Duel Pack Planes - New Paint Scheme
I've seen a few reports that the planes in the Dual Pack are all new paint schemes.
But they look practically identical to the ones in the Wings of War deluxe second edition to me.
There are some minor differences - they have pilots, the moulding on the albatross top wing is different and the Dr1 rudder and tailplane has red edges.
Otherwise, they look identical - am I missing something.
Cheers,
Nigel
Nope, the paint schemes are the same as the old RDS planes... just from the new molds. The only difference is MvR has a different color surround around the top wing crosses.
I missed the delux sets so these are a welcome addition for me. I look forward to getting the Frank Luke Spad.
On the occasion of the release by ASYNCRON of the 2020 Duel Packs with French rules, here is a comparison between the miniatures of this reissue Duel Pack 2020, those of the first edition Duel Pack 2012 and those of the box Wings of War Deluxe Revised 2010 (from left to right on the pictures), which reveals some small differences.
Duel Pack WGF001A (FOKKER Dr.I Von Richthofen / SOPWITH CAMEL Brown)
FOKKER Dr.I (Manfred Von Richthofen)
2020 figure : The red color is darker and is the same on the wings and fuselage (2 shades on the 2012 figure).
On the bottom, the white square with the black cross seems too big for the width of the wing and is cut on its back side.
SOPWITH CAMEL (Brown)
Figurine 2020 : the edge of the wings is green, which is more aesthetic than the light sand color of the 2 other figurines.
The red color of the tail is darker and is the same as on the engine cover and the wheels, while it is more orange on the 2 figurines 2012 and 2010.
The brown color of the fuselage around the cockpit is also darker.
The white of the roundels is slightly greyer.
Duel Pack WGF001B (ALBATROS D.Va Baümer / SPAD XIII Luke)
ALBATROS D.Va (Baümer)
2020 figure : on the lower wing, a small spot of green paint is missing in front of the struts connecting the 2 wings.
The Iron Cross on the vertical tail is smaller on the 2020 and 2012 figures than on the 2010 figure.
SPAD XIII (Luke)
2020 figure : the camouflage does not cover the whole bottom of the vertical tail.
The identification number 26 on the upper wing is not surrounded by a white border (as on the 2010 figure, unlike the 2012 one).
The lack of green paint in front of the struts connecting the 2 wings is common to all 3 editions.
On the bottom, the color is brighter on the 2020 and 2010 figures, compared to the 2012 one.
Last edited by monse; 01-09-2023 at 07:10.
What a meticulous work of research Simon ! as with some models like between the Spad XIII , there were already differences by realizing that some details differed on the same model as on these two Spad XIII of Madon Ares and Baracca Nexus
Except for the decorations and the addition of a "Pilot". We will find these two differences between the 2 planes W.O.W and W.O.G :
1/the size of the wing :
2/the shape of the wing tips :
Propellers, wings, wheels and guns are made of resin or plastic molded apart from the fuselage which is made of metal and seems identical on the two series of Spad XIII W.O.W and W.O.G :
Pictures from " Repainting Spad XIII " by Exequiel Lopresti on FaceBook
Do they re-use their molds at 100% 80% 60% or - depending on the model ?
And even between the two reissues of Duel Pack we realize thanks to you Simon today that there are also small differences between the miniatures of planes, which will undoubtedly make the happiness of the collectors in the future for the rarity of the object !
IIRC NONE of the original Nexus tooling still exists. Usually tooling is cut right in the factory and stored onsite, then scrapped once the client is no longer willing or able to pay for keeping and using it. (see Nexus bankruptcy)Originally Posted by Spad VII
Hello I am surprised by your answer ?
I was a former project manager at Solido and Gt Spirit, Otto Mobile company Die Cast about 18 million turnover in the world.
I worked on models of aircraft, car, die cast at 1/24 1/48 1/72 of the scan of the device to the creation of the model, the principle of the mold is the same of metal and plastic resin accessories but at a scale, and we had repurchased many molds to company in bankruptcy to reuse them as in the range warmaster !
