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Thread: T&T&T: Triplanes & Tripods & Tanks

  1. #1

    Default T&T&T: Triplanes & Tripods & Tanks

    I just happened to notice that there are lots of 1/100 WW1 tanks on Ebay - mental gears begin whirring...

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    . . . gotta have TANKS! Somewhere, some when the elves did some 1/144" scale WWI tanks didn't we? . . . they had landships in the second book . . . working on those now, but its secret . . .

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    Wow, Wayne! That's quite a collection of 1/200 scale WWI tanks and vehicles I look forward to seeing what you print off... I have some 6mm - 1/300 stuff from Shapeways, but maybe the 1/200 scale is a bit better to use with Tripods.

    All the best,
    Matt

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    Thanks for the share. What a great selection of super looking vehicles.


    Here's to them what are like us. Damn few and they're all dead.

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    Matt and Rhodie,
    Has anybody done a tank rule set that works with wings of glory. Tanks with the WOG planes against the tripods would be quite an epic session. I think it would be quite fun!

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    Plastic Soldier Company issued a series of WWI tanks as expansions to their boardgame The Great War which I play with my buddy at least once a week.
    Those are British Mark I/II, Whippet, German A7V, Captured Mark I/II, French Schneider and St. Chamond. I do not recall the exact scale, but look really great and will surely fit the bill - and the minis are prepainted.
    <img src=http://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=2554&dateline=1409073309 border=0 alt= />
    "We do not stop playing when we get old, but we get old when we stop playing."

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    They're 15mm (1/100 scale). So might be a bit big for WoG Martians.
    Karl
    It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus

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    I think 1/144 would be the largest you would want to go with tanks in any sort of added ground combat to T&T...and I think I really like the idea of 1/200 instead of 1/300. They would be easier to paint - I like the 1/300 vehicles as ground targets, but for actual interactive use with tripods I think the 1/200 ones would fit better.

    Movement scales and cannon firing/range would be the keys to synch with T&T...have to give it some thought.

    All the best,
    Matt

  10. #10

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    I thought about using a modified T deck (Morane_Saulnier) maneuver deck with a tank. Maybe one of the slower bombers. Also thinking of combining a C and D deck for damage. Just a thought. Firing range would need some contemplating.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Biggles downunder View Post
    Ooh, ooh, just found this 3D printed set!!

    https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:3555618
    I've printed a couple of the tanks and mobile artillery and they do look good. Though I have to add supports to the guns.

  12. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by camelbeagle View Post
    I thought about using a modified T deck (Morane_Saulnier) maneuver deck with a tank. Maybe one of the slower bombers. Also thinking of combining a C and D deck for damage. Just a thought. Firing range would need some contemplating.
    Hmm - a fast tank - that'll take some catching Dan !
    We've used tanks & other vehicles in OTT in the past - the quickest and easiest method of movement was the width of a range ruler - put it across the front of the vehicle (card) then move the front of the vehicle to the other side of the ruler. Probably still quicker than it should be but a decent compromise.
    We've also used the XA deck but just 1 card per game turn.

    "He is wise who watches"

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    I decided to do a test print of just 2 tanks and here they are. So fresh that I haven’t removed them from the build plate yet:

    Click image for larger version. 

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    I reckon the guns will need replacing with stretched sprue. Now that I’ve got the settings dialled in for this particular filament I’m keen to try some French vehicles.

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    And here are some more shots after they have been removed from the build plate. They still need cleaning up, painting etc:

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Click image for larger version. 

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    Last edited by Biggles downunder; 07-24-2019 at 19:57.

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    Two more test prints join the stable!

    Click image for larger version. 

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    I’m really happy with the way these are turning out and now that I have replaced the compressor on my airbrush,I can restart the paint shop but I have quite a back-log - Thunderchild & now tanks.

    Hey Clipper, about those elves who want to emigrate...
    Last edited by Biggles downunder; 07-24-2019 at 20:01.

  16. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightbomber View Post
    Plastic Soldier Company issued a series of WWI tanks as expansions to their boardgame The Great War which I play with my buddy at least once a week.
    Those are British Mark I/II, Whippet, German A7V, Captured Mark I/II, French Schneider and St. Chamond. I do not recall the exact scale, but look really great and will surely fit the bill - and the minis are prepainted.





    ive got a few of theirs and some flames of war 1/100 ww1 tanks

  17. #17

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    Those tanks look pretty good! Thanks for sharing this!!!

