Arab Israeli War of 1948 Airplanes

[Lord_Ninja]

So looking at the Arab Israeli conflict of 1948 we have several planes already released to the game and several more that will need homebrew stats.

Released:

Israel-
Beaufighter
P-51
Spitfire Mk. IX
B-17G (but lacking all guns except the tail guns)

Arab Forces-
Spitfire Mk. IX

Need Homebrews:

Israel-
Avia S-199
Spitfire Mk. V

Arab Forces-
Spifire Mk.V
Hawker Fury
Macchi MC.205V

Proposed Brews;
Avia S-199. H Deck, 17 Hp, BCC/AC
Macchi Mc.205V. Q Deck (Maybe O without 60 degree turns?)(Speed 400 mph/640 kmh), 18 Hp, BCC/AC
Hawker Fury, currently too fast for any decks (460 MPH/740 KMH) R deck as a stand in (due to the similarities of the Fw-190D to the Hawker Tempest, an earlier variant of the Fury), Hp 18, BBBB/BB

Spitfire Mk. V, With a speed of 370 MPH/595 KMH it technically falls in line with the speeds of the Yak-1 and Ki-61 (some variants) but that also unfortunately makes it's deck speed the same as the Mk.I Spitfire. Some people would have it be Q deck while others A deck with the 90 Degree turns of the L deck. Meh, just give it 18 HP and BCC/AC and be done with it either way.

[Lt. S.Kafloc]

Type.............................Deck......Short.........Long.................Dam......Ceiling.....Climb......Base



Spitfire Mk.VA
Q
B-B
B

18
13
3
F


Spitfire Mk.VB
Q
B-C-C
A-C

18
13
3
F


Spitfire Mk.VC
Q
B-C-C
A-C

18
13
3
F


Spitfire Mk.VC(Trop)
A
B-C-C
A-C

18
13
4
F

[Lt. S.Kafloc]

Type.............................Deck......Short.........Long.................Dam......Ceiling.....Climb......Base



Maccia 205N
O*
B-C-C-C
A-B-C

18
13
4
F
rare


Maccia 205V series I
O*
A-B
A

18
13
2
F



Maccia 205V series III
O*
B-C-C
A-C

18
13
2
F

[Foz]

I'll have a rummage on the planes that haven't made the official unofficial list yet tomorrow, when I'm more human.

Also another list of planes for the 1948 conflict...
http://www.militaryfactory.com/aircraft/arab-israeli-war-aircraft-1948.asp

Wing loading on Spits should only give them a maximum turn of 60 degree in most cases.
I have been thinking on making a few unofficial decks for later Spits.

[csadn]

Does anyone else see the Galactic Irony in that Israel used a Nazi design (built in Czechoslovakia)? :)

[Naharaht]

Yes, but they were glad of any planes they could lay hands on.

[Diamondback]

Desperate people in desperate fights use whatever weapons they can get. I'm sure they woulda Kamikazed Up with Reichenbergs if they'd had to.

[Carl_Brisgamer]

Does anyone else see the Galactic Irony in that Israel used a Nazi design (built in Czechoslovakia)? :)

They used Mauser Kar98K rifles as well, re-bored to 7.62mm. I have one, a 1916 Oberndorf.

[csadn]

Desperate people in desperate fights use whatever weapons they can get. I'm sure they woulda Kamikazed Up with Reichenbergs if they'd had to.

Mmm -- I don't think the Israelis would have been big on suicide tactics; not only for reasons of faith, but for the simple fact that there weren't that many of them (esp. not after what Dear Old Uncle Adi and his crew did to them).

[DarrylH]

Mmm -- I don't think the Israelis would have been big on suicide tactics; not only for reasons of faith, but for the simple fact that there weren't that many of them (esp. not after what Dear Old Uncle Adi and his crew did to them).

Although taking off or landing in an Avia S-199 bordered on suicidal very frequently. They ground-looped so often that the Yemenite farmers near their air strips developed a routine of checking to see if their assistance was needed in turning an Avia back over whenever a mission began or ended.

[Lord_Ninja]

Although taking off or landing in an Avia S-199 bordered on suicidal very frequently. They ground-looped so often that the Yemenite farmers near their air strips developed a routine of checking to see if their assistance was needed in turning an Avia back over whenever a mission began or ended.

