I think a trade in replacement is a novel idea. Also, how about turning in so many upc's from airplane packs to get a deck.Originally Posted by Diamondback
Duel packs were also mentioned in this thread. They should keep them stocked and I also think its about time for Ares to come out with some new/different duel packs.
The Duel Packs are very good but I think more a scenario pack would be even better.
A scenario pack would contain the following:
1x Aircraft + Decks (preferably a new model such as a F.E.2 with Camera or something totally unique like the Hansa-Brandenburg W.29)
3x Ground Targets (models and cards, for the F.E.2 it could be weapons cache, convoy of trucks, for W.29 boats and even a U-Boat for drop off - pick up/supply missions)
1x Scenario rule book (contains several solo play missions + multi-player missions that incorporate current duel packs & other scenario packs)
Dog fights are great but they get boring pretty quick and to expand on the game I more can be done than the same old same old.
This is a great idea!
I also think they should scrap the single packs of aircraft and just release them as Duel Packs, teaming them up with their counterparts.
It makes far more sense than the current release model and you put less popular models with the 'must haves' and thus sorry to say prevents the dead stock problem as die hard fans buy them up.
Actually, If I was the product manager I'd even go as far as putting "Generic" fighters in the Duel Packs, sod putting Brown's Sopwith Camel in there with Richthofen's Fokker Dr.I!! I would put a Sopwith in there with no individual markings and then release Brown's pack with a generic DR.I.
Price for the new "Scenario" packs would be the same as a Duel Packs flat price for everything, everything can be played right out of the box and everything recommends buying the Rules and Expansion Pack to tie them all together.
Another benefit to this model is that retailers will become more inclined to stock it, the boxes are easier to display and unlike the individual aircraft they are a complete package and more likely to sell, if you are left with a few drips and drabs you can just pop them at the cashier and they'll sell themselves...... put a miniature there with no context to go with it and you have dead stock that will sit there till Lucifer Ice skates to work. This is exactly what has happened at my LGS ...the duel packs flew out the door the miniatures to my good fortune sat their unloved.
To the new gamer having some box sets are less intimidating to take the first step in to the game, it was for me ..... hmm rules and accessories pack and a few birds or a duel pack...... duel pack it is! Now increase the concept to ground targets or flying boats.
Oh that's another point
Sorry but WHY?
I get a feeling that some of the models released are really the desire of the game designer, fair enough it's his game and I love him for the amazing game but really those float planes, there is no context to them as stand alone miniatures for anyone first getting in to the game and even less so to those that have no interest in playing that front.
Now if they were released as a scenario pack that would be a whole different matter! That would make them exciting, like I said before I honestly believe that the current product management team have taken it as far as they can.
Ares and anyone else that is part of the product management team, you can have the Scenario Pack idea for free...... I got a lot more ideas where that came from and I'm open to business ops.
I like both the senario- and the "generic"-duelpack ideas but I have just one consern. Everything is aboute business and Ares, just like everyone else, wants to make money more than to please us, allready devoted to the game. Nothing wrong in that.
But the duelpacks have one drawback. As a gamer you can't choose the content. If you are new to the game the duelpacks are perfect but when you are 10-15 ACs into the game it's a different matter.
You might ending up buying the same Ac you allready have 2 or 3 of just to get the one you want. Well, good for Ares but not for you. I think that just this might make some customers think twice before buying a new set. I think that duelpacks are a good thing but I don't think that they can replace the single-Ac box.
The idea with senarioboxes are a different matter. If Ares would do them as you sugested, James, they will have a single AC with a "mission" and that is allways a good thing.
Why would you keep buying the same AC's? All I am suggesting is that Ares just makes Duel Packs with each new series.
So take the new series 8 lineup in a duel pack you would get a Macchi M.5 vs Phonix D.I. if you wanted all of them you just buy 3 Duel Packs, if you only wanted a certain plane then you buy the Duel Pack with that plane in it (although you will get its counterpart). In no way am i suggesting a system similar to F-Toy's where you don't know what you are getting, everything is labeled up and viewable just like the current Duel Packs.
