for the V2 list
I'm starting this thread for new plane stats pending the release of the V2 table. Please keep discussion to the point, and uncluttered.
Thank you.
It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus
Something for the French fliers:
Bloch MB.151/152:
D deck. Hits 16, ceiling 11, climb 5 Guns are A/B for the 151 or C-C-A/C for the 152.
Loire-Nieuport LN.401/411
Deck: ZJ( with divebombing cards added) Damage: 15 Ceiling: 11 Climb: 6 Guns: C-A/A
Amiot 143: Deck Q(Z)b. Damage 22. Ceiling: 9. Climb: 8.
Guns: Front turret: A/A 9 O'clock to 3 O'clock, low to high
Dorsal turret: A/A, 360 level to high with B.S. front and rear arcs
Front ventral: A/A 10 O'clock to 2 O'c clock, low
Rear ventral: A/A 4 O' clock to 8 O' clock low.
It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus
I am 'dartboarding' planes on Karl's list, and the next victim could be this:Originally Posted by Jager
Cause I have to do a Crew Management card, too...
PS: Hmmm...
This indicates the French Air Force had 6-man crews:
What up with that?
Last edited by OldGuy59; 11-12-2022 at 22:43.
Mike
"Flying is learning to throw yourself at the ground and miss" Douglas Adams
"Wings of Glory won't skin your elbows and knees while practicing." OldGuy59
By request, Ki-15-I and II Babs
Ki-15-I: K deck; 15 hits. Rear gun: A/A; Ceiling: 12; Climb 5
Ki-15-II: D deck; 15 hits. Rear gun: A/A; Ceiling : 9; Climb: 4
Navy versions:
C5M1: K deck; 15 hits. Rear gun: A/A; Ceiling: 9; Climb 5
C5M2: K deck; 15 hits. Rear gun: A/A; Ceiling: 11; Climb 4
Fighter base.
House Rules: 1,2,3
It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus
Nakajima Ki-44 Tojo Model Ia and Ib
Nakajima Ki-44-Ia: Deck E; Hits 18; Guns: B-A/A; Ceiling 13: climb: 3
Nakajima Ki-44-Ib: Deck E; Hits 18; Guns: B-B/B; Ceiling 13: climb: 3
It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus
End of the war nightfighter:
Junkers Ju.88G-7
V deck; Guns: C-C-C-C / C-C
Damage 28; ceiling 10; climb: 7; Bomber base.
It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus
Blackburn Skua:
Deck: XA (add divebombing cards) [This is the He-111's deck]
Hits: 17
Ceiling: 7
Climb: 6
Guns: B/A // A/A (standard rear firing arc)
Base: Fighter
It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus
Do you think that the Skua should be given tighter turns than a Heinkel III and perhaps even an Immelmann turn (maybe restricting it to when it is not carrying bombs)?
Yes, probably. It's tough being restricted to the decks we have, sometimes.
That said, the alternative is to create brand new decks, which violates my sense of right.
Let me think an this tomorrow; I'm fried from work right now.
Karl
It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus
OK guys. I have to make a serious apology.
While trying to make a turn card for the XA deck, my measurements were mathematically correct from my tables, but it looks too small. So I
got out a He.111 for the cards. Either my scientific ruler is way off, or I have more bad data.
I fixed the tables for the XA and XB decks, but now the Skua is too slow for the XA deck
(Getting really mad at myself now).
The "good" news is that we can use the Z(T) deck (arrow only movement) with only adding divebomb cards.
Karl
It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus
Karl,
A few other Japanese planes that would be cool to see stats for should you have the time;
Ki-36 Ida
Ki-51 Sonia
C6N Myrt as a standard recon aircraft. I’m not sure if it would change if you just took the guns out
Ki-46 Dinah
I know none of them are very exciting planes, but I plane to produce models and fly them all someday. I think these would wrap up everything I would ever think of putting into a game.
Thanks!
I like the idea of the Ki-51 and Ki-46.
