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Thread: How durable is frosted ultra detail?

  1. #1

    Question How durable is frosted ultra detail?

    I've had some prior experience (different game system) with shapeways white, strong and flexible, and it was universally bad. I actually wound up being unable to get the surface finish to the point where I could start painting. So right now I'm looking at a highly detailed Felixstowe F.2a on shapeways (wingspan 20 cm, large giants base), and essentially I'm wondering if frosted ultra detail would be durable enough for this model. I'm willing to pay the price in order to be actually able to paint it in the first place, but I don't know if FUD would break too easily (especially for such a large model) to make it a good idea. Is it?

  2. #2

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    I understand FUD can be brittle - ie you wouldn't want to drop it ! There are now black and grey strong flexibles that may do better than WSF did for you - have a look here for all things Shapeways and comparisons of materials It has all been thoroughly discussed and assessed before by those that use it for production and usage.
    Last edited by flash; 12-27-2017 at 14:52. Reason: highlight link

    "He is wise who watches"

  3. #3

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    I would go with WSF for biplanes and bigger bombers in WWI and nearly anything else for WWII. The added detail is nice and the models are so tiny they still bounce well in WWII. Since they are game pieces to me I have no issues with WSF all the way. With the new 2x Spray colors for plastics in the Walmart world I find three wet coats works great for filling and surface prep . . . I mean the elves find it great!

  4. #4

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    Here's my limited experience for what it's worth: I've done several shapeways models in WSF but the grain of the material and lack of detail always left something to be desired. I had heard stories of FUD being too brittle and for a long time didn't try it. Since then I've seen some WWII models first hand that my brother picked up in FUD, and they aren't as brittle as I was afraid of. I went ahead and ordered an Eindecker and a Sopwith Pup in FUD and I think it will be just fine. I haven't painted them yet so things may change, but the FUD models don't seem to me to be any more fragile than the regular Nexus or Ares models. No, you would want to drop a FUD model on the floor, but I don't go dropping my Nexus or Ares models on the floor either... they would break just as easily I think.

    I can't say how well a 20 cm model will fare, but if you already treat your models with care then there isn't anything to be afraid of with the smaller models in FUD, in my opinion.

  5. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by brdavis View Post
    Here's my limited experience for what it's worth: I've done several shapeways models in WSF but the grain of the material and lack of detail always left something to be desired. I had heard stories of FUD being too brittle and for a long time didn't try it. Since then I've seen some WWII models first hand that my brother picked up in FUD, and they aren't as brittle as I was afraid of. I went ahead and ordered an Eindecker and a Sopwith Pup in FUD and I think it will be just fine. I haven't painted them yet so things may change, but the FUD models don't seem to me to be any more fragile than the regular Nexus or Ares models. No, you would want to drop a FUD model on the floor, but I don't go dropping my Nexus or Ares models on the floor either... they would break just as easily I think.

    I can't say how well a 20 cm model will fare, but if you already treat your models with care then there isn't anything to be afraid of with the smaller models in FUD, in my opinion.
    It's this one:
    https://www.shapeways.com/product/EY...ionId=60682118

    Tons of detail, much of it very deeply recessed, doesn't seem to be any way to get much of the detail to show up in WSF. My standing for not breaking is "tipped over on the gaming table, from a height of 4 pegs" and "bumped while on the gaming table" (The table would likely be one of Ares's mats as well, or baring that likely something semi-soft, but maybe not.) On the other hand, giants don't really fall off much, their much thicker pegs and large base make that improbable. I'd expect an Ares model to break if dropped on the floor, which I've never done. Interestingly, if knocked over, it seems this particular model's nose guns wouldn't actually contact the table if knocked over forward.

    Do you think it's durable enough by that standard? (Humm - seems to be a good candidate for gray HP plastic, going by the thread on it. I don't want warped/sagged FUD wings. The cavities would make something going trough the polisher a bad idea.) Also, where kind I find information on gray/black, strong and flexible for our use?

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by BraselC5048 View Post
    My standing for not breaking is "tipped over on the gaming table, from a height of 4 pegs" and "bumped while on the gaming table"

    Do you think it's durable enough by that standard?
    In my opinion, yes. I just looked at my FUD Sopwith Pup again, it is much lighter than a Nexus/Ares model would be and I am almost positive that it would survive a fall better. Again my experience is limited, but since placing an order and checking it out first hand, I no longer fear that FUD is "too brittle".

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by BraselC5048 View Post
    Also, where kind I find information on gray/black, strong and flexible for our use?
    https://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/sh...ial-HP-plastic
    which it appears you've already read !

    "He is wise who watches"

  8. #8

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    Keep in mind that WSF prints are much better today than they were a few years back. But they'll never reach the level of detail of FUD. You can see some close-up comparisons in the thread on HP materials.

    Personally I only make FUD available for fighter-sized planes at 1:144 -- it's just too expensive for large planes, and you might get the bendy wings problem.

    Unfortunately the HP materials aren't yet "on the table" for comparison because Shapeways still hasn't made them generally available for customers. (And, IMHO, they've overpriced the material too, but that's another thread.) Physically I think that will be an excellent material for large planes.

    A side note: Though I know most WoG gamers use 1:144 scale, I will mention that I think FUD is plenty durable at smaller scales like 1:285.

  9. #9

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    Ignore my other post, Daryl... just saw this here. Thanks!

  10. #10

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    Also, whatever happened to BHDA? It might be a good choice, but I haven't heard anything about it recently. Did they wind up cancelling it, or did it simply turn out not to be good for our uses?

  11. #11

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    Question - are sagging wings a problem that occurs during production, or does it occur gradually over time? (Ruled out White Detail on temperature/melting grounds.)
    Last edited by BraselC5048; 12-28-2017 at 16:21.

  12. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by BraselC5048 View Post
    Also, whatever happened to BHDA? It might be a good choice, but I haven't heard anything about it recently. Did they wind up cancelling it, or did it simply turn out not to be good for our uses?
    The black high-definition plastic has gotten mixed reviews...sometimes it's brilliant, sometimes there are unexplained print defects. While I think it might work well for WWII planes, I'm skeptical for WWI planes. When that material is printed, a scaffold of support struts is built into the model to support any overhangs, and the struts are clipped away by a Shapeways technician during post-processing. And that's where the rub lies -- I have no confidence that they would preserve the real struts and clip away the dross.

    Maybe I should order one to test my theory.

    Here's an example role-playing figure before the supports are removed:
    Click image for larger version. 

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