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Thread: Raptors with multiple crew

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    Default Raptors with multiple crew

    Rules for scenario and campaign play state that raptors have multiple crew members. I wonder if that means their bonus to hit is stacked. Can Boomer and skulls crew the Raptor together? How do talents work with multiple crew?

  2. #2

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    I imagine it will be like the way the skills work in WGF and WGS. There are pilot skills and skills for other crew members. I do not think that two pilots with the same skill will be allowed to stack the results of that skill because only one of them is actually flying the ship at any one time but they may be able to use skills, which complement each other. I am thinking in terms of something like the pilot having a to hit bonus for some natural ability and the second crew member having a to hit bonus because he or she is good at using the electronics.
    Last edited by Naharaht; 04-24-2020 at 17:12.

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    Am I the only guy that read the last paragraph in the last page of the rulebook? lol

    What about injuries?

  4. #4

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    The last paragraph in the scenario book isn't that clear. I would think only 1 crewman gets to use their skill(s) per attack? They mention different crew combinations but nothing about who uses their skill when.
    The rulebook mentions nothing about crew, only pilots. For the two Raptor crew, I would think one pilots the Raptor and the other takes care of the other abilities like jamming....

    For injuries in a campaign I'd come up with a table to roll on, or maybe miss 1d6 missions per wound.

  5. #5

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    I wouldn't allow two crew members to stack their bonuses.

    It'd be like aiming a gun, and suddenly having someone else throw off my aim by adjusting it to their own perspective (think of 2 people both controlling a single computer cursor!)

    The chance to hit is already too high - if you watch the TV show, everyone blasts away for long streams of shots before ever achieving a hit, and the majority of shooting attempts miss entirely.

    I understand the need to make hits more likely, to maintain player interest and shorten games (the same is true for WGF and WGS) but a multiple crew Utility craft should never be as effective at shooting as a single-pilot dedicated "fighter".
    I laugh in the face of danger - then I hide until it goes away!

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by Flying Helmut View Post
    I wouldn't allow two crew members to stack their bonuses.

    It'd be like aiming a gun, and suddenly having someone else throw off my aim by adjusting it to their own perspective (think of 2 people both controlling a single computer cursor!)

    The chance to hit is already too high - if you watch the TV show, everyone blasts away for long streams of shots before ever achieving a hit, and the majority of shooting attempts miss entirely.

    I understand the need to make hits more likely, to maintain player interest and shorten games (the same is true for WGF and WGS) but a multiple crew Utility craft should never be as effective at shooting as a single-pilot dedicated "fighter".

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    Quote Originally Posted by Flying Helmut View Post
    I wouldn't allow two crew members to stack their bonuses.

    It'd be like aiming a gun, and suddenly having someone else throw off my aim by adjusting it to their own perspective (think of 2 people both controlling a single computer cursor!)

    The chance to hit is already too high - if you watch the TV show, everyone blasts away for long streams of shots before ever achieving a hit, and the majority of shooting attempts miss entirely.

    I understand the need to make hits more likely, to maintain player interest and shorten games (the same is true for WGF and WGS) but a multiple crew Utility craft should never be as effective at shooting as a single-pilot dedicated "fighter".
    I'm not so sure about that last part, the Viper hits on 6 and has +3 pilots where as the Raptor hits on 8 and only has +1 pilots at best. That gives vipers w/starbuck a hit on 3 where Boomers best shot would be on 7s. Stacking the to hit bonus would still be nowhere near Starbucks effectiveness in a Viper.

    Whether that's the right way to play or not I have no idea.

  8. #8

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    Avoiding the handful of "super Aces", a Generic Viper hits on a 6, a Generic Raptor on an 8.

    Adding "ordinary" +1 crew, the Raptor with "stacked" bonuses would hit on a 6, the the Viper on a 5; much too close for my liking!

    But, Hey, it's your game - play it how you like!
    I laugh in the face of danger - then I hide until it goes away!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Flying Helmut View Post
    Avoiding the handful of "super Aces", a Generic Viper hits on a 6, a Generic Raptor on an 8.

    Adding "ordinary" +1 crew, the Raptor with "stacked" bonuses would hit on a 6, the the Viper on a 5; much too close for my liking!

    But, Hey, it's your game - play it how you like!
    I hear you there, more non combat gameplay for the Raptor/Raider would be cool anyway.

    I just wish Ares would not have released half of the game with missing rules so we could play/look at them now ala Star Citizen.

  10. #10

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    Is there any chance of a ruling from Andrea on this topic?

  11. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by Naharaht View Post
    Is there any chance of a ruling from Andrea on this topic?
    Dunno - have you PM'd him?
    I laugh in the face of danger - then I hide until it goes away!