OK: The Ki-46 was already done:
https://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/sh...5-Toryu-(Nick)
Tachikawa KI-36 (Ida): Deck = ZM* (no 90 degree turns); Hits: 14; Ceiling 9; Climb 6; Guns: A/A - A/A
Ki-51 Sonia: Deck: I*: (no second dive card or dive bomb cards; will need to add the 30 degree turn cards from my files)
Hits: 16; Ceiling: 9; Climb: 6;
Guns: A/A (late war B/A) - A/A
C6N Myrt: Deck: Q*+: no extreme side slips; ad a second set os side slip cards.
Hits: 18; Ceiling: 12; Climb: 4; Guns: - A/A or C-C/C SM (Very rare; used as a night fighter.).
Note: crew of 3, but no ability to change seats, so the navigator/observer is a free crew hit
It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus
Thanks Karl!OK: The Ki-46 was already done:
https://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/sh...5-Toryu-(Nick)
Tachikawa KI-36 (Ida): Deck = ZM* (no 90 degree turns); Hits: 14; Ceiling 9; Climb 6; Guns: A/A - A/A
Ki-51 Sonia: Deck: I*: (no second dive card or dive bomb cards; will need to add the 30 degree turn cards from my files)
Hits: 16; Ceiling: 9; Climb: 6;
Guns: A/A (late war B/A) - A/A
C6N Myrt: Deck: Q*+: no extreme side slips; ad a second set os side slip cards.
Hits: 18; Ceiling: 12; Climb: 4; Guns: - A/A or C-C/C SM (Very rare; used as a night fighter.).
Note: crew of 3, but no ability to change seats, so the navigator/observer is a free crew hit
Thank you so much Karl!!
Vickers Vildebeest
Deck: D(Zb); hits: 16; ceiling: 7; climb: 9; guns: A/A - A/A:
(note: forward gun should only fire up the 12 O'Clock line, due to the lack of maneuverability of this plane like most bombers.)
HF base; House rule: 1, 2, 3
It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus
Excellent Karl, thank you! I’ll have some cards posted in the Painting Showcase on a few weeks.
Here are some additional Stuka variants:
Junkers Ju 87D-3
Deck: I
Guns (Front): A/A
Guns (Rear): A/A
Damage: 19
Ceiling: 8
Climb: 6
Base: Fighter
Junkers Ju 87D-5
Deck: I
Guns (Front): C/A
Guns (Rear): A/A
Damage: 19
Ceiling: 8
Climb: 6
Base: Fighter
Junkers Ju 87G-2
Deck: I
Guns (Front): D-D/D
Guns (Rear): A/A
Damage: 19
Ceiling: 8
Climb: 6
Base: Fighter
House Rules: 8
Notes: 3
(house rules and notes based on the supplementary notes document)
Let me know if any of this seems somewhat off
Last edited by RobotSpark; 04-07-2021 at 19:37. Reason: Forgot to change the damage value of the G-2
I did have some questions relating to my custom stukas that I hope some of the more experienced players here can help me out on:
- The Ju 87B series had one 7.92mm MG-15 for a rear armament, but the Ju 87D and G series had a double-barreled 7.92mm MG 81Z for the rear gunner - would this increase the in-game armament at all?
- Is the front armament value for the D-5 (C/A) consistent with other German planes for a plane with two 20mm MG 151/20 cannons?
Two 'A' guns perform exactly the same as one in WGS, so the twin mount MG81 gains no advantage.
I would have guessed at CC/C for the front guns - perhaps the Stuka's lack of speed and manoeuvrability adversely affect this?
Karl will be the chap to know the answer.
I laugh in the face of danger - then I hide until it goes away!
I hadn't looked at the D models yet: stats look ok at a glance. The D-5 swapping out the wing-mounted MGs for 20mm would be a C-C/C.
Given that this was for ground support, and the pilots had little training in air-to-air shooting, I would use my house rule for medium/heavy bombers with fixed frontal guns:
they are only allowed to fire up the 12 O'clock line. Gives you a chance, but notes that you are not dogfighting.