The bankruptcy does not mean destruction of the mold as at Frog for example with its mold model of 1966 still used by Smer or some marks of the countries of the east in 2021
I think here that the pieces in resin were remade but not the fuselage it is too identical in its design that would explain the similarity can be ?
When Ares reprinted series 1 they purported that they had changed the models and how they were made in order to make them 'more accurate', hence there are differences between their version and the Nexus series 1. eg undercarriage on the Albatros D.Va, tail fins on Dr.1 & Camel.
Sapiens qui vigilat... "He is wise who watches"
Thanks for your clarification Dave
Or did they keep the 3D image of the fuselage scan ?
It happens like this : we make a scan of the plane, we send it to the 3D design office and we make the modifications and then there are specialized companies in China that ensure the molding of the plane which are often the same as those who subcontract for other manufacturers of die cast and toys like Corgi etc, and sometimes we are surprised when the model comes out with defects, all the charm of Asiadifficult to control the chain when we are not on the spot !
The models of Ares are necessarily by 4 models what explains that we always find molded together here these 4 planes Spad, Fokker, Sopwith and the Albatros, because molded individually it would be too expensive to remake because the more we have material the less it is expensive in the cost of production !
If the molds were destroyed, why didn’t Ares create a new mold with accurate measures for the too low scaled Spad XIII ?
The Spad VII miniature has correct proportions, compared to the Spad XIII ones.
Real dimensions (meters) Spad VII / Spad XIII :
Wingspan 7.81 m / 8.10 m
Length 6,08 m / 6,30 m
Height 2,20 m / 2,35 m
At 1/144 scale, the dimensions (centimetres) should be :
Wingspan 5,4 cm / 5,6 cm
Length 4,2 cm / 4,3 cm
Height 1,5 cm / 1,6 cm
But actually, here are the dimensions of Spad VII / Spad XIII WOW / Spad XIII WOG Miniatures :
Wingspan 5,5 cm / 5,3 cm / 5,4 cm
Length (with propeller) 4,2 cm / 4,2 cm / 4,2 cm
Height 1,7 cm / 1,8 cm / 1,8 cm
The WOG Spad XIII appears to be at 1/150 scale, whereas its wingspan is slightly bigger than the WOW model (1/152 scale).
Ares only switched to CAD/CAM relatively recently... supposedly they were trying to pivot to gang-mold "one mold, one sculpt, multiple copies every shot" but for whatever reason it didn't happen.
In the case of those older Frog etc molds, it may be that they were sold before dissolution, or the trustees managing the assets arranged their preservation, while Italeri had no interest in preserving anything of Nexus--though my understanding could be incorrect.
Also, Ares has changed modelmakers over the years... as proven by the "we're totally NOT changing scales even though our new ships mike out at closer to 1/1200 rather than advertised 1/1000" Sails.
Could be that they tried to start fresh from the same drawings used for the original, but the drawing was off. First step in fixing a problem is to ADMIT there is a problem, and Denial ain't just a river in Egypt--you should have seen the uproar over the scale issues on Sails Wave 3, and the resistance in recognizing that there was a problem.
Yes but the molds are sometimes sold at auction after the dissolution of the companies too, we have recovered several of die cast brands which no longer exist !
Solido my Compagny for example has been relaunched by our group by buying the old molds which were dispersed by the world when the fact that the 3 D did not exist it is not a problem since one can remake with an existing mold several models
As far as changing "Designer" for Ares, that's for sure they did ! but once again the metal body is the same as Nexus the first plastics manufacturer was from a European subsidiary of Italeri it seems to me ?
It is indeed possible to recreate a mold with a base of old drawings or plans, but so from a new mold, it is practically impossible to remake a 100% identical "Metal body "
The flawless unless you scan in 3D and as you say that they did not use it at the time everything suggests that .