I'm just suggesting a sales model that pleases everyone, Distributors, retailers, beginners and veterans.
10-15 AC's in..... did you only just start playing the game this weekend???(Just joking)
Last edited by FarEast; 11-16-2014 at 23:28.
I didn't mean that you would have to buy blind. But if you want to combine, say, Ac1 to Ac5 in a series, that combo just might not be for sale. If you want the same freedom in combining ACs from one series (or from different series for that matter) as you have now Ares would have to do 6 packs for every AC. That means 36 packs for every series instead of 12 as today. I can't see why Ares would want to do that.Why would you keep buying the same AC's? All I am suggesting is that Ares just makes Duel Packs with each new series.
So take the new series 8 lineup in a duel pack you would get a Macchi M.5 vs Phonix D.I. if you wanted all of them you just buy 3 Duel Packs, if you only wanted a certain plane then you buy the Duel Pack with that plane in it (although you will get its counterpart). In no way am i suggesting a system similar to F-Toy's where you don't know what you are getting, everything is labeled up and viewable just like the current Duel Packs.
I'm just suggesting a sales model that pleases everyone, Distributors, retailers, beginners and veterans.
10-15 AC's in..... did you only just start playing the game this weekend???
I bought 18 Guynemer Spad VII and I might end up buying a few more.
It's the collector/modeler side of the game.
I simply needed Spad VII for the Italian Front as I most play this front: WWI it's not all about Flanders.
Also, I bought more than a dozen of Aviatiks and Albatros D.II just to have a counter part.
A thing Ares could do, to help new and veteran players, should be labelling the A/C box with a simple Early War - Middle War - Late War tag. I would even go farther adding the Front where the actual released miniatures saw actions.
Just like the Flames of War box sets.
Float planes ... I love them.
And I get quickly bored to play with überplanes ...
Yeas but that is sort of my Point. You wanted 18 SPADs but what about the 18 Albatrosses you'd had to buy along with them. Would you have bought the SPADs anyway?I bought 18 Guynemer Spad VII and I might end up buying a few more.
It's the collector/modeler side of the game.
I simply needed Spad VII for the Italian Front as I most play this front: WWI it's not all about Flanders.
Also, I bought more than a dozen of Aviatiks and Albatros D.II just to have a counter part.
A thing Ares could do, to help new and veteran players, should be labelling the A/C box with a simple Early War - Middle War - Late War tag. I would even go farther adding the Front where the actual released miniatures saw actions.
Just like the Flames of War box sets.
Float planes ... I love them.
And I get quickly bored to play with überplanes ...
I'm not that sure that's the case for everyone.
Of course not ... THAT is the point with the fixed duel pack.
What if Ares would have included a Fokker xxx in the Spad VII duel pack? They would have lost my money
The duel pack it's an easy way to introduce new players into the game.
That is why Ares should manage to keep these in stock and, maybe, release a few new more.
But then, releasing single boxes possibly at a quicker rate, is the only way, in my opinion, to keep players IN.
That is exactly how I see it.
All this just goes to show that in a game as diverse as ours is becoming, with so many of us having different requirements to fill our particular niche, there is no way that Ares can satisfy everyone. Therefore, they should focus on the need to attract new players to the game, and blow the rest of us. We will get by one way or the other. We usually do.
Rob.
"Courage is the art of being the only one who knows you're scared to death."
I do not need a damage pack, a ruler, etc. etc. in every pack I buy.
And I'm not terribly keen to have someone else deciding which aircraft I should use against which.
Ditto
Just to keep this thread on track...
If selling a single manoeuverdeck isn't good business for Ares perhaps selling sets are.
What about selling them in stacks of ..say... 4. (A,B,C,D ) and (F,H,I,J) and so on. Perhaps arrange them if fighter- and twoseater-sets?
