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Von Rotherham
10-21-2010, 10:26
I wasn't sure where to post this but here seems like the best place. Here is a link to my new photo album of picture from a trip I recently undertook to Belgium. I was working on some battlefield archaeology as part of a larger project that hopes to put the entire stretch of the Western Front in Belgium on the UNESCO World Heritage List by 2014. I was working with two others and we excavated trenches on two sites: Palingbeek and Sanctuary Wood, both just outside of Ypres. The Palingbeek excavations were on German front line systems and the Sanctuary Wood ones were on what was supposed to be German systems but looked more like British from the recovered artefacts. The photos are not in chronological order due to the uploader, but I hope you enjoy them anyway:

http://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/album.php?albumid=300

Khargor
10-21-2010, 11:26
You have my total respect for the work you put in to the project you joined - the Western Front seems to be rapidly disappearing under new developments and needs to be recognised as an important historical area before its gone for good.

I've taken school groups across to Sanctuary Woods before as part of WW1 history trips (even though I teach ICT, I love getting to Flanders and the Somme areas:)) and have heard some conflicting reports about the authenticity of the trenches being in the correct position as Jacques claims they are - did any of your dig shed light on this debate? I've been told that they were put in during the 60's, that they were really British support trenches as well being told that they're authentic front line ones! I'm due back there in May with more students and it'd be great to know the truth as, even if they're not real, they do help give an impression of what a trench system looks like.

I'd really like to hear how you got on with the dig if you've time to post about it :)

BryanR
10-21-2010, 11:52
Fantastic! Your job is way cooler than mine.

Attila57
10-21-2010, 12:46
Great! A really nice and interesting album of picture.

Please, Alex update us about this project in future.

Attilio

richard m schwab
10-21-2010, 16:24
Alex!

Thank you for sharing those!

Rich

Warhorse47
10-21-2010, 17:03
Thanks for your efforts on the job and the photos!

Won Wing Lo
10-21-2010, 20:51
Really appreciate you posting these. Everyone here is an amateur historian at some level. Thanks.

Flying Officer Kyte
10-22-2010, 02:18
Thanks for the photos Alex. It really brings home the fact that so many lives were going on and ending in those trenches. It is easy to forget from up in the clouds.
Rob.

Von Rotherham
10-22-2010, 11:05
Thanks guys, I'm glad you liked them. It's not often that I get to go out to France or Belgium but it's always great when I do!


did any of your dig shed light on this debate? I've been told that they were put in during the 60's, that they were really British support trenches as well being told that they're authentic front line ones! I'm due back there in May with more students and it'd be great to know the truth as, even if they're not real, they do help give an impression of what a trench system looks like.

I'd really like to hear how you got on with the dig if you've time to post about it :)

Unfortunately the trenches in the back of Jaques cafe are not authentic. Every so often you'll notice that there are fresh spade marks where they've been cleared out. I'm not sure when they were originally dug, but this is the same story all over the Western Front. Even the trenches in the Beaumont Hamel Newfoundland Memorial are not what they are touted as. The guides tell you they are 1916 trenches, where in fact most are from 1918. The area is correct for the Newfies attack, just not the trenches.

The trenches that I can say with absolute certainty (as I had a hand in excavating them) are authentic Great War Trenches are the one behind Ocean Villa's Tea Shop on the Somme and the trenches in Thiepval Woods again on the Somme (the latter can be visited by asking Teddy at the Ulster Tower, the former by asking Avril at the Tea Rooms). Both of these have been left open to for public viewing and are well worth a visit. If anyone is interested I can tell you more about the excavations on both these sites. We (NML) have dug on nearly twenty sites across the Western Front but most of them have been filled in again after we fully recorded them as they are generally Farmer's Fields that are still in use.

Jaques Trenches and the various other ones scattered across the tourist routes of the front line do give a good impression of the trenches, but it is by far a complete picture.