That's what happens when you take a fighter already notorious for ground looping and stick a bomber engine and propeller on the front that also rotate opposite direction of what the original engine and propeller rotated. Yet somehow they managed to successfully shoot down eight enemy planes and damage four more for only the loss of four S-199s. Not a bad ratio for probably the worse combination of fighter and engine.

[Foz]

I apologise, I had completely forgotten to have a dig for stats. I'll try to do it tomorrow.
As this had caught my interest, I went and bought the Osprey book on the subject, which led to this...

The Miles Aerovan, as used by the Israelis.

197705

[Carl_Brisgamer]

I was looking through the Armaments in Miniature website and saw they now have the Avia S.199 used by the IAF - http://www.angelfire.com/nj4/armamentsinminiature/aircraftinminiature/9mm/resin09mm.htm

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As well as the Short Stirling used by the Egyptian Air Force. Throw in a few repainted Ares Spits (Egyptian and IAF) and Beaufighters (IAF) and you have yourselves a decent stoush.

[rhodie80]

They used Mauser Kar98K rifles as well, re-bored to 7.62mm. I have one, a 1916 Oberndorf.

The WWII Victory Museum in Auburn, Ind have couple of Sturmgewehr 44s with Israeli Defense Force stamps on the barrels.

They was a great documentary on the early Israeli Air Force called Above and Beyond. Well done piece and can be found on Amazon.

[Carl_Brisgamer]

The WWII Victory Museum in Auburn, Ind have couple of Sturmgewehr 44s with Israeli Defense Force stamps on the barrels.

Probably sold by the Czechs. I saw my first real Stg/MP44 in the weapons container 1RAR brought back from Somalia in 1993. Incredible the plethora of weapons the bandits were using, all different makes and calibres. Being a Somali warlord's quartermaster must have been a nightmare!

[matt56]

I think this could be a post-WW2 era I could easily get into...:sAprvd: It would make a great convention game scenario...

All the best,
Matt

[BobP]

Lucas. Here are my planes I did for 1948 Arab/Israeli war. All are AIM models with Miscmini decals. I post these in the Hobby Room before.

263694

These are my Spitfires and Avia S-199's.

[BobP]

And here are my Egyptian planes. Again AIM with Miscmini decals. Kevin did the Egyptian decals as a special request but they are on his site now.

263695

Spitfires and MC V205's.

263696

[milcoll73]

I think this could be a post-WW2 era I could easily get into...:sAprvd: It would make a great convention game scenario...

All the best,
Matt





hhhhhhhhhmmmmmmmmmm, not that i need another b-17, but that one with mickey mouse slinging a bomb on the tail DOES look awesome!!!

[BobP]

Just received the Osprey Arab-Israeli Air Wars 47-82. It is just for the IAF and has some nice pictures. There is a photo of a B-17 being escorted by 2 Spitfires. The B-17 is a D model as it has no chin turret or top turret. Also some photos of Mosquitos and P-51D's. When I looked online the article didn't mention Mosquitos or P-51's so now I have 2 other types to add to my IAF. have to see if I can find an Osprey book that has the Arab forces.

[Carl_Brisgamer]

Just received the Osprey Arab-Israeli Air Wars 47-82. It is just for the IAF and has some nice pictures. There is a photo of a B-17 being escorted by 2 Spitfires. The B-17 is a D model as it has no chin turret or top turret. Also some photos of Mosquitos and P-51D's. When I looked online the article didn't mention Mosquitos or P-51's so now I have 2 other types to add to my IAF. have to see if I can find an Osprey book that has the Arab forces.

The Israelis got their Mosquitos from the French, retired them in 1955 but then returned them to service during the Sues Crisis in 1956 where they gave sterling service. That was the last time the ‘Mossie’ was used in combat anywhere in the world.

[BobP]

Thanks Carl. When you look on line you get different info. That's why this place is so good. A wealth of information and knowledge. And with that do you know what the Squadron code was for #22 Squadron RAAF was? I have some DB7s I was thinking of doing for the RAAF. I have seen DU as a unit code but not sure who it is.