Or as a complet set. One of each. (A-V)
Last edited by LOOP; 11-17-2014 at 02:07.
I can't see ARES ever selling everything in duel packs - doing so restricts what we can buy. The notion of lumbering less good sellers with good ones would drive the majority mad. Really there shouldn't be any duds in any set of three if they released the right colour schemes. They have already stated that they want to move to a position of more flexibility not less so they can release what they want without being tied into releasing 12 models in one go. In this position they could keep a core of the popular types on the shelves and do the weird and wonderful as special releases. They could for example do limited editions.
Extra decks would be a great idea and to be honest I can't see it harming their sales that much since there is a relatively small number that make models opposed to buying the official miniatures. Perhaps they will come when they can keep a good range of models in supply. For example, making SE5 decks available right now will only encourage folks to seek SE5s elsewhere. Unless of course this is part of their master plan to keep driving sales which would be grossly unfair in my view.
Getting Ares to reprint the N-deck without reprinting the SE5 first. Well I can't see that happening. I wouldn't do it if I were in their shoes.
But releasing decks that allready been made by Ares. Well that's another matter.
We can just hope..
My point exactly Rob, I'm happy with the single packs but in reality they do not attract new players or stockists and it has limited the exposure of the game. Retailers need floor space and a lot of it if they really want to push the product but that also requires a solid investment on their part.
If Ares went the dual pack way I'd get by no problems at all most of us here buy 1 of every release so the dual packs won't effect them.
Rulers, rules, cards with every purchase again will not effect sales, look at X-wing I have a bizillion tokens, dials and cards for all the bloody miniatures I own, I kept what was needed the rest went to a communal pot for club games and the rest in the bin.
Ive come to the game very late but I really think the current model for bringing fresh blood to the game and its longlivity is broken. These are just my ideas from experience both within the industry as a maker and also having worked the retail side in visual merchandising. I'm now a teacher so now "I know nothing"
Mayby I am being a bit naive. But to be able to get hold of new decks would be handy. at leased give me that
Per-Gunnar I totally agree with you getting extra decks will be handy. (I was lucky enough to be able to buy all the booster packs from Xen here on the forums, plus Watch Your Back and Flight of Giants. Trying to hunt down Famous Aces and Burning Drachens now to complete it all.)
what a lot of people don't realise is that its the fresh blood that really drives the games ability to develop and introduce new aspects. Like I mentioned before Games Workshop retailers is ALL about capturing the fresh blood, they really do not cater for veterans when it comes to table time or customer service in the stores, they make no secret of it either but those that have been around GW products for sometime realise and understand that its beneficial to them in the long term. GW had some amazing games that basically died off because at the time they didn't really understand how the market worked.
At the end of the day, we can harp on about how this aircraft could perform this or that maneuver, or how its firing arcs gave it better firepower than that plane, but at the end of the day for a game to do well it needs to be non-threatening. When I first joined GW it was ALL about the individual blister packs..... now it's all about the pre-selected units, you can play an army straight from the box now rather than purchase 50+ individual miniatures..... I actually remember when they first released the plastic Space Marine box set - those flew out the door so fast they had sold out on the first day.
Does that happen with Wings of Glory? Well with some models yes, others no. So buy introducing Scenario Packs and Duel Packs you can cater to everyone, the obscure aircraft get paired up with a high damned aircraft and that way you please the masses and also those in the sidelines.
For me if I was just thinking short term and my own personal needs the miniatures would be sold in packs of 3, unpainted and with a selection of decals that way I can have exactly what I want.
I'm not sure I follow the logic from Duel Packs are good for getting new blood into the game (which I agree with) to everything should be in Duel Packs (which seems counter-intuitive to me).
My experience is as someone who encountered the game for the first time this year; having rejected table top gaming 20 years earlier after long, but unsatisfactory, acquaintance .