What's sad is that we *know* Chinese manufacturing can do better when the customer demands it--look at a Meng or Trumpeter model kit. (Admittedly almost every model is "off" in one way or another.) For example comparing a Trumpy Bismarck to the Hasegawa/Tamiya/Fujimi/Aoshima Waterline Series counterpart in same scale, the newer Trumpeter is much crisper in its detail sculpting particularly gun turrets and barrels but the older Japanese model is more accurate to hull and superstructure shapes.
There is so much that we do not know about why these things keep happening, but we know they will continue as long as there is a lack of willingness to accept that there is a problem and engage in a frank assessment of "the differences between what we have and what it SHOULD be, why didn't it hit the mark and how can we get there from here." Even though I think I have a way they could deliver an economical and structurally sound product, a part of me is grateful they're studiously avoiding the Austro-Hungarian star-strutters... (The simple fix in this scale would be a clear block with lasered holes to match the struts, and shooting those holes full of paint.)
Yes we often rubbed shoulders with Trumpeter , Hobby Boss etc at the Nuremberg Toy Fair
They say the same thing it is true, but it is enough to have someone on site who manages our office is in Hong Kong and our group had a new factory built in Bangladesh because it becomes too expensive in China but personally I am for a reintroduction of factories in Europe a friend of mine Jose Fernandez " French Editor " Co/founded the Azur brand at the beginning in Tchecoslovakia and it's going well !
If you're interested ?
Here are the products Warmaster Solido 1/72 Die Cast Metal + Plastic/Resine , I was working on before the Covid 19 !
https://www.flying-tigers.co.uk/prod...ster-aircraft/
At first glance your Rufe is gorgeous... missing detail of note is the A6M2-N has a rudder that extends below the fuselage and a ventral fin, but you have a solid start there and I think it'd be easy to tool a glue-on "Rufe Ventral". Frankly, if it was up to me and economics allowed my first choice would be Czech Republic--there are a lot of exquisite model kits that came out of there as of when I had to give up modelbuilding a decade ago, and frankly I'd think with the post-Soviet economic conditions there'd be no shortage of opportunities to arrange skilled labor and precision manufacturing at an affordable expense. Not to mention the shorter transits and more reliable shipping.
Sadly, segueing back to Ares via a tangent in WWII, going by the not-Bf109K I'd expect to see an Ares Rufe just like that model without the tail change.
If memory serves, sometime last year or late 2019 when Rob at Ares and I last exchanged emails, he was talking about the idea of an Early War duel pack alongside that series' rerelease, and I had floated the idea of introducing a second deco-variant for each Duel Pack while keeping the originals (case-pack in a ratio of something like two new-decoes to one original so newbs have a shot at both and us Grognards have something new), which he seemed receptive to on a future re-run. (It was too late for the batch that's just coming in now.)
Thank you , and yes for Czech Republic , it's pleasure to exchange with you and "bravo" for your professional eye
I myself had consultants when in 2018 we made a special D Day with our models of Jeep and tanks is always a pleasure to discuss with them
There is indeed on this model a " Gouvernail Ventral " (in French) to add below I had told them but too expensive to add it to the machine to cut it is necessary to finely cut the parts outside the plastic molds or metal parts !
Then you need screws for assembly almost impossible to do by hand , and precisely this model is 10 years old and it is taken from an old model mold that we had to buy the rights.
We worked to remake it in metal and improve it by keeping this base as well as and it is not conceived in 3D, I was called as project manager then to create new planes by scanning and to launch a new range of product in 1/48 for the first time at Solido but at the end of one year of investment, the pandemic arrived and the project of the new range was given up, can be it will come back one day who knows ?
5.000 / 7.000 Planes minimum for a series so that it is profitable for a price of 25 Dollars per piece because even with this price not sure to totally make the mold and the study of the aircraft profitable !
Here is an example of a factory in China specialized in molding where we manufactured our models after the study of the project in France :
Edit: Vidéo You tube " Diecast Model Manufacturing in China "
But we come back to the main discussion about the Duel Pack and Spad because we are moving away from it
Like Simon for me the most beautiful and successful series in WW1 for Ares design is #4 with the Spad VII and others
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