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Thread: Air Racing Anyone?

  1. #1


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    Default Air Racing Anyone?

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Now I just need some 1930's planes...

  2. #2

    Smile

    I think I have seen some racing here on the Forum. Perhaps Dave AKA "Clipper"?

    I reckon its a "No Contest" between a SPAD & that Fok Dr.I.

    "Its a fine line indeed between going out in a Blaze of Glory or having Crashed & Burnt!"
    Member Australian Society of WW1 Aero Historians

  3. #3

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    I'm sure Shapeways could help you out with 1930s racers. Looks like fun. Who got to play?

  4. #4

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    If you want the Fokker Dr.1 to win you need more pylons and a very twisting course. Are the pylons home made or did you buy them from somewhere, please?

  5. #5

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    yeah, dave (clipper) painted up some dc3s in racing livery.

  6. #6


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    Racing Pylon #1.pdf

    I made them in Paint and MS Word. I printed them on card stock, then folding and a bit of glue and Presto!

    Here's the PDF of pylon #1. If there's an interest, I can post pylons with higher numbers.

  7. #7

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    Thanks for the Pylon PDF; Strangely Brown in the UK has run a air race game (with armed planes!) at Doncaster.
    I was going to use his inspiration (and notes) to run my own, but faltered with the gaming aids for visuals.
    Karl
    It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus

  8. #8

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    Thanks! Someday . . . been planning a Red Bull game, but . . . life . . .

  9. #9


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    The airfield is coming together. Click image for larger version. 

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  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dobbs View Post
    The airfield is coming together. Click image for larger version. 

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    I have been trying to put together a Wings of Glory air race thing for a few years. It would be one way of getting people into the game system, without the guns. As that is a thing for some Canadians, especially if children are part of the mix.

    Keep this going, please.

    My first attempt looked a a race around Reims, France, as it had a few landmarks that could be used for corners during the race:
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    I just couldn't get different planes to work over the course, because maneuverable planes tend to be slow, and unmaneuverable planes are too fast. Things like blocking moves, or slip-streaming tactics, dirty tricks, jettisoned objects, and smoke screens were being considered to "even" the playing field, or win in tight race situations.

    The idea was that position and strategy could work for and against pilots, not just the capabilities of a given plane. I wasn't smart enough to get it to work.

    Anyone else smarter than me (I hope)?
    Mike
    "Flying is learning to throw yourself at the ground and miss" Douglas Adams
    "Wings of Glory won't skin your elbows and knees while practicing." OldGuy59

  11. #11

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    One could find actual air race routes from the past online as well as the Red Bull and Reno races . . . Scaled at 1/144 or 1/200 . . . One might have a supply of appropriate aircraft . . . One might . . .

  12. #12

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    Any one remember this from Zvezda?

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    Nice planes . . .

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    Always wanted to expand it . . .

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    Now if the attachment and rotation cooperate . . .

  13. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by OldGuy59 View Post
    I have been trying to put together a Wings of Glory air race thing for a few years. It would be one way of getting people into the game system, without the guns. As that is a thing for some Canadians, especially if children are part of the mix.

    Keep this going, please.

    My first attempt looked a a race around Reims, France, as it had a few landmarks that could be used for corners during the race:
    Click image for larger version. 

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    I just couldn't get different planes to work over the course, because maneuverable planes tend to be slow, and unmaneuverable planes are too fast. Things like blocking moves, or slip-streaming tactics, dirty tricks, jettisoned objects, and smoke screens were being considered to "even" the playing field, or win in tight race situations.

    The idea was that position and strategy could work for and against pilots, not just the capabilities of a given plane. I wasn't smart enough to get it to work.

    Anyone else smarter than me (I hope)?
    I think it could work with customized decks that picked the best moves from multiple decks - some of the tight turns and slower straights from the more maneuverable decks along with the fast straight / sideslips of the faster decks like the A and N. You could even Immelmann a hairpin turn.

    Might have to think about this before the next grandson visit ....

  14. #14

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    . . . Dice rolls for overheated engines, high speed stalls, bird strikes, etc . . . stopwatch for overall elapse time . . .

  15. #15

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    Indeed! A D.VII wouldve done the trick

  16. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by clipper1801 View Post
    . . . Dice rolls for overheated engines, high speed stalls, bird strikes, etc . . . stopwatch for overall elapse time . . .
    NO DICE!

