Sneak peak, new Aerodrome Accessories product

**Oberst Hajj** · 05-19-2010 00:04

Hey all, I've got several new products in development for Aerodrome Accessories. One of the ones I'm working on right now is some custom Flight Control Boards. These would be made out of the same 1/8 plexi that I use for the flight bases and special damage markers. If they weigh more then I would like them to, I'll do them out of 1/16 plexi.

These are just the first two layouts I'm playing around with...

Layout 1
201mm x 150mm

The 7 circles across the top of this one are for the Wings of War WWI counters. The one on far left is used to keep track of your last maneuver type (steep, climb, etc.) The next three would be used to keep track of any special damages like smoke or fire. The last three are for keeping track of gun jams. All 7 of these would be slightly recessed so that the counters would stay in place.

The Fuel gauge is the same size as the altitude dial on the flight stands. In the final version, the Fuel gauge will go up to 20. This should allow plenty of room for everyone to use their own house rules for fuel if they like. The gauge will use the same peg system as the flight stands ans will include the smaller top dial to keep track of altitude counters (climb rates).

The two areas labeled Ace Skills and Maneuvers will be slits cut all the way through the base. This will allow you to stand your cards up in them. This will same space while still allowing you to see the cards you selected. The Ace Skill slots will work in conjunction with some Ace Skill cards I am looking into producing.

The 4 card outlines at the bottom, from left to right, are: Plane stat card (slightly recessed), Maneuver deck, damage taken, damage +1 taken.

All of the symbols and text would be laser etched into the plastic as well.

Layout 2
250mm x 150mm

This second layout has all of the same features, but I've also added a location to keep your ammo cards if using limited ammo rules. I've still playing with the placement of everything to get the overall size of the control board right on this one.

The official card stock boards that come in the boxed sets measure 194mm x 194mm. That puts mine a little wider, but also not as deep. This should take up less of your playing area on the game table.

If you have any suggestions about the layout, adding or removing something, or anything at all, please feel free to post them. I've not decided on what color(s) I will be making these in, but I'm leaning towards just the dark gray tinted plastic like the smoke and dials I already produce.

This is your chance to influence the design of products you want, so speak up!

**Katipunero** · 05-19-2010 01:58

Col Hajj, what if the altitude meter and "air speed" are also incorporated in the flight control board to simulate a simple flight cockpit? it's not just for aesthetics purposes but it's also for functional purposes. just my 2 Afghani worth.

off topic, any chance of the flight pegs being sold and included in the flight stand? those gimbal mounts are really tempting.

**Oberst Hajj** · 05-19-2010 02:04

I thought about putting the altitude dial on here as well, but left it off after thinking it was better to have it on the mini's base for all to see. But that only works if the players are using either my stands, or adding pegs to the official stand. I'll keep it in mind and I'd like to hear what others think about it as well.

As for the pegs, I've got that project in the works as well. It's not any where near completion though.

**Katipunero** · 05-19-2010 03:17

any chance of a plastic ruler as well simulating tracer rounds? hehehe

looking forward to those pegs... a complete flight stand with gimbal mount... hopefully soon before i demob from here.

**Flying Officer Kyte** · 05-19-2010 11:34

Hi Col.
I can't seem to get the image. I have never had any problems on the site before. All the other pics are coming up O.K. Any ideas?
Rob.

**bumblie3** · 05-19-2010 13:12

I prefer the second layout, Col. In the first layout, if folks are clumsy like me they are bound to wind up, sooner or later, folding or creasing the maneuver and ace cards, reaching over them to get at, or placing, the counters.

Just my opinion.

The concept is great.

John.

VonHope · 05-19-2010 16:39

I also perfer 2nd layout Col.

**Oberst Hajj** · 05-19-2010 21:35

Thanks for the feed back guys. I took a quick moment this evening and rearranged the first layout:

Layout 4

Do you guys still prefer Layout 2? If so, why is that? Is it the added place for ammo cards? Do you have any ideas on what could fill up some of the dead space on the left on that one (besides the logo)?

**Oberst Hajj** · 05-19-2010 21:37

Okay, after take a moment to actually look at this new layout, I think it will still have the same problems. I need to move the card holders to the top like in layout 2. The counters can stay at the bottom with the card decks in the center.