The trenches that we were digging in Sanctuary Wood (some distance away from where the Canadian Monument and Jaques is; the access to our site was not up the road that most of the tourists would know, but by a small track off to the right up beyond the Hooge Chateau, the Hooge Crater Museum and the amusement park) were located by a new technique developed by one of the Belgium archaeologists of the Flander's Institute (who we were working for by Proxy). Basically he takes photo recon pictures and overlays modern OS maps onto them using various points of reference. These can then be located with a reasonable amount of accuracy on the modern landscape using a Total Station Theodolite (a surevying GPS system) and this dictates where the archaeological trenches should go so that we hit the Great War trenches. As you can see from the pictures, in the part of the trench that I was working on we hit the tops of two trenches (the archaeological trenches stretched for about 100m across the wood), they seemed to be British by the amount of .303 rounds I pulled out and the fact that there was a piece of British webbing in there. They could have originally been German trenches that were attacked and then held by the Brits, but that's difficult to say given that we only found British artefacts in there.

The trenches at Pallingbeek were thought to be German trenches by the Belgian archaeologists and all the evidence we collected points to the fact that they were. We found wooden wattling that had collapsed, a general feature of German trench furniture rather than British, who generally used chicken wire or corregated iron. There were also several German mauser rounds.

If anyone has any more questions, don't hesitate to ask!

bumblie3
10-23-2010, 14:14
Brilliant Alex, thanks for the info.
john.

Goering Ace
10-24-2010, 19:07
Hi Alex. Not sure if you knew it, but I'm a professional archaeologist here in the US. Didn't know there were any other archaeologists here on the site!! Cool pictures. Looks like a very interesting dig. I'd love to be part of something like that!! Most of the digs over here aren't that exciting, although I've had my share of cool projects over the last 25 years with a number of cemetery jobs. I've dug up more bodies than most grave diggers!! :)

Anyways, just wanted to touch base with a fellow archaeologist.

Scott

Von Rotherham
10-25-2010, 09:55
Thanks John and hello Scott! I've been a profesional archaeologist for nearly ten years now and I've been involved in Great war Archaeology for about six of those. Like I said before these jobs don't come up often but when they do I'm on them like a rat up a drain pipe! If anyone is interested further here is the webpage for No Man's Land, the group I belong to. It has most of the reports from the sites we've worked on:

http://www.redtwo.plus.com/nml/

Goering Ace
10-25-2010, 10:13
Hey Alex, not only am I a professional archaeologist, but my wife is too! We met on a dig in Baltimore, Maryland in 1987 and have been together ever since. She's a historic expert while my expertise is in prehistoric sites (1500 a.d. - 10,000 b.c.). This week I'm going to northeast Pennsylvania to prepare a new site for excavation. This is a great site because they already identified a large prehistoric village site right next to where our excavations begin. We'll likely find more of what the other excavations revealed, which is many hearth features, post molds, and prehistoric pottery and stone tools! Basically, we should see a continuation of the original site. I can't wait!!

Scott

Von Rotherham
10-25-2010, 10:30
Keeping it in the family ey? That's excellent news about the digs. Are they commercial run excavations or research? I try to do a bit of both. I usually try to spend most of my summers teaching Students how to use a trowel... This year I spent two months in Northern Tanzania teaching students from Nairobi and Dar Es Salaam universities, although I can usually be found in the less glamorous location of Doncaster... I'm currently working on the outskirts of York on a Roman/Prehistoric site. It's waterlogged and we're pulling out tons of preserved wooden artefacts!

Alex

Flying Officer Kyte
10-25-2010, 11:10
Keeping it in the family ey? That's excellent news about the digs. Are they commercial run excavations or research? I try to do a bit of both. I usually try to spend most of my summers teaching Students how to use a trowel... This year I spent two months in Northern Tanzania teaching students from Nairobi and Dar Es Salaam universities, although I can usually be found in the less glamorous location of Doncaster... I'm currently working on the outskirts of York on a Roman/Prehistoric site. It's waterlogged and we're pulling out tons of preserved wooden artefacts!

Alex
Were you on Time team special this Sunday?
Rob.

