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Thread: 2 gun planes

  1. #1

    Default 2 gun planes

    This has probably been raised before, but where there are two forward firing guns that are separate, (such as on the Nieuport 17 or SE5), should'nt the card read B/B rather than A for damage? I am thinking of jamming. If a jam comes up then only one gun should be jammed in those cases and the plane should revert to a single B. I am also thinking that rather than try those dangerous gymnastics when reloading the top lewis I would probably leave it and just use the main gun and concentrate on flying so maybe there is a lewis reload rule in here somewhere?

  2. #2

    Default

    It has been mentioned Gary

    Andrea had this to say:
    Jamming twin guns (A firing planes)
    When you fire with an A weapon, that represents twin guns, you could jam one of the machineguns or, more rarely, both of them.
    If you are at short distance, you jam a machinegun if target picks up a jammed Damage card, you jam both of them if he picks up two of them. Firing at long distance, you jam both of them if the target picks the 0 red jammed Damage card, only one if he picks the 2 red or a green jammed Damage card.
    Planes jamming a single gun take three jammed counters. Each turn after moving, the player can decide if unjam the jammed machinegun or if they want to fire with the remaining one. If they unjam, they discard a token; if they fire they do it at B capability (and they normally jam this second weapon if a jamming B card is picked by the target). The weapon is unjammed if the player unjam it after three consecutive maneuvers. It is allowed to stop unjamming to fire with the other weapon at any moment, but the jamned counters are immediately restored to three.
    If both weapons are jammed, they are unjammed at the same time after the same three consecutive maneuvers. No dseparate account of unjamming is necessary.
    You could decide to apply it just to Se5a, Ni.17/23, twin MGs SPAD VII and the like.
    https://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/sh...E5a-amp-Jamage
    https://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/sh...-shooting-rule

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  3. #3

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    Thank you Dave for your links on this fascinating subject. After reading through the material I am thinking that it is best to leave things as is. Any jam card means no firing for 3 movements. The decider for me was as someone else pointed out I do not think a damage token could be discarded where the pilot was still firing 1 machine gun and the other jammed because he would be just about physically unable to aim and fire whilst clearing a jam.

  4. #4

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    Gary I'm sure the ruling is, if employing the I can still fire as a B damage if 1 gun jams situation, that the pilot continues firing as a B damage or tries to un-jam the jammed gun he cannot fire and un-jam at the same time.
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  5. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by Baxter View Post
    I do not think a damage token could be discarded where the pilot was still firing 1 machine gun and the other jammed because he would be just about physically unable to aim and fire whilst clearing a jam.
    I keep track of planes that can use the B deck because one of their A deck guns jammed by using the WoW token for those cases and the WoG token for regular jams.
    If the aircraft fires that 'B' gun then tokens are put back to 3.

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by Baxter View Post
    ... I do not think a damage token could be discarded where the pilot was still firing 1 machine gun and the other jammed because he would be just about physically unable to aim and fire whilst clearing a jam...
    Which is basically what Andrea's said when he wrote the above rule Gary.
    You can fire the remaining gun as a B deck, or, you can unjam the jammed gun. Not both.
    If having commenced to unjam the jammed one you choose to fire the remaining gun then you start the unjam from the beginning with three tokens. eg unjam, unjam, shoot - requires - unjam unjam unjam to clear the gun jam.
    I've used this rule, particularly with SE5 & N.17 as they have separate gun systems, for years and it works fine.
    Last edited by flash; 11-22-2018 at 01:43.

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  7. #7

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    Always remember that you can 'house rule' the situation any way you like.

  8. #8

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    Ooh... this would be a good house rule to give unreachable machine guns. I'm gonna start using it for that.

  9. #9

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    Certain twin-gun mounts on German planes had two firing buttons; you could choose whether to fire both MGs, or just one.
    Albatros D series springs to mind.
    I read just the other day a report from Oswald Boelcke, recording one of his 'kills', stating "one of my machine guns jammed, but the other fired all the better for it!". Something to do with the synchronisation system, perhaps?

  10. #10

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    The Camel, SE's, Pfalz D.III's had two firing buttons also. It's certainly an option to run in a game and alleviates the unreachable gun issue a little.
    May have to try it in the next FC Tim, whenever that may be !

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