**Greywolf** · 05-20-2010 02:14

nice work Col Hajj

are these going to be done as a PDF to download?

Cheers
GW

**bumblie3** · 05-20-2010 02:46

Originally Posted by Col. Hajj

Okay, after take a moment to actually look at this new layout, I think it will still have the same problems. I need to move the card holders to the top like in layout 2. The counters can stay at the bottom with the card decks in the center.

I still like 2, but, if the cards are moved to the top of the board, then 3 would work fine. As I said before, my concern is creasing or folding the upright cards if you have to reach over them to get at other decks or counters. I know me, and sooner or later I would catch the cards with a sleeve and, probably chuck the whole board all over the table, if I had to reach over the cards. I just think aesthetically 'pretty' isn't necessarily practical, but from your comments, Keith, I'm pretty sure you've already taken that on board.

In any event, thanks for the great work.

Cheers,

John.

**bumblie3** · 05-20-2010 03:06

Thinking about it some more, the 3rd board would save on size, as it doesn't accommodate the ammo deck. I took the liberty of juggling in accordance with what I think you were suggesting? I have tried to attach it and hope it works!
I felt you just HAD to retain the WoW Aerodrome logo, even if it is tiny...

John.

**Oberst Hajj** · 05-20-2010 03:08

Originally Posted by Greywolf

nice work Col Hajj

are these going to be done as a PDF to download?

Cheers
GW

These are going to made out of tinted plastic, like my smoke markers.

**Oberst Hajj** · 05-20-2010 03:42

Using my mad MS Paint skills, I came up with this one...

John, you laid it out just like I was thinking on the smaller one.

**bumblie3** · 05-20-2010 03:52

Hi Col.
I hope you didn't mind my attempt? I think I still prefer 3 with the cards along the top, but I can see that a lot of people will see the provision for the ammo deck as an essential. If it doesn't make the board over large, what about 6 cards side by side on the top edge, 5 decks below with fuel marker alongside and counters and logo on the bottom line. This would possibly reduce the board height at the expense of width?

John.

**Oberst Hajj** · 05-20-2010 04:04

I don't mind at all! Doing 5 cards across might not be a bad idea. That would give enough room to add an altitude dial to the other side, since not everyone would be using bases with altitude dials on them. I personally would rather have the FCB wider then higher.

**bumblie3** · 05-20-2010 04:34

This is just a stab, and you could reduce the logo to let the altitude dial fit. I'm not sure I've scaled everything right. It just me dabbling. Hope it helps.

John.

**Oberst Hajj** · 05-20-2010 04:38

I was thinking about taking what you posted in post #12, adding another card on the right hand side and placing another dial above that.

**bumblie3** · 05-20-2010 04:42

I like that idea Keith, it will still be fairly compact, and everything will be there. My last stab did feel a bit clumsy.

John.

**Oberst Hajj** · 05-20-2010 08:25

Layout 5

**Katipunero** · 05-20-2010 08:39

Originally Posted by bumblie3

This is just a stab, and you could reduce the logo to let the altitude dial fit. I'm not sure I've scaled everything right. It just me dabbling. Hope it helps.

John.

John and Col. Hajj,

not to hijack anyone's work, I just re-arranged it and here's my small contribution. The other fuel gauge would be the altitude meter if Col. Hajj do decide to put one.

**Katipunero** · 05-20-2010 09:00

Col. Hajj,

Layout 5 is way much better than my suggested layout.

**bumblie3** · 05-20-2010 09:14

Originally Posted by Col. Hajj

Layout 5

Hi Col,

Considering all the efforts, including Kookie's contribution, I have to say I do think layout 5 hits the spot for me.

It's got everything needed and its aesthecally 'pretty'. I'd definitely go with this.

John.

**Oberst Hajj** · 05-20-2010 09:17

Originally Posted by bumblie3

Hi Col,

Considering all the efforts, including Kookie's contribution, I have to say I do think layout 5 hits the spot for me.

It's got everything needed and its aesthecally 'pretty'. I'd definitely go with this.

John.

Originally Posted by Katipunero

Col. Hajj,

Layout 5 is way much better than my suggested layout.