Von Rotherham
10-25-2010, 11:32
Hi Rob, no, I've never been on Time Team. The site that was covered by that particular show was a site called Hungate in the centre of York run by The York Archaeological Trust. I work for another Archaeological company in York. But... A bit of self promotion here... I have taken part in and featured on two TV series about Great War archaeology called Finding the Fallen (aka Trench Detectives) and a couple of one off specials for the BBC and the History Channel.

Goering Ace
10-25-2010, 11:33
Keeping it in the family ey? That's excellent news about the digs. Are they commercial run excavations or research? I try to do a bit of both. I usually try to spend most of my summers teaching Students how to use a trowel... This year I spent two months in Northern Tanzania teaching students from Nairobi and Dar Es Salaam universities, although I can usually be found in the less glamorous location of Doncaster... I'm currently working on the outskirts of York on a Roman/Prehistoric site. It's waterlogged and we're pulling out tons of preserved wooden artefacts!

Alex

The digs I'm involved with are "commercial", as you say. They are all a result of historic conservation laws here in the US. If you are going to build anything, a certain amount of the money must go towards environmental & cultural resources (archaeology, wetlands, etc.). I work for a cultural resource management firm. We do historic preservation and archaeology. Most of the jobs I've been involved with over the last 25 years were state or federally funded government jobs like highway construction or bridge replacements. Those are probably 60% of the work I've done, with the other 40% coming from private contractors, like housing developments, hotels or pipelines (for example). I worked on Guam for 2.5 years and all the digs there were private development (golf courses and hotels), mainly for the Japanese tourist industry. The one I'm going to this week is a small airport that is making improvements. I have yet to be involved with any digs that are research grants. Those just don't happen over here.

Your current dig sounds awesome!! Finding preserved wooden artifacts is rare for us! If you can, post some pictures. I'd love to see what kind of artifacts you're recovering. :)

Scott

Goering Ace
10-25-2010, 11:39
Hi Rob, no, I've never been on Time Team. The site that was covered by that particular show was a site called Hungate in the centre of York run by The York Archaeological Trust. I work for another Archaeological company in York. But... A bit of self promotion here... I have taken part in and featured on two TV series about Great War archaeology called Finding the Fallen (aka Trench Detectives) and a couple of one off specials for the BBC and the History Channel.

That's awesome, Alex! Over my career I've never made it on TV but had plenty of newspaper reporters interview me and most quoted me out of context to spice up the story, which didn't go over well with my boss!!

Scott

Von Rotherham
10-25-2010, 12:13
plenty of newspaper reporters interview me and most quoted me out of context to spice up the story, which didn't go over well with my boss!!

That's the media for you! My friend wrote an article about a cemetery site that I was working on and all the British papers were full of it, but by the end of the week it was reported as though we'd found Oliver Cromwell's lost army...

I used to have a bit of a hankering to work in the US as an archaeologist but I never knew how easy it was to get work and/or how often the contracts came around. I once applied for a job in Hawaii, I assumed the site would be surrounded by Hula Girls! It sounds like there is quite a lot of work over there, but I'm pretty much done living abroad for work now...

Goering Ace
10-25-2010, 12:34
I used to have a bit of a hankering to work in the US as an archaeologist but I never knew how easy it was to get work and/or how often the contracts came around. I once applied for a job in Hawaii, I assumed the site would be surrounded by Hula Girls! It sounds like there is quite a lot of work over there, but I'm pretty much done living abroad for work now...

Getting work over here isn't that hard, and it gets easier the more contacts you make as you work new jobs. They're always building roads and, as a result, will always need to do Phase I archaeological surveys for all proposed options for the new highway. There is a site called www.shovelbums.org that you can go to and see current listings for job openings across the US. Of course, if the economy slows down so does the work, but you can usually still find work even if it's smaller jobs. If you get on a large highway project it can last for years as it goes from Phase I to Phase II and, if your really lucky, Phase III (data recovery).

Oh, and you said you applied for a job in Hawaii? When Chris and I ended up in Guam we had applied to a firm in Hawaii (PHRI, Inc) who had a main office in Hilo, HI. They had tons of work out of their Guam office so we ended up there. Curious to know if you applied to the same company?