I now have 51 different aircraft, and a handful duplicates. That is how good I think this product is.
I don't recognise the experience some people have described of model unavailability; although some that I wanted took a little searching most were immediately and easily available.
I've also discovered as a result any number of friends who have invested in the game in a casual way, often with a Duel Pack and then, perhaps, a handful of other models; occasionally with R&A and then a few models.
It seems to me that Duel Pack did the job. Perhaps more of them might convince others to do the same; after all you don't want a group of friends all with the same aircraft.
I also note that Bombers do already come with a collection of ground targets and scenarios.
Ground targets are also in the R&A.
Perhaps there is some value in extending that to the two-seater planes....?
Fox,
You're looking at this purely as a gamer, but take a look at your purchase history.... how often out of 51 aircraft did you purchase a 1 off aircraft? I started in June this year and have close to 90 aircraft from Ares/Nexus and that doesn't include booster packs or add on packs from WOW, nor the huge amount of shapeways and Valom kits.
I can tell you now that none of my purchases were of single aircraft and I would hazard a guess that neither were yours (unless they were rare aircraft that you had to sources that way) and i would also hazard a guess judging from the posts here on the forums that neither do the majority here. So why would doubling up aircraft (different Aircraft) in Duel Packs be counter Intuitive for both new players and older players, as a person that is dedicated to the game how many of the wave 8 and wave 9 will you purchase, 1 aircraft, 1 of each? 2, 6 or all of them?
when players first get in to the game they aren't looking at anything but the pretty airplanes in the box, its why Ares switched from cards to miniatures so why not offer a much larger selection for first time buyers of what they can chose from.
My purchase history went like this:
Purchased 1st duel pack
Purchased the 2nd duel pack
Purchases 3 Sopwith Camels + 3 Albatros
If they had bundled 1 camel and 1 albtros of each type in a Duel Pack, I would have bought 3 more duel packs - plane and simple. (pun intended)
Now here's the funny thing, my Japanese LGS bundles them as sets - I can't just buy 1 camel or 1 albatros on its own, I have to buy all three..... did that stop me? Nope actually buying it as a three pack made it slightly cheaper, so already I'm already purchasing as sets rather than individuals..... But why did they do this? Because they were fed up of 1 or 2 planes from each series just sitting there year in year out, they still have NOS Wings of War aircraft, booster packs and add on packs in the wrapper just sitting there - I got my SE.5's there and a few other ultra rare aircraft. But if they had packed them together then they wouldn't have this dead stock.
At the end of the day this is all very hypothetical, ARES nor the Game designers are going to change how it works, why? Because they are happy with the status quo, why fix something that isn't broken and lets face it, it's not actually broken. We just can't have exactly what we want, when we want it and hey maybe that's not a bad thing
But the main point to making everything a duel pack is this..... Right now you can not get either the Rules or Accessories pack nor the current Duel Packs for love or money, so if a shop no longer has the MAIN game but lots of miniatures how is that going to bring new blood to the game? It can't, it grinds to a halt, plain and simple - then retailers have a problem, the first wave of miniatures sells fast as the established gaming crowd purchases everything, so do they order more in the hope they can sell even though the R&A Pack and Duel Packs are out of stock with no word of when they will be republished, or do they clear the floor space for something else?
They clear the floor space for something else, plain and simple, because dead stock makes no money and if a product isn't making you money then its costing you money.
Last edited by FarEast; 11-17-2014 at 07:14.
They are trying to keep the duel packs stocked at all times and the SPAD XIII/Albatros is still in stock at the warehouse last time I checked. I've also suggested that they should change the paint schemes in each duel pack reprint to completely new ones each time. That would ensure all us long time players would buy them
I've still got the RAP and one of the duel packs in stock. In fact, I've got lots of the SPAD XIII duel packs on hand. From the pricing points, I don't think Ares could actually offer everything in duel pack format. I'm pretty sure they take a decent hit on profit margin with the duel packs, but as you say, they are aimed at the new player and they can expect to recover that profit loss by additional sales by the new player.