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    I will definitely print a few more for my kit. Even if they don't more more than the width of a range ruler it would be a good addition. For me at least, I always felt that T&T should have contained at least basic artillery rules. Honestly though, because of their lack of mobility they would be more targets. However even with very basic rules and limited mobility it would add so much to the flavor/theme to the game.

  19. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by Biggles downunder View Post
    Two more test prints join the stable!

    Click image for larger version. 

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    I’m really happy with the way these are turning out and now that I have replaced the compressor on my airbrush,I can restart the paint shop but I have quite a back-log - Thunderchild & now tanks.

    Hey Clipper, about those elves who want to emigrate...
    They would love a set here to play with, are you thinking of an elf based effort? We are planning a trip to the NZ in January, I could bring a bag of elves over and they could sail themselves over the channel . . . just a short swim for them . . .
    Last edited by clipper1801; 07-25-2019 at 12:20.

  20. #20

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    So these are in 1/200, Wayne? They don't look bad at all - is the layered look a function of your printer? Will you sand that or will it fill when you prime them? I look forward to seeing them as you work on them (and the Thunder Child, too, of course!)

    All the best,
    Matt

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    On my printer you can see the layering. If I print in fine mode you don't see it as much, but it is there. I don't model, paint, etc. so I couldn't answer your question on sanding or priming. Sorry.

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    In answer to the layering questions:

    This is a fact of life when printing in PLA and I reckon any serious attempt to smooth the tanks would result in a massive deletion of fine detail. Actually, they look better 'in the flesh' as the close-up nature of the photographs emphasizes the layers.

    One way to deal with this would be to print in ABS (which gives off horrible fumes that need to be vented) and then smooth in Acetone vapour as described in this article:

    https://rigid.ink/blogs/news/acetone-vapor-smoothing

    I haven't used ABS because of the fumes given off by the printing process and the fumes given off by the smoothing process but maybe it's something I need to think about!
    Last edited by Biggles downunder; 07-25-2019 at 21:07. Reason: Fixed crap spelling

  23. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by clipper1801 View Post
    They would love a set here to play with, are you thinking of an elf based effort? We are planning a trip to the NZ in January, I could bring a bag of elves over and they could sail themselves over the channel . . . just a short swim for them . . .
    Hi Dave, maybe you could give me a postal address for when you are in NZ and I could send some for your elves to play with.
    Last edited by Biggles downunder; 07-26-2019 at 00:42.

  24. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken at Sunrise View Post
    I will definitely print a few more for my kit. Even if they don't more more than the width of a range ruler it would be a good addition. For me at least, I always felt that T&T should have contained at least basic artillery rules. Honestly though, because of their lack of mobility they would be more targets. However even with very basic rules and limited mobility it would add so much to the flavor/theme to the game.
    At the very least they would be some interesting eye candy!!

  25. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by matt56 View Post
    So these are in 1/200, Wayne? They don't look bad at all - is the layered look a function of your printer? Will you sand that or will it fill when you prime them? I look forward to seeing them as you work on them (and the Thunder Child, too, of course!)

    All the best,
    Matt
    Yep, 1/200 scale

  26. #26

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    Two more join the menagerie. What is the collective noun for a bunch of tanks I wonder?

    Click image for larger version. 

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  27. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by Biggles downunder View Post
    Two more join the menagerie. What is the collective noun for a bunch of tanks I wonder?

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Depending on the country, a troop or a squadron?

    US Army Doctrine (FM 17-15) says:
    The tank platoon is the smallest maneuver element within a tank company. Organized to
    fight as a unified element, the platoon consists of four main battle tanks organized into
    two sections, with two tanks in each section. The platoon leader (Tank 1) and platoon
    sergeant (Tank 4) are the section leaders. Tank 2 is the wingman in the platoon leader's
    section, and Tank 3 is the wingman in the platoon sergeant's section (see Figure 1-1).
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    Almost like the Luftwaffe Schwarm organization...
    Mike
    "Flying is learning to throw yourself at the ground and miss" Douglas Adams
    "Wings of Glory won't skin your elbows and knees while practicing." OldGuy59

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    That 'tadpole' Brit looks pretty tasty, too, Wayne! I imagine the layering isn't too bad for a gaming piece - when these are blown up in a picture like this, you see all of the nooks and crannies. I look forward to seeing how painting them tones down that aspect of the model.