The G-1 and G-2 were pretty much the same plane. The I deck is too fast, so I have to look at it sometime soon.
Note that the 37mm guns are slow firing, and only meant for ground attack. I have read of no instance of them hitting a flying airplane.
The MG-87Z is an interesting piece. I had not read about it before. officially, twin 7.62mm would still be an A/A. However, given the RoF, I would rate the B/A as a house rule.
Get back to you on the G models soon.
Karl
It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus
I don't know why I didn't reply sooner, but the G-2 gets the "house rule" that applies to all "tank buster" aircraft with gunpods in that it can only perform slow manoeuvres, so it shouldn't be too fast in that case
True; but having a deck you can do both fast (sort of) and slow maneuvers is best.
Sorry, life has gotten odd, in a not fun way. I'll probably spend some of the coming holiday weekend (only 2 days for me; got to love life in retail) looking at the back.log.
Karl
It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus
Junkers Ju.87G: Deck: T(Z): Guns: D/ and A/A Damage: 18; Ceiling: 6; Climb: 8.
Note: the gun pods can be jettisoned; the stats then revert to those of the Ju.87D (no forward MGs though). And again, these D guns are for AT only; no pot-shooting at the LaGGs
Note 2: no divebombing cards with this deck; dive brakes and bomb racks were removed.
It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus
I'm not entirely sure this was possible - dropping a pair of what were essentially anti-tank guns seems very costly.
Also, on an unrelated note, unless I'm mistaken I can't find any rules for the Typhoon or Tempest anywhere.
Do.335A-1: Deck: T(130%); Guns: C-C-D/C-C; Damage: 27; Ceiling: 13; Climb: 4 Fighter Base
Do.335A-6: Deck: T; Guns: C-C-D/C-C; Damage: 27; Ceiling: 13; Climb: 4 Fighter Base
Do.335B-2: Deck: T(125%); Guns: C-C-D-D-D/D-C-C; Damage: 27; Ceiling: 13; Climb: 4 Fighter Base
Ta.152H-1: Deck: R(125%); Guns: C-C-D / C-C; Damage: 20; Ceiling: 16; Climb: 1
Ta.152C-1; Deck: R(125%); Guns: C-C-C-C-D / C-C-C; Damage: 20; Ceiling: 13; Climb: 3
It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus
Nakajima B6N Tenzan (Jill) (the N1 and N2 come out the same):
Deck: K(7); Damage: 18; Ceiling: 10; Climb: 6; Guns: na / A/A plus A/A ventral gun (rear arc lower only); Fighter base.
Note: I'm using the new system for deck modifying: the (7) indicates that the K deck will only use it's regular set of SSs (deleting the fast-only set), as well as making them not-difficult.
New deck modifying system: https://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/sh...430#post557430
Karl
It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus
Karl,
What would the gunnery be for the Bristol Blenheim MKI-F version with the 4 extra forward firing machine guns?
While I am at making cards for them, would you mind converting the plane to the new system? I am doing MKI's and I-F's.
Thank you!
Let me check Sunday; my time off for the holiday won't be until the 10th.
Karl
It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus
OK, I already re-did these. The only change is to the maneuver deck, and that goes to a XF deck (Ju.88 A-4).
Note that these planes are due for the next release, and the deck for them is likely to be somewhat different, but the XF deck will get you there until then.
The Mk-IVF changes the forward guns to B/A.
Karl
It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus
If a Hurricane Mk I is a BB/B with 8 .303s, would adding 4x .303s to a Blenheim Mk.I (A/A) make it a BBA/A?
The Blenheim bomber has a single 303 in the left wing. Adding the gunpod adds 4 303s and removes the ventral turret, so techniquely it would be BA/A, but since the A is defined as 2 303s,
I prefer to leave it as B/A. Lord knows if the wing gun is harmonized with the gunpod, though I really doubt it, which makes this even more sense.