Your scenario pack idea is interesting, not sure if the price point could be kept reasonable though. I can only really see this type product for the less mainstream planes, and those already sell worse then straight up fighters. Add to their costs and I'm not sure the mass majority of players would pay for them. They have made a little move in that direction with the new WGS heavy bombers. The Dam Buster Lanc has special targets and even special rules with it to fly those specific missions.
There is also a campaign system/products in the works, but development is slower then they would like.
I'll close by saying that the current production manager is definitely open to new and better ways of doing things. We talk several times a month about possible ways to improve the product line and game. They just have to deal with a lot of "bandwidth" restrictions on design, production, and even administrative time. The company has more games then it has employees... really, they do.
Well, obviously I'm looking a purchasing patterns of customers based on what I know about the purchase patterns of the customers I know.
I'm also looking at from the point of view of someone who's wife has a one man band manufacturing and retail business in a niche area.
And also as a senior software developer for the third largest software company in the world, writing planning and costing analysis for manufacturing and chain of supply.
They all give me both insight and bias.
As I said, I am not specifically a gamer. I don't generally play table top games or board games. This is a complete exception for me.
I'm aware this makes me atypical of both the enthusiasts on this forum, and the more casual purchasers.
Indeed, most of the people I know who have bought small amount of the game are, more generically, gamers, with investments in all sorts of table top and board games.
As you said, almost never, unless I found one I couldn't find elsewhere.
But I was looking at purchase history, and I bet you Ł10 to a stale doughnut that they were not bought in the pairings the one might anticipate as Duel Packs.
For example, looking at my most recent purchases, I bought two Fokker D.VIIs in the order.
I'm assuming these would be paired with the Snipes; but I don't much care for them, and I don't think I'd have purchased at all if that had been the choice.
I'm not sure I follow that logic. Duel Packs don't appear to be the solution to unpopular models.
Surely you would just end selling the Duel Packs that are most popular, and be left with the ones that are least popular.
That is illustrated by the fact that you can still pick up the Spad vs Albatross Pack relatively easily [it's on Amazon right now, for instance], but that the Camel vs Dr.1 Pack is really much harder to find [although I did just buy it recently].
BTB: Do Ares make stockist take every plane in the range in equal numbers?
...which is my point. A lot of your points are about stockists, and possibly stockists of a particular size or type.
And again, the lack of availability of the best selling items doesn't feel like an argument to me to change the whole range to that format.
It seems like a need to produce more of those items, and possibly, if the flexibility is required, of few more in that format. But that is all.
Not to my knowledge. I could order 150 Fokker D.VIIs and only 2 Snipes if I wanted to. The real problem comes when all the D.VIIs have sold out and there are only Snipes and 2 seaters left in the warehouse. At that point (at least in the past), we had to wait for the other three types to sellout before a reprint was ordered. Roberto has said that a single plane reprint is technically possible, but at a higher cost. Sometime in the next year I guess we will get to see if they will exercise that option with the D.VII selling out way before the other 3 planes (again)
3 more duel packs... or 3 duel packs to replace the 3 Camel/Albatros singles you bought?
And can your order which of the D.VIIs you wanted?
I didn't spot this before, but the current pairing is Camel vs Dr.1 not Albatos.
So you wouldn't have been able to make your purchase.
Yes, but this has been made easier in the recent releases as well. Before WGF Series 6 (pretty sure that was the one), each different aircraft came in a display box that contained three of each paint job for a single type. I think through normal distributorship, stores had to order a full display box. I've always been able to order just 1 or 2 of a paint scheme if that is all I needed (very rarely was that the case though), but I deal with Ares directly (still via the US warehouse though). The releases after that have come in cases of 24 of one paint job per plane type. Not only does this allow retail stores to order exactly what they need, but it cuts down on packaging costs now that the pretty inner box is gone.