    Names for groups of things always works well if there is some alliteration involved, so perhaps 'troop of tanks' (which uses the British smallest-unit term) might work?! Unless you can come up with a nifty word to use with these land leviathans...

    All the best,
    Matt

  29. #29

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    Quote Originally Posted by matt56 View Post
    That 'tadpole' Brit looks pretty tasty, too, Wayne! I imagine the layering isn't too bad for a gaming piece - when these are blown up in a picture like this, you see all of the nooks and crannies. I look forward to seeing how painting them tones down that aspect of the model.

    Names for groups of things always works well if there is some alliteration involved, so perhaps 'troop of tanks' (which uses the British smallest-unit term) might work?! Unless you can come up with a nifty word to use with these land leviathans...

    All the best,
    Matt
    Funny you should mention alliteration Matt as when I asked the question it was a bit tongue in cheek. I was thinking of phrases like ‘a tangle of tanks’ or ‘a tussle of tanks’

  30. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by flash View Post
    Hmm - a fast tank - that'll take some catching Dan !
    We've used tanks & other vehicles in OTT in the past - the quickest and easiest method of movement was the width of a range ruler - put it across the front of the vehicle (card) then move the front of the vehicle to the other side of the ruler. Probably still quicker than it should be but a decent compromise.
    We've also used the XA deck but just 1 card per game turn.
    Just curious, what damage deck and range to you use?

  31. #31

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    I have the same questions Ken. I was thinking of a C or D deck. My biggest thought is how do you the short and long range of the tank guns.

  32. #32

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    Quote Originally Posted by Biggles downunder View Post
    ...What is the collective noun for a bunch of tanks I wonder? ....
    Perhaps it should be a clatter of tanks Wayne !

    "He is wise who watches"

  33. #33

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken at Sunrise View Post
    Just curious, what damage deck and range to you use?
    They were mostly used as targets Ken but used their MG as AAMG so could bite back.
    Cannon used in aircraft have been given 1 Ruler range and 1 C deck damage card, I can't see a reason the tanks should be any different - they should be bloody hard to shoot from and the same to hit a target.
    Personally for aircraft cannon I'll use a modifed C deck with only three or four 0's in the deck as it's direct fire, much like a machinegun, rather than area fire of the AAA type where the shrapnel does the job. Iirc there are 9 x 0 in a C deck (17 cards).
    For big arty type guns you could always use greater ranges & bump the damage cards depending on the calibre; eg. 2xC; 1C+1D; 2D - it would give the Martians something to head for and stomp on !

    Quote Originally Posted by camelbeagle View Post
    I have the same questions Ken. I was thinking of a C or D deck. My biggest thought is how do you the short and long range of the tank guns.
    You don't, the round is explosive so the bang should be the same whatever the range - you could always look at impact on a Martian I suppose - maybe choose a deck & give it a +1 at short range ?

    "He is wise who watches"

  34. #34

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    Likely the English teacher in me, Wayne, although alliteration works in any language as a mnemonic - not to mention being pleasing to the ear...

    I like your 'clatter', Dave - not alliteration, per se, but rather onomatopoeiac in nature...

    I like the basic ideas you're floating about tank guns, too, Dave - I was thinking it would be C or D deck damage in some form or another. Your movement idea of the width of the ruler each move phase or a card once a turn (3-card move) both sound good, as well - I would almost lean to the latter so that one doesn't need to do too much 'planning' with ground movement, or make it too powerful and flexible. I was looking around on Shapeways and there is all sorts of WWI arty available in 1/200, too, that might allow for not only targets but something to actually hit back at the tripods with, were one to want to add it to the mix. Artillery is certainly a key element in the Earth's defense against the Martians in the original novel. And, like you said, it would be great for 'stomping'...