Karl
It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus
Thank you Karl!
I wonder what year the next release will happen in?
It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus
Has anyone ever done a set of stats for the F1M Pete? I've got one painted up and am starting on the card art.
Thanks!
I don't think so........let me check the files next week (just got home from Dayton).
Karl
It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus
I couldn't locate any game stats for Nakajima A6M2-N (Rufe), or Aichi Ryusei B7A2 (Grace).
The latest bunch:
XP-67 Moonbat: Deck: T(hf)(8); guns: 6xD/3xD*; Damage: 28; Ceiling: 12; Climb: 4; HF base
*Note: given the great dislike of US pilots with the M4 37mm cannon, I suspect
if the bugs were worked out, it would end up with 20mm cannon, so 6xC/3xC.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Nakajima B6N2 Tenzan (Jill): Deck K(7); guns: A/A rear arc plus A/A rear arc, lower only (no blindspot).
Damage: 18 (note: no self-sealing gas tanks, so HR2 can be used (also HR3)
Ceiling: 10; Climb: 6 Fighter base (just inside the limit)
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Bloch MB200: Deck: H(zb)(8); Guns: Nose gun: A/A 10:00 to 2:00; Dorsal gun: A/A 360, level to high, with front and rear
blindspots (tail and engines; the front one might be more, check a vertical view); Vental gun: A/A 4:00 to 8:00 low only.
Damage: 20 (I assume no armor or self-sealing tanks, so HR1,2,3 can be used).
Ceiling: 9; Climb: 8
----------------------------------------------
Mitsubishi F1M Pete. Deck: P(z); Guns: A/A plus A/A rear arc. Damage: 14; Ceiling: 10; Climb: 6
Nakajima A6M2-N (Rufe): Deck: J; Guns: A-C-C/C Damage: 14; Ceiling: 11; Climb: 4 F Base; HR1,2,3
Aichi Ryusei B7A2 (Grace): DEck: W; Guns: C-C/C plus A/A rear arc; Damage: 20; Ceiling: 12; Climb: 5, F base; HR3
It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus
Beaufighters were released by 'Ares', so Unofficial stats are unnecessary - they already exist Officially
I laugh in the face of danger - then I hide until it goes away!
Ahh, rightio - but it might be worth including them in the list like other official aircraft for ease of reference.
A minor finding (for perfectionists).
The unofficial aircraft sheet lists the Curtiss Kittyhawk Mk.I as B-B/B. Now this is true only for the first 20 machines delivered to the British. The other 460 had already 6 x 0.5 caliber mgs.
Source: 'Squadron-Signal 8262 Detail & Scale 62 Curtiss P-40' page 10/11
Well, the KH Mk,I is an official (via the Fire in the sky box set, so card only IIRC) plane.
However, your research is shown in numerous on-line sources, so if a player wants to use B-B-B/B-A, have at it
Karl
It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus
Any chance to get stats for the Fiat RS.14 float plane?
This is going to be a very tough one. It's right in the speed that can't be fit with regular deck movement (it needs a bomber base, so only has 0.47cm
of arrow after the 8cm base), and too fast for arrow length only movement. Let me think on this.
Karl
It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus
Maybe arrow length only on a %-scaled up card?
Sorry, Fabrizio, for the delay, and thank you for your patience.
The best solution is, indeed, a scaled deck; note the XC deck is the B-17's:
Fiat RS.14 float plane:
Deck: XC(80%); Hits: 23; ceiling: 7; climb: 7 HR: 3
Guns: Dorsal turret: A/A, 306 high only; Waist guns: 3-5 O'Clock and 7-9 O'Clock high to low, A/A.
First models: some might have a front gun A/A front arc high to low. Some of the second batch replaced this with
2 nose guns, A/A 1-2 and 10-11 O'Clock high to low.
Gun manning is a question: wiki says 3 crew; a russian source says 4-5, which makes much more sense.