Scott

Von Rotherham
10-25-2010, 13:15
I think I applied for that job in Hawaii through Shovelbums, it was a long time ago though, maybe around 2003, so I really cannot remember the name of the company that I applied to! Sorry about that. I'm now at a stage where I'm pretty much done with living outside of the UK for extended periods though; I lived in Ireland for four years, Iceland for a year and Singapore for nearly six months all through archaeology. But you never know, one day I may change my mind!

Alex

Goering Ace
10-25-2010, 13:31
Chris and I planned on traveling around the US doing digs but we landed the Guam job and we ended up staying well past the required 6 month contract. But while there we traveled to Hong Kong, Thailand, Bali, Nepal and China, so it was better than a US tour. I bopped around the states more than Chris in the early years before Guam. She pretty much stayed put while I went from job to job throughout the eastern states. Once back from Guam I worked for a few different firms before our son was born and I jumped out of the archaeology field for awhile as he grew up.

Chris is the lab director for the firm I work with now. She's been with them since 1992.

Scott

Von Rotherham
10-26-2010, 10:15
Wow it certainly sounds like you've seen the world. That's one of the things I love about the job and I always push that idea onto the Students that I teach from time to time. I try to tell them to travel with the job as much as possible before families and the like get in the way.

I will try to get some photos of the site I'm on now, but a lot of the wood has already been lifted and removed from site.

Goering Ace
10-26-2010, 11:56
Any photos would be great, even if they aren't of the wood artifacts. I'd like seeing any pictures of the overall dig.

Chris and I always wanted to do our traveling and seeing the world before we had any kids and it worked out well for us. The Guam job was a godsend as we took trips to the above mentioned countries about once every 6 months or so for vacation. It was incredibly cheap to visit those places from Guam and we'd never have been able to afford the trips if we had tried to do them from Pennsylvania. Heck, we paid $400 for round trip airfare to Indonesia and that would have been easily $1000-1500 for the flight from the states. Yep, get those students traveling while they can!! :)

MayorJim
10-26-2010, 16:01
Alex,

Thanks for sharing this info with us. I also enjoyed the NML site...thanks for the link. The pics of the wattling were what caught my eye the most...thanks again!

Von Rotherham
10-27-2010, 09:39
Scott I'll try to upload a few pics at the weekend, I'm currently working away and can't get the pictures off my phone onto my computer until I get back home.

Jim, thanks for the comments. The wattling was an excellent find, it's nothing we've seen before in the ground although we knew it existed from Photos.

tonyc206
10-28-2010, 01:36
Wow, thanks Alex. I love seeing archaeology and watch loads of time team etc. I keep meaning to get involved in something but always have too many other things on the go and haver to keep the family happy :-)

What an exciting thing to do for a job. Thanks so much for sharing this

Tony

Von Rotherham
10-28-2010, 09:31
Thanks Tony, no problem, I'm glad you liked the pictures. I have thousands more from earlier trips into France and Belgium, if anyone is interested I can upload those at a later date as well.

Ha ha, the job is not so exciting when you have contractor breathing down your neck to finish yesterday and it's lashing it down with rain...

Khargor
10-28-2010, 16:05
Alex - Thanks for the info on Sanctuary Wood, its appreciated. Now I'm going to rewatch my 'Finding the Fallen' DVD to see if I can work out which one is you...;)

Von Rotherham
10-29-2010, 10:31
Hi Shaun, I can give you a clue, I'm the one with the credits 'Alex Sotheran'. Which series do you have on DVD? On the first series I am talking on the Beaumont Hamel episode and in the second series I'm on a lot more. But I was involved with all of the excavations that are on both series.

Von Rotherham
10-30-2010, 02:43
Scott, here are some photos of the site I'm on at the moment. There is a couple of shots of some of the preserved wooden artefacts we are finding.

http://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/album.php?albumid=307

Flying Officer Kyte
10-30-2010, 02:54
Some more very interesting shots. Have you found any artifacts