    Otherwise, it's some other game, not Wings of Glory. But, yes.

    I was thinking that a player could use something like a NOx Boost, but then would have to draw a damage card and if not a zero..., or would have to plan stalls for a few phases, or something...

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    Mike
    "Flying is learning to throw yourself at the ground and miss" Douglas Adams
    "Wings of Glory won't skin your elbows and knees while practicing." OldGuy59

  17. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by the black devil View Post
    Indeed! A D.VII would've done the trick
    For one player, and then a Snipe for another, and so on...

    Think Barnstorming, or whatever. But my idea was to use pretty much planes out-of-the-box, if possible, to play the air race, so it would be the same experience, without the guns.
    Mike
    "Flying is learning to throw yourself at the ground and miss" Douglas Adams
    "Wings of Glory won't skin your elbows and knees while practicing." OldGuy59

  18. #18

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    I've thought on this a few times, and yes, given the digital nature of the WoG engine, and the lack of energy rules, it does make it tough to have a matched race.
    WGS might work better, since the 2 speed method lets you choose between speed and turning radius, to some extent.
    Also, requiring some pylons to but crossed/rounded at certain altitudes makes it more challenging, and might even things up some.
    Of course, if the planes are armed, being in front isn't always the best idea
    Not what you're looking for, Mike, I know.

    Karl
    It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus

  19. #19


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    I've almost finished the bleachers. Soon the pilots will get turned loose on the course and Captain Dobbs' Royal Flying Circus will be open for business. Click image for larger version. 

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  20. #20

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    Awesome! I want front row seats or pit passes as soon as they are available!

  21. #21


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    The Build-a-Bleacher kit

    Bleacher Front.pdf

    Bleacher Back.pdf

    I printed the sheets on some 110lb cardstock I found at Walmart. I imagine that 65lb would work fine. I used thin square basswood rods (probably 1/16) for the columns.

  22. #22


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    Racing Pylons 2-6

    The Start/Finish and Intermediate lines print with lines when printed as a PDF, but word files don't transfer so well. If anyone prints them and is dissatisfied, let me know and I will scan my Word-printed ones and upload them.

    Attachment 273965

    Attachment 273966

    Attachment 273967

    Attachment 273968

    Attachment 273969

    Attachment 273970

    Attachment 273971

  23. #23

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    Looks like the attachments villain has visited you too! Rats! Here are some fancy Spads that toured post war in the U.S. they would be great air racers!

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    Last edited by clipper1801; 08-26-2019 at 20:10.

  24. #24

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    Your set-up looks fantastic!

    If we should have to fight, we should be prepared to do so from the neck up instead of from the neck down. -Jimmy Doolittle

  25. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by clipper1801 View Post
    Any one remember this from Zvezda?

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    Me. I am the translator of the Italian rules in the box.

  26. #26

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    Great stuff Dobbs!!!

    Clipper1801 did something like that after being challenged by Csad on the past:
    https://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/sh...50-DC-3-Racing

  27. #27

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    II
    Quote Originally Posted by clipper1801 View Post
    Looks like the attachments villain has visited you too! Rats! Here are some fancy Spads that toured post war in the U.S. they would be great air
    Beautiful collection, David!
    Voilą le soleil d'Austerlitz!

  28. #28


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    Aargh! Let's try again...

    Bleacher Front.pdf

    Bleacher Back.pdf

    Bleacher Back Larger Arrow.pdf

    The second back sports a thicker arrow, which I thought worked better visually.
    Last edited by Dobbs; 09-05-2019 at 17:23.

  29. #29

  30. #30


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    I love your Spads and your DC-3s, Clipper. Are the Spads decals or did you paint all of them?

  31. #31

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    Clipper, those Spads are amazing. I love the different schemes you did. Dobbs, Cool pylons and race setup. Been pondering armed races myself. Thanks you for sharing this!

  32. #32

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dobbs View Post
    I love your Spads and your DC-3s, Clipper. Are the Spads decals or did you paint all of them?
    It was a mix of home made stickers and paint . . . the Flag Bus is my fave, did 6 of them . . . if you Google The Flag Bus Spad you will find their story : )
    Last edited by clipper1801; 08-27-2019 at 18:29.

  33. #33

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jager View Post
    WGS might work better, since the 2 speed method lets you choose between speed and turning radius, to some extent.
    WGS Bi-Planes!

    Or just use WGS decks with WGF aircraft.

  34. #34


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    I've been working on my racing rules and want to include altitude. Height would be limited to 4 pegs.

    The regular altitude rules don't seem to reflect a plane moving faster in a dive? I've been thinking of a zooming dive, where the diving plane could use two dive cards or a dive and a non-stall turn for the diving movement. Any thoughts?

  35. #35

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    . . . loving it! Slower for the climb then . . .

  36. #36

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dobbs View Post
    I've been working on my racing rules and want to include altitude. Height would be limited to 4 pegs.

    The regular altitude rules don't seem to reflect a plane moving faster in a dive? I've been thinking of a zooming dive, where the diving plane could use two dive cards or a dive and a non-stall turn for the diving movement. Any thoughts?
    I've wondered about moving faster in a dive but I suspect the reason in the game is that while the air speed increases the horizontal distance over the ground doesn't.
    Could be wrong though.

    Wonderful concept and looking good in its reality.

  37. #37

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dobbs View Post
    I've been working on my racing rules and want to include altitude. Height would be limited to 4 pegs.

    The regular altitude rules don't seem to reflect a plane moving faster in a dive? I've been thinking of a zooming dive, where the diving plane could use two dive cards or a dive and a non-stall turn for the diving movement. Any thoughts?
    Energy is something greatly missing from the WoG engine. Not as big a deal with the high-drag WW1 planes, but really missed with WW2.
    I have some thoughts, but not the time now to polish them for publishing. Maybe this winter.
    Karl
    It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus

  38. #38

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vagabond View Post
    I've wondered about moving faster in a dive but I suspect the reason in the game is that while the air speed increases the horizontal distance over the ground doesn't.
    Could be wrong though.

    Wonderful concept and looking good in its reality.
    A lot of the gained and lost speed is reflected in the card movement during the climb/dive. The issue is afterward, esp. with the gained speed being strictly horizontal. The trick is figuring blanket rules for how much, and how long, as it was very aircraft dependent.

    Karl
    It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dobbs View Post
    I've been working on my racing rules and want to include altitude. Height would be limited to 4 pegs.

    The regular altitude rules don't seem to reflect a plane moving faster in a dive? I've been thinking of a zooming dive, where the diving plane could use two dive cards or a dive and a non-stall turn for the diving movement. Any thoughts?
    I think I've got it. For my zoom dive, players play the dive and a straight or dive and a turn, putting the second card on the end of the first. This makes it an advantage, but removes the in between base-length from the move.

  40. #40


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    Here's my stab at Air Racing Rules:

    Air Racing Rules.pdf

    Wind Chit.pdf

    There are now more current rules at post #62
    Last edited by Dobbs; 09-09-2019 at 18:36.

  41. #41


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    Here's a Thank You to the folks who have sent Rep points my way for my efforts!

    If anyone prints out my stuff and makes use of it, please share the pictures. I'd love to know about it!

  42. #42

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    Looks pretty cool Dobbs. I'd love to try it but don't seem to have much time in the near future to fit it in. Someday...

  43. #43

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    Nice racing rules. I will give these a try and see what plane fairs the best.

  44. #44

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    Quote Originally Posted by Teaticket View Post
    Looks pretty cool Dobbs. I'd love to try it but don't seem to have much time in the near future to fit it in. Someday...
    Hey Peter; think something like this would be a draw at Origins?
    Karl
    It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus

  45. #45

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    I'll dig out the DC-3's this weekend and give them a try! Thanks a bunch! Lots of great detail work . . . now where did I put those gooney bird cards . . .?

  46. #46


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    Quote Originally Posted by Jager View Post
    Hey Peter; think something like this would be a draw at Origins?
    Karl
    If you need a new town name on the bleachers I can change that!

  47. #47

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dobbs View Post
    If you need a new town name on the bleachers I can change that!
    OK, I'll let you know. Thanks.
    Karl
    It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus

  48. #48


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    A new set of bleachers takes shape, using the PDFs I uploaded to this thread.

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    The finished bleachers in the back are the prototype, and have been improved upon.

  49. #49


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    To keep the lightweight paper pylons from getting bumped off station, I glued a 1/4" high centering block to the pylon stripes. I used plastic, but wood would have been just fine.

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  50. #50

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