Front gun(s) is the observer/bombardier's job. The turret is probably the radioman's job. If their is a 5th
crewmember, he gets both waist guns. Otherwise, the RO does that. He better be fast on his feet!
It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus
Thanks Karl, no problem. Due to job issues the plane is anyway not able to fly (and to float) yet.
My docs also state that crew was 4-5. Could not find any reference for front guns, though. Must have been some seldom used option.
The 20 degree turn of XC seems a bit pessimistic compared to 30 degrees of Rzb for the CANT 506. Here is what I found in a publication (translated from italian)
...Yet the RS.14 has the merit of being far more manoeuvrable in combat than the massive three-engine aircraft: more than one pilot is saved by the ability to make sharp turns and sudden dives...
Well, the problem with this is that the Fiat RS.14 uses a bomber base (>19m wingspan), and no
bomber in the game has a 45 degree turn. Nor do any of the heavy fighters.
The wingloading and power to weight ratio is very close to the B-17, which was one reason I chose this deck.
This is, unfortunately, one of the factors of this game engine.
Karl
It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus
OK: a big release of Spanish Civil war planes.
Discussion and the link to the new table will be on it's own thread.
Karl
Bloch MB210: Deck: O(zb)(8); Hits: 24 ceiling: 11 climb: 7; B base.
Guns: Nose gun: A/A 10:00 to 2:00; Dorsal gun: A/A 360, level to high, with rear blindspots;
Vental gun: A/A 4:00 to 8:00 low only.
Bréguet 19A2: Deck: V(b); guns: A/A; A/A; Hits: 14; ceiling: 8; climb: 8; F base; HR: 2
Gourdou-Leseurre GL.32: Deck: B(z); Guns: A/A; Hits: 14; ceiling: 11; climb: 6; F base; HR; 2,3
Gourdou-Leseurre GL.432: DEck: V(z); Guns: A/A; Hits: 14; ceiling: 10; climb: 6; F base; HR: 2,3
Polikarpov R-5: Deck: V(z); Guns: A/A; A/A; Hits: 15; ceiling: 7; climb: 6; HF base; HR: 2
Polikarpov R-Z: DEck: Q(z)(7); Guns: A/A; A/A; Hits: 16; ceiling: 10; climb: 6; HF base; HR: 2
Potez 540: Deck: Q(zb); Hits: 20; ceiling: 11; climb: 7; HF base; Guns:
Nose gun: A/A 9:00 to 3:00; Dorsal gun: A/A 360, high only,
Vental gun: A/A 360, low only.
Avia BH-33: Deck: A(z); guns: A/A; Hits: 14; ceiling: 9; climb: 5; F base. HR: 2, 3 Note: deck should also have a 60 degree turn.
Dewoitine D.371: Deck: ZJ; Guns: A/A (or B/A); Hits: 14; ceiling: 12; climb: 3; F base; HR: 2,3.
Dewoitine D.510: Deck: ZJ; Guns: C-A/A; Hits: 15; ceiling: 12; climb: 3; F base; HR: 2
Dewoitine D.500: Deck: ZJ; Guns: B or A/A; Hits: 15; ceiling: 9; climb: 3; F base; HR: 2
Dewoitine D.27: Deck: Q(z)(1); Guns: A/A; Hits: 14; ceiling: 10; climb: 5; F base; HR: 2
Letov Š-231: Deck: ZM; Guns: A/A; Hits: 14; ceiling: 10; climb: 5; F base; HR: 2,3. Note: needs a 60 degree turn.
Loire 46: Deck: ZJ; Guns: B/A; Hits: 15; ceiling: 13; climb: 3; F base; HR: 2,3.
Nieuport-Delage NiD 52: Deck: D(z); Guns: A/A; Hits: 15; ceiling: 9; climb: 7; F base: HR: 2.
Dornier Do.17E/F: Q(zb)(8); Hits: 21; ceiling: 6/7; climb: 8 HF base;
Dorsal Gun: A/A, 5-7 o'clock, high only
Ventral Gun: A/A, 5-7 o'clock, low only.
