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Thread: Color: British PC12 & AMAPDT

  1. #1

    Default Color: British PC12 & AMAPDT

    While PC10 "Standard Khaki" was widely used on planes on the Western Front, PC12 was more widely used in other theater, especially the Middle East, and perhaps frequently on RNAS aircraft. Of course, no rule is absolute, and you can be sure there were some PC10 planes flying in Palestine and some PC12 planes in France.

    However, there is some more recent thinking that there has been some confusion between PC12 and another, more reddish color "AMAPDT":

    The problem is that PC12 has been confused with the 'AMAPDT (AMA Protective Dope Tropical) reddish brown' (based on red oxide) intended for tropical use and used more commonly post-war. The connection to Tripes on the Western Front is a bit of a reddish brown herring. From 'Coloured Thinking' in Windsock magazine Vol. 28 No.4 (July/August 2012) by Ray Rimell:-

    "Whilst the 'PC12 red/brown Sopwith Triplanes was another false path I'd rather not go down again" - footnoted thus:-

    "This was an early WINDSOCK International, Vol.3 No.1, Spring 1987, page 15, and later repeated by the editor in Datafile No. 22 when I stated some Sopwith Triplanes may have been doped in PC12, which was described as Reddish Brown. Actually many Naval types were in PC12 but the actual colour was more of a dark chocolate brown. The matched colour chips in WS 3/1 were close to later AMAPDT Reddish brown - for tropical use and unlikely to have been applied to Sopwith Triplanes..."
    On these colors: first the usual caveats: Unless you've got a high-end, wide-gamut monitor in perfect calibration (and who does?), do not trust the colors you see on your monitor! Instead, visit your local paint store and see if you can find paint samples like the ones listed below and then match your hobby paints against those. The goal is just to "get close". See 'Color: why we'll never get it exactly right'.

    Entries with an asterisk (*) are excellent matches; entries with question marks have not been formally measured with a color meter and confirmed.

    PC12 British upper surfaces, especially outside France, maybe RNAS commonly
    Source: Windsock Datafile 80
    Methuen/CIElab House Paints and Standards Hobby Paints

    La*b* 40.4,4,17.2
    Hex 6D5C43
    Beauti-Tone Cummings Oak CC086-3 or Hannover Hills 0228
    Behr Tree Swing PPU7-2*
    Benjamin Moore Tamarind AF-120
    Dulux/Glidden Thoroughbred 10YY 13/152
    FS595 30118 or 33105 or 30051
    Kelley-Moore Overgrown KM4715
    PPG Olive Wood 1097-7
    Sherwin-Williams Oliva Oscuro 9125*
    Valspar Stampede 3008-9A
    Vallejo 70.875 Beige-Brown or 70.873 US Field Drab
    Humbrol 98 Chocolate
    Reaper 9220 Olive Skin Shadow*

    AMAPDT¹ "Tropical" aircraft red-brown
    Source: Various Windsock Datafiles, esp. 6, 22
    Methuen/CIElab House Paints and Standards Hobby Paints

    39.71, 31.44, 29.67
    Beauti-Tone Heatwave A10-1-1407-3
    Behr Kalahari Sunset MQ1-24
    Benjamin Moore Toasted Chestnut 2174-10
    BS 444 Terracotta
    Dulux Deep Spice 39YR 11/342
    Dulux Trade Jungle Ginger 50YR 12/406
    Pantone 7587C
    Sherwin-Williams Spicy Hue 8342
    Valspar Jekyll Club Cherokee Road 2011-7
    ?Vallejo 70.818 Red Leather?

    49.7, 24.82, 16.47
    Beauti-Tone Corazon A7-2-0073-3
    Behr Scene Stealer MQ1-22
    Benjamin Moore Colonial Brick 2093-30
    DIN6164 TSD 6-3-3 *
    Dulux Vinland 10YR 22/206
    NCS1950 S 4030-Y80R **
    Pantone 7593U
    RAL 030 50 30 *
    RAL Effect 330-1
    Sherwin-Williams Foxy 6333
    Valspar Savannah Red 1008-7B
    TBD

    45.64, 32.07, 21.6
    Beauti-Tone Cinnamon Spice A9-3-1402-4 *
    Behr Cajun Red PPU2-15
    Benjamin Moore Covered Bridge CC-126
    DIN6164 TSD 7-4-3
    Dulux Charred Clay 30YR 17/341
    FS595c 22144
    NCS1950 S 4040-Y80R *
    Pantone 484U
    Pantone 7524C
    Sherwin-Williams Bold Brick 6327 *
    Valspar Toasted Cranberry 2001-5A
    TBD

    42.21, 36.62, 25.84
    Beauti-Tone Heatwave A10-1-1407-3
    Behr Morocco Red PPU2-17
    Benjamin Moore Country Lane 2088-20 *
    Dulux Downing Street 30YR 14/365
    Pantone 2350U
    Sherwin-Williams Brick Paver 7599
    Valspar La Fonda Antique Red 2002-5A
    ?Vallejo 70.946 Dark Red?

    ¹ = incorrectly labeled as "PC12" in those references.

    Color matching with 1989 Methuen Handbook of Color and Nix Color sensor
    Last edited by ReducedAirFact; 03-21-2022 at 14:26.

  2. #2

    Default

    I was doing some research on PC12 (and whether it was really as red as the colors described above) when I stumbled on the quote above about there being confusion between PC12 (more of a chocolate brown) and AMA Protective Dope Tropical, which was more of a red-oxide color. It's hard to keep up with the changes in thinking on WWI colors! But this does completely change my perception of PC12. Now I'll have to "repaint" a couple of full-color 3D models I did in the more reddish colors to more of a chocolate. And if you've got some British planes painted in the more reddish tones, rest assured that no one really knows with 100% certainty anyway. One of the top color experts in the world (Ray Rimell) had it wrong for decades.

  3. #3

    Default

    Fascinating stuff (as always!) Daryl!

    Many thanks for posting.
    I laugh in the face of danger - then I hide until it goes away!



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