Yeah, I'm liking #5 as well.

**Greywolf** · 05-20-2010 14:50

Originally Posted by Col. Hajj

These are going to made out of tinted plastic, like my smoke markers.

awesome look forward to seeing them made.
still got to order some of those markers and bases you have made dam good work....

Cheers
LGW

**Flying Officer Kyte** · 05-27-2010 01:08

Hi Col.
Layout five does it for me as well.
Rob.

**Rick57** · 05-27-2010 06:08

I echo Rob. Layout 5 is my favorite.

Way to go Gentlemen. Co-creating something useful at its best.

Cheers,
Rick

**Bixby** · 05-27-2010 08:42

Looks Good and #5 is the winner for me as well.

Xargos · 05-27-2010 10:23

Hi Col,

Great idea, this dashboard. Can't wait to use it!

I agree that layout #5 is the best design. I would humbly suggest very nit-picky modifications about it though:

1) I would put the maneuver deck area to the immediate right of the plane card (which is currently occupied by the ammo card area) since conceptually the maneuver deck (and its type) is directly related to the plane type.

2) Since the ammo rule is optional and not used by all players (I guess), I would move its card area to the extreme right (the current +1 damage card area), so that all "hard rules" concepts (plane type, maneuver, damage cards) are stringed together.

3) The private/public information dilemma. The special damage and gun jammed counters are PUBLIC information for other players, but here the standing cards (current maneuvers and ace skills) might somewhat hide them for other players' view. At the same time (correct me if I'm wrong) the fuel level is PRIVATE information, but it is shown in plain sight at the front of your dashboard layout... My critic is not very constructive though, because I can't imagine a solution to this, except maybe by putting the counters along a column on one side of the dashboard, but then that would break the current pleasant symmetry...

Just my two cents,

Pascal

Xargos · 05-27-2010 14:07

Also, it could be practical if the card slots for the standing cards were wide and thick enough to accomodate the mini european card sleeves from Fantasy Flight Games, for those who use them.

http://store.fantasyflightgames.com/....cfm?SKU=FFS02

**Oberst Hajj** · 05-27-2010 21:41

Originally Posted by Xargos

Hi Col,

Great idea, this dashboard. Can't wait to use it!

I agree that layout #5 is the best design. I would humbly suggest very nit-picky modifications about it though:

1) I would put the maneuver deck area to the immediate right of the plane card (which is currently occupied by the ammo card area) since conceptually the maneuver deck (and its type) is directly related to the plane type.

2) Since the ammo rule is optional and not used by all players (I guess), I would move its card area to the extreme right (the current +1 damage card area), so that all "hard rules" concepts (plane type, maneuver, damage cards) are stringed together.

I had thought about that as well, but then the "ammo cards" would be right next to the damage you have taken cards... this could lead to some mixing of the two... I thought it would be better to separate them to avoid this. Function over form as it were.

3) The private/public information dilemma. The special damage and gun jammed counters are PUBLIC information for other players, but here the standing cards (current maneuvers and ace skills) might somewhat hide them for other players' view. At the same time (correct me if I'm wrong) the fuel level is PRIVATE information, but it is shown in plain sight at the front of your dashboard layout... My critic is not very constructive though, because I can't imagine a solution to this, except maybe by putting the counters along a column on one side of the dashboard, but then that would break the current pleasant symmetry...

Just my two cents,

Pascal

Again this was do to function. Putting the counters up top and the dials at the bottom would have increased the chances of either bending the up right cards when messing with the counters or bumping the dials. While fuel level is mostly a private thing, almost every pilot know the rough engagement time of enemy aircraft. If you truly wanted to hide this, I guess one could fold a piece of paper and slide it under the FCB so that it hid the Fuel dial some.

Originally Posted by Xargos

Also, it could be practical if the card slots for the standing cards were wide and thick enough to accomodate the mini european card sleeves from Fantasy Flight Games, for those who use them.

http://store.fantasyflightgames.com/....cfm?SKU=FFS02

The card slots are going to be 1mm wide... this is wider then the actual cards, so I'm pretty sure the card holders would fit as well. Feel free to measure one and let me know.