Dornier Do.17M/P: XE(8); Hits: 21; ceiling: 8; climb: 8 HF base;
Front Gun: A/A, 11-2 o'clock level only
Dorsal Gun: A/A, 5-7 o'clock, high only
Ventral Gun: A/A, 5-7 o'clock, low only.
Polikarpov I-15: DEck: ZM; Guns: B/A; Hits: 14; ceiling: 11; climb: 4; F base; HR: 2,3
Tupolev SB SM-100: Deck: XE(50%); Hits: 22; ceiling: 9; climb: 9; HF base; HR: 1,2,3
Nose guns: forward arc, high to low, B/A
Dorsal gun: rear 180 degree arc, level to high, A/A
Ventral gun: rear arc, low only A/A
Note the same crewman uses the dorsal and ventral gun.
Heinkel He 111B: Deck: S(zb)(6); Hits: 25; ceiling: 8; climb: 7; B base;
Nose gun: front arc, level only;
Dorsal gun: rear arc, level to high w/ BS
Ventral gun: rear arc, low only.
Heinkel He 111E: Deck: XA; Hits: 26; ceiling: 8; climb: 7; B base.
Nose gun: front arc, level only;
Dorsal gun: rear arc, level to high w/ BS
Ventral gun: rear arc, low only.
Henschel Hs 126: Deck: ZL(-90); Guns: A/A and A/A; Hits: 16; ceiling: 10; climb: 5; F base; HR: 2, 3.
Junkers Ju 86 D: Deck: T(zb)(6); Hits: 22; ceiling: 7; climb: 8; B base; HR: 1,2,3
Nose turret: front arc. Dorsal gun: 3:00 to 9:00 level to high, no blindspot.
Ventral gun: 4:00 to 8:00 low. All are A/A.
Messerschmitt Bf 109A: Deck: K(1); Guns: A/A; Hits: 16; ceiling: 10; climb: 5; F base;
Messerschmitt Bf 109B: Deck: K(1); Guns: A/A; Hits: 16; ceiling: 10; climb: 5; F base;
Messerschmitt Bf 109C: Deck: K(1); Guns: B/A; Hits: 16; ceiling: 10; climb: 5; F base;
Messerschmitt Bf 109D: Deck: K(1); Guns: B/A; Hits: 16; ceiling: 11; climb: 5; F base;
Breda Ba.65: Deck: I(-db); Guns: B-A/A; Hits: 16; ceiling: 7; climb: 7; F base; HR: 2,3.
Cant Z-506: Deck: T(zb)(8): Hits: 28; ceiling: 8; climb: 8; B base; HR: 3
Dorsal turret, 360, level to high, with a front arc blind spot A/A
Ventral gun: rear arc, low, A/A
Waist guns (often not present): 3:00 to 5:00, and 7:00 to 9:00, level, A/A
Caproni Ca-310: Deck: T(zb)(8); Hits: 18; ceiling: 8; climb: 8; HF base; HR: 2,3
Fixed forward guns: A/A 12 o'clock line only;
Dorsal turret: 360 level to high w/ tail BS.
Caproni AP-1: Deck: ZJ; Guns: A/A and A/A; Hits: 15; ceiling: 9; climb: 6; F base; HR: 2,3.
IMAM Ro.37: Deck: ZM; Guns: A/A and A/A; Hits: 15; ceiling: 8; climb: 6; F base; HR: 2,3.
Heinkel He 112B-0: Deck: D; Guns: C-C-A/C; Hits: 15; ceiling: 10; climb: 4, F base.
Blériot-SPAD S.51: Deck: C(z); Guns: A/A; Hits: 14; ceiling: 9; climb: 6; F base; HR: 2,3
Last edited by Jager; 11-07-2022 at 12:12. Reason: sp again!
It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus
Just about to print the ZM deck for my IMAM 37 from the file section. Wondering if the slow arrow on the noncritical side-slip cards 17/18 was forgotten or a conscious decision?
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