"If" like I said hypothetically if they had put all the DV.a in Duel packs matched up with camels I would have bought all the Duel packs containing them, if they had gone the way they currently have with the DVa's with the SPAD I would have made an even bigger purchase, as I would have also bought all the Camels as well with the DR.1.If they had bundled 1 camel and 1 albtros of each type in a Duel Pack, I would have bought 3 more duel packs - plane and simple. (pun intended)
Keith, do you also have a brick and mortar retail front?
Anyway I've pitched my ideas good or for bad my ideas are really about drawing new blood in to the game with pretty much zero regard for established gamers (price points included) as this approach has worked very well for countless other companies from GW to FFG, Ares seem to have their ideas and are running with them and at the end of the day that all that matters.
Sorry, James; I didn't express myself well.
I understood that you had expressed a hypothetical, only that I hadn't noticed that angle on my first response.
If we're looking at new blood and perhaps younger gamers on limited budgets then the models in single packs make an ideal way to add to your collection a little at a time. In the UK a single seater can be bought for Ł10.80 and two seaters about Ł15 - rather more expensive than in the US but that's what comes with living on a small damp foggy island. Duel packs are about Ł20 so each time a more significant purchase.
The ideal position for ARES would be to get each tooling set-up so they can produce exactly what they want when they want it without having to consider other models in the series. I'd suggest that there are duds in some releases is down to poor colour scheme choices. I have no idea but I suspect single seaters outsell two seaters by a considerable margin and ideally they need to get into a position where they can meet the demand for the core models that the new blood (and old hands) are always going to want. I'd much prefer to see a new colour scheme released each month or perhaps three every quarter. That kind of schedule probably isn't practical but it would keep the interest bubbling constantly.
If I were them I'd also look at one off limited editions that could sell out really quickly – miss them and they are all sold… Perhaps this will come in the future. They could work their way through squadrons and Jasta. It will certainly be interesting to see how they handle future series when they run out of types to pair up in their releases of four at a time.
The only multiple packs I'd like to see would be sets of models from the same unit, perhaps three or four models would be a good number. I can but dream…
So you don't currently own one of each paint scheme from Series 1?
Looking at the Series 1 planes (since that is what is in the current duel sets), under your idea they could have offered 6 different duel sets without creating more paint schemes. So regardless of duel set or single packs, the most planes you can get either way is 12... which any collector type would buy regardless of how it was offered to them. I think from a consumer's point of view, duel packs do not offer anything over singles and just add limitations on selection and initial price.
I do agree with you 100% that they need to come up with a better way of grabbing new players. They tried this with the duel packs vs. the old deluxe sets. They have also make an effort to bring the initial buy in price way down. Perhaps a scenario based (smaller) deluxe set would work better?
No brick and mortar store here... only dealing in Wings and Sails could not support such a thing. One of my best friends and room mates for several years does own and run the largest game store in town though.
All ideas are good ones, as they all lead to different lines of thought
No problem, its great we can bounce these ideas off each other hopefully Ares will cherry pick what works for them. Just for the record I'd happily pay more for a "scenario" pack than a Duel Pack if done well
100% agree with this.
Not so much with this. I would have been sad to join the game to learn there were some limited edition minis that I missed out on. Even the non-limited edition minis were going for $70+ on eBay, I would hate to know that they would be going for if we all knew they were never to be printed again.
All new plane types for duel packs would be great but this is what I had in mind with changing up the paint schemes in the current duel packs.
I started with a deluxe set. 4 ACs and all you needed to get going. Both me and my son was immediatly hooked and flew dogfight on dogfight. Recently I recomeneded WoG to a friend and she bought a duelpack and a R&A to her son.
The result was that they flew around the table not hitting anything. The one against one senario is not a great way to start WoG. She bought 2 more planes but the
damage was allready done. Now the game lay dead in the box.
