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Thread: An idea for climb rate and altitude points costs

  1. #1

    Default An idea for climb rate and altitude points costs

    Hi all. Whilst feebly trying to work out the breakdown of the points costs of the planes using the list given to us by Andrea, I came up with a simple idea for adding to each plane an additional cost for ceiling and climb rate. It works out like this: planes max ceiling minus planes climb rate equals points cost to add to base value when playing using altitude.
    Here are some examples:
    Albatros CIII Climb rate 8, Ceiling 8 (8-8=0) Base pts cost 81 add 0pts Total 81pts
    Albatros DVa Climb rate 4, Ceiling 14 (14-4=10) Base pts cost 82 add 10pts Total 92pts
    Fokker Dr1 Climb rate 2, Ceiling 14 (14-2=12) Base pts cost 85 add 12pts Total 97pts
    Fokker EIII Climb rate 6, Ceiling 9 (9-6=3) Base pts cost 48 add 3pts Total 51pts

    So what do you guys think, would it work? It is a very simple way to quickly adjust the points system to fit the altitude rules.

  2. #2

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    Yes, that's very quick and elegant. Thanks for the contribution I am only uncertain if it actually matches the utility of these data in the game. A low climb is with no doubt an advantage if altitude rules are in use. But maximum altitude is usually not useful at all - planes fight at an altitude where the enemy can be, and most miniatures scenarios are played within a 4 levels range where all planes can fly.

  3. #3

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    Thanks for the reply Andrea.
    Higher altitude can be a big advantage. If you can be a level higher before attacking it's an advantage. Immelmann turns can be performed more often with a higher ceiling. Escaping from a mission is easier if you can climb higher than your enemy. Also the planes with better climb rates tend to have higher ceilings and so cost more points, as they should.
    I'm going to play test these for a while to see how they pan out.
    I agree that if you only use the 4 levels of altitude it is less of an advantage. May be when using that system planes could pay 8pts for a climb rate of 2 through to 0pts for a climb rate of 8?
    Last edited by Popsical; 05-13-2018 at 14:35.

  4. #4

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    It could be an idea. Let me know about your tests!

  5. #5

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    Probably worth noting that even with using the full altitude rules, many scenarios just won't get that high. Bombing, ground attack and photo recon have to be done at heights well within the ceilings of even the worst aircraft. It's largely only going to matter in a pure dogfight that starts at high altitude... and the planes with a ceiling disadvantage can somewhat negate that by diving down to mid-range heights.

    The proposed system is simple and elegant, though, which is always good.

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by Angiolillo View Post
    Yes, that's very quick and elegant. Thanks for the contribution I am only uncertain if it actually matches the utility of these data in the game. A low climb is with no doubt an advantage if altitude rules are in use. But maximum altitude is usually not useful at all - planes fight at an altitude where the enemy can be, and most miniatures scenarios are played within a 4 levels range where all planes can fly.
    I've recently introduced that game to two new groups. Both want to play with more rules and altitude. I'm wondering if I should start with the Standard 4 altitude rules or go straight to the rules that use the planes max. Based on what you said the 4 altitude range of the Standard Rules should be enough, but I don't really see a difference in the rule other than the ceiling.

    Your thoughts?

  7. #7

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    Personally the 4 altitude rule doesn't do enough for me, it's nothing more to add the max ceilings in anyway and makes the planes more characterful IMO.

  8. #8

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    The 4 altitude rule seems to largely be in place because the minis come with 4 pegs and that using too many pegs might lead to topple over, damage and angry customers

    I agree that it's no trouble to just go with the full ceiling rules, though expanding the 4-band rule to a larger number (6 seems to work well) is a middle ground.

  9. #9

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    It appears to be a simple way to add ceiling to the points equation. I have played a mission where ceiling advantage saved the bacon of an SE5a confronted by three German scouts. I have had up to 15 pegs fitted to a base without any 'toppling' issues.

  10. #10

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    I have found that my planes rarely go over 12 pegs. I agree Carl that there doesn't seem to be any toppling issues (I haven't tried a giant yet though).

  11. #11

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    My thoughts were to put a 20 die beside each plane indicating altitude. And an eight sided die on their planning board to track climb counters, though climb counters might be just as easy.

  12. #12

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    The dice is a simple solution Ken, especially if pegs are in short supply.

  13. #13

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    All well and good, unless you want to photograph the action...................

    I find that planes at greatly different altitudes look as though they are at the same level if the correct number of pegs is not used; much of the dynamic situation is lost.
    I laugh in the face of danger - then I hide until it goes away!

  14. #14

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    Very true Tim. That is another reason I prefer to use the full altitude rules over the 4 levels.



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