**Rick57** · 05-28-2010 09:17

My Dear Colonel,

Had a thought yesterday..... It would be a terrific idea if you could drill three little holes somewhere to hold the unused altitude flight pegs for each plane.

A tray to hold them would be too hard to craft/ unstable and they could easily scatter in a game.

Holes would be nice. Either tiny enough to accomodate the male end -OR big enough to accomodate the opposite end?

Cheers,
Rick

**Oberst Hajj** · 05-28-2010 14:15

Not a bad idea Rick. What do the rest of you guys think about that? I could extend the right hand side just enough to put a series of holes down that edge to hold several flight pegs. I'd do a larger hole as not to risk breaking off the small male ends.

**Oberst Hajj** · 05-28-2010 16:49

Here is layout 6, which includes the holes for the flight pegs.

**bumblie3** · 05-29-2010 00:20

Blimey, Col, are you looking ahead to a supersonic jets release? These guys will need space suits....

Mind you I haven't seen the stats for WWII bombers, particularly the B29. How many flight pegs will be supplied with those, do you know?

No, seriously, it looks neat and it doesn't do any harm to have more holes than you need. Who knows what future gadgets might fit?

Its fine by me,

John.

**Oberst Hajj** · 05-29-2010 01:44

Well, for those that play with the pegs for altitude, this layout is still shy of covering 0 to max altitude for some of the WWI scout planes! Besides, I might as well use up the space.

**bumblie3** · 05-29-2010 02:00

'Nuff said.

John.

**Flying Officer Kyte** · 06-01-2010 02:19

I'm O.K. with it.
Rob.

**Guntruck** · 06-02-2010 01:33

Looks good to me.

**Oberst Hajj** · 06-09-2010 21:36

I should have the first prototype of the new FCB in my hand some time this week. I did a little more tweaking as I got to thinking that it was not as useful for Dawn of War. So, I added the two small squares down in the lower right for the fast and slow speed counters. I had to remove two of the peg holders, but I did not think that was a big deal

Layout 7

The altitude dial on the right is going to have the same dials that are on my bases:

I was just going to use a blank dial identical to the medium gray dial in that drawing, except with out the climb rate numbers on it. However, if anyone can think of some other aspect of the game we could use another dial for, I can add numbers or letters to to the top of it and include the small pointer on top of it as well. Any thoughts?

**Bixby** · 06-09-2010 22:01

Excited to see these go production...

**Oberst Hajj** · 06-09-2010 23:03

Okay, thinking about these more, would it make more sense to produce a WoW and a DoW version? WoW uses a 3 card movement system while DoW uses a 2 card system. DoW also does not use cards for damage/ammo or have jams. Also, fuel and altitude could be different between the two as well.

**bumblie3** · 06-09-2010 23:50

As far as I'm concerned Keith, the layout in post 40 has got it nailed. It allows me to do everything I want.
John

**Flying Officer Kyte** · 06-10-2010 00:20

The overall layout is superb. I just can't wait to get my hands on it.
Rob.

**Oberst Hajj** · 06-10-2010 00:57

So, you guys can't think of any thing to use the extra dials for?

**Flying Officer Kyte** · 06-10-2010 01:03

Not off the top of my head Col. I will work on it.
Rob.

**Guntruck** · 06-10-2010 01:04

The layout in post 40 is ideal for those who play WoW and DoW, as you don't have to buy different boards for each game. Having said that, if it is viable then I would prefer to see a 'tailor-made' WoW board.

**Oberst Hajj** · 06-10-2010 04:52

I can easily make one for each system. If I did that, the one showed in post #34 would be the Wings of War flight board and I'd design up a completely new one for use with Dawn of War.

**Flying Officer Kyte** · 06-10-2010 05:14

I'd go with one for each period then if as you say it is feasible.
Rob.

**usmc1855** · 06-10-2010 05:22

Originally Posted by Col. Hajj

I can easily make one for each system. If I did that, the one showed in post #34 would be the Wings of War flight board and I'd design up a completely new one for use with Dawn of War.

While we don't use Ace Skills, Fuel or the Pegs for altitude, I'd still have to pick up about 20 of the Wings of War boards for my group. (Quantity discount perhaps? ) When do you anticipate having these ready for purchase, and what cost?