I don't know why Ares don't do the Delux set any more but I guess that it didn't go financially. I might be wrong but the one by one senarios is not that fun for the beginner.
There is just that extra action if there is 2 extra ACs in the air.
Or maybe the game wasn't their cup of tea?
As avid fans we all believe that everyone is going to instantly love the game and go out and buy it or if they do, get hooked like us! I have a German co-worker that played a few games, really enjoyed it, I gave him the link to the forums, everything...... he has yet to buy a single plane nor has he recently show any interest in playing at work.
My point was only that if WoG shall be able to compete with computergames and every other medea out there it must relay its potential at the first try.
The one on one can get boring really quick if you are unfamilliar with the gamemechanics.
Mayby it's more up to retailer to do what yours did. Pair up duelpacks with 2 extra ACs to create a "Delux"-set.
A duelpack would have been enough to hook me but I'm not that certain that it would have hooked my son. But adding the second plane did its jobb well.
I believe that to re-intruduce a 4 Aircraft-starter kit is one (already tested I know) way to go.
Last edited by LOOP; 11-18-2014 at 07:56.
I'd agree with LOOP. One on one doesn't make for a good game once you have worked out a certain tactic.
I think they have to get the boxed rules back out there and the Deluxe set would appear to be a great way to get new players into the game. I think it's a lost leader for them but one that has to be worthwhile in the long term.
A agree with that completely, Tim and Per-Gunnar.
But, what about separate decks? We are missing that issue. And we need separate decks.
Heмaњa, sadly I think we will never see stand alone decks again in my own honest opinion, it flies in the face of everything Ares did when switching to miniatures.
I suspect it'll come down to those needing extra decks buying a model in a box and offering the plane to the repainters here. I think the ARES business model is like HP with their printers - they make their money on the consumables, in our case the decks of cards that happen to come at a price.
I do think that they are losing money by not offering just decks. Those that just want the cards and not the minis will go elsewhere, or will come up with other solutions. But... how much money are they loosing to that? Enough to warrant the expense of production and tracking extra inventory items? Or would they lose more money by allowing people to get decks without buying miniatures? You'd really have to know the sales figures and production costs to make a business case.
Production costs for just decks would have to be a lot cheaper than producing minis (no re-tooling of production lines, etc), and you can see from trolling eBay that at least some people are willing to pay $10 for out-of-print booster packs. It'd be interesting to put together a business case... but you'd need a lot more information that I just don't have.
It occurs to me there was a chap selling movement templates for Wings of Glory on E-bay.
He seems to have stopped selling them.
I wonder if Ares contacted him about copyright infringement, or if they just weren't selling.
I know that cards are often the most expensive part of any game. For some unknown (at least to me) reason, full color press printing is still very expensive. Think of how many millions of the basic Bicycle player card decks are produced every year... and they still retail for several bucks each.
The old booster packs used to retail for $10 if I remember correctly... so 6+ years later they have not gone up in demand for the general public. It's only the hard core builders and painters we have on sites like this one that need extra decks.
The mechanics of the card/template maneuver system is not something that can be copyrighted here in the US. So I would have to think they just did not sell well. They are not something I'd make and sell in the AA store.
I would really go for a new 'starter' 4 plane set with all new paint schemes (There are even a couple MVR Dr.I schemes not yet produced!). Also I would be in for the duel sets if they went with unique schemes. I know a lot are opposed to 'limited' paint schemes, but virtually all paint schemes, and consumer products generally, are limited production to some extent. Everything stops being made sometime, so best take advantage of the situation by putting out more variety to hook collectors and garner those extra sales. Anything that helps keep planes 'in print' is good for the game.
You mean these things Keith? Hahahahaha
A freind of mine that worked in Vegas was telling me why that is,they remain so expensive is also because there are 52 unique cards in each deck.... they are an utter pain in the arse to manufacture and each one must meet a very high QA.
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