  12. #12

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    My nickel, as Canada doesn't mint pennies anymore, is that the Raptors shouldn't be armed, anyway. So, the 8+ to hit is useless (Combat Assault Raptor excepted).

    Look at the Battlestar Galactica TV series. The Raptor pilot flies the ship, the copilot helps fly the ship, or does the Electronic Operator thing (ECM, Scanning, etc...). No guns.

    In the Blood and Chrome series, there were gun-equipped Raptors, and the pilot flew the ship, with the second person manning the rear turret.

    Nowhere did two crew 'stack' skills or Talents for anything, let alone shooting.

    www.youtube.com - BSG: BLOOD & CHROME- Pilot "Better Than That"
    Last edited by OldGuy59; 04-27-2020 at 10:53.
    Mike
    "Flying is learning to throw yourself at the ground and miss" Douglas Adams
    "Wings of Glory won't skin your elbows and knees while practicing." OldGuy59

  13. #13

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    The pilot's manoeuvring can help the gunner get a good shot.

  14. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by Naharaht View Post
    The pilot's manoeuvring can help the gunner get a good shot.
    More likely screw up his shot mid-targeting!

    Try aiming a laser pointer, and have someone randomly and unexpectedly jog your arm...…………..
    I laugh in the face of danger - then I hide until it goes away!

  15. #15

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    I left a question on the Ares website and I have received a reply from Roberto Di Meglio.

    I asked,"

    In the Battlestar Galactica game, when operating a Colonial Raptor with more than one crew member possessing crew cards or tokens, is it possible for more than one crew member to use their attack bonuses and talents of the same type simultaneously provide a multiple boost (i.e. ability stacking)?".

    Roberto's reply was, " Dear David
    no, it is not possible, the entire crew is abstracted as a single set of cards, so they cannot stack.".

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    Nice work Naharaht, I'm kinda sad for the possible game play and thought it might be part of the "soon" to be released rules expansion but clarification is awesome. -15 points for unarmed gear card might be good when missiles arrive...whenever that might be. Strangely Boomer will never pilot the unarmed raptor if I'm using the point system I suspect.
    Last edited by MajorBorris; 04-29-2020 at 00:26.

  17. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by MajorBorris View Post
    Nice work, I'm kinda sad for the possible game play and thought it might be part of the "soon" to be released rules expansion but clarification is awesome. -15 points for unarmed gear card might be good when missiles arrive...whenever that might be. Strangely Boomer will never pilot the unarmed raptor if I'm using the point system I suspect.
    But, the maneuverability of the Unarmed Raptor is much better. And Boomer can then use her Daredevil Talent for non-straight Overboosts. Cause, otherwise, Boomer's Daredevil Talent is a complete waste.
    Mike
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    "Wings of Glory won't skin your elbows and knees while practicing." OldGuy59

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    Quote Originally Posted by OldGuy59 View Post
    But, the maneuverability of the Unarmed Raptor is much better. And Boomer can then use her Daredevil Talent for non-straight Overboosts. Cause, otherwise, Boomer's Daredevil Talent is a complete waste.
    Wouldn't it be better just to take an average pilot with itchy trigger finger and Daredevil? Although I'm still not sure if I prefer to play with the point system or just equal pilots and talent / gear cards but then again with equal Pilots I'd be giving the enemy a plus one for free.

  19. #19

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    You already know my opinion on the subject - NO POINTS!!!! Points systems NEVER work!
    I laugh in the face of danger - then I hide until it goes away!

  20. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by MajorBorris View Post
    Wouldn't it be better just to take an average pilot with itchy trigger finger and Daredevil? Although I'm still not sure if I prefer to play with the point system or just equal pilots and talent / gear cards but then again with equal Pilots I'd be giving the enemy a plus one for free.
    So, you are still planning on putting weapons on the Raptor, with the choice of Itchy Trigger Finger? Which means the Overboost turn cards remain Difficult Maneuvers, and unavailable for use with the Daredevil Talent. The issue with the Daredevil Talent is that you can use "non-straight" Overboosts after a Difficult Maneuver. However, you are not allowed to do two Difficult Maneuvers in consecutive turns. For Vipers, this doesn't come up, but Raptor Overboost turns ARE Difficult Maneuvers, if the Raptor has any weapons, not just when equipped with gun and rocket pods.

    From a combat game point of view, I can understand the idea of putting guns on the Raptors, but it never happened in the series (with the exception of the Combat Assault gear). So, why did Boomer get Firing Talents at all? Marketing decision? Boomer's Talents should have all been Action, Maneuver, and Other. She could have had Exceptional Pilot, allowing her to use two Maneuver Talents in the same turn, and Elusive/Evasion, or Quick Reactions.

    Just my nickel.
    Mike
    "Flying is learning to throw yourself at the ground and miss" Douglas Adams
    "Wings of Glory won't skin your elbows and knees while practicing." OldGuy59



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