    All the best,
    Matt

  35. #35

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    I agree that they are mostly targets. In the book, an artillery group of cannons brought down a tripod and was immediately incinerated. But since the cannons/tanks are a stable platform they shouldn't any less than artillery. Perhaps even better as they lead their target and wait for the right moment. The plans and tripods can cover so much more ground that limiting movement seems not only a good choice but thematic as well.

    Quote Originally Posted by flash View Post
    They were mostly used as targets Ken but used their MG as AAMG so could bite back.
    Cannon used in aircraft have been given 1 Ruler range and 1 C deck damage card, I can't see a reason the tanks should be any different - they should be bloody hard to shoot from and the same to hit a target.
    Personally for aircraft cannon I'll use a modifed C deck with only three or four 0's in the deck as it's direct fire, much like a machinegun, rather than area fire of the AAA type where the shrapnel does the job. Iirc there are 9 x 0 in a C deck (17 cards).
    For big arty type guns you could always use greater ranges & bump the damage cards depending on the calibre; eg. 2xC; 1C+1D; 2D - it would give the Martians something to head for and stomp on !


    You don't, the round is explosive so the bang should be the same whatever the range - you could always look at impact on a Martian I suppose - maybe choose a deck & give it a +1 at short range ?
    What do you mean by "bump the damage cards depending on the calibre; eg. 2xC; 1C+1D; 2D".

  36. #36

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken at Sunrise View Post
    ...But since the cannons/tanks are a stable platform they shouldn't any less than artillery.
    Yeah they should. Operating anything in a tank was tremendously difficult in WW1 particularly whilst in motion, they're not a stable base for any sort of gunnery & vision is limited. The tank guns in World War I were used against unarmoured or lightly armoured targets such as machine gun nests and artillery pieces at relatively short - machine gun type - ranges.


    Quote Originally Posted by Ken at Sunrise View Post
    ...What do you mean by "bump the damage cards depending on the calibre; eg. 2xC; 1C+1D; 2D".
    What I meant by that was - change up the damage depending on whether you're throwing a baked bean tin, a keg, or, a dustbin down range.
    Not all guns will do 1 C deck damage - so the bigger the gun/shell - the bigger the damage ! eg 2x C deck for guns up to X cal; 1C+1D deck damage for guns X - Y cal; 2D deck damage for guns Y - Z cal and so on, however you'd like to figure it out. Will take a bit of research but doable.

    "He is wise who watches"

  37. #37

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    I ordered another Kickstarter: War of the Worlds - The New Wave specifically to get the tanks and ships and to have a strategic map to augment T&T.

    From the latest update it looks like August/September fulfillment.
    Just about a year quicker than Ares ...

  38. #38

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    A ‘clatter’ of tanks - love it!!

    I had a crazy thought regarding the possible back-story behind a motley collection of tanks going up against the tripods. It goes something like this:

    Chaos gripped the former protagonists as the impact of the tripod invasion slowly dawned on each high command. There was a mad scramble to recover, resurrect and repair any technology that might have an impact on the coming conflict.

    Teams were hurriedly cobbled together with orders to scour the recent battlefields and bring back tanks in particular. The teams were coordinated by a Major Watson and they were nicknamed ‘Watsons Whizzers’.

    More to follow...

  39. #39

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    I did some experiments few years ago....
    link

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    I am sorry to dampen your enthusiasm but WW1 tanks would be too slow and they do not have the armour to resist the Martian heat rays. The only reason that the 'landships' in the Stephen Baxter book lasted so long was that they were made from Martian metal salvaged after the first invasion.

  41. #41

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    Quote Originally Posted by Naharaht View Post
    I am sorry to dampen your enthusiasm but WW1 tanks would be too slow and they do not have the armour to resist the Martian heat rays. The only reason that the 'landships' in the Stephen Baxter book lasted so long was that they were made from Martian metal salvaged after the first invasion.



    well, one would think theyd be more resistant then canvas and wood aircraft.

  42. #42

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    Quote Originally Posted by Naharaht View Post
    I am sorry to dampen your enthusiasm but WW1 tanks would be too slow and they do not have the armour to resist the Martian heat rays. The only reason that the 'landships' in the Stephen Baxter book lasted so long was that they were made from Martian metal salvaged after the first invasion.



    well, one would think theyd be more resistant then canvas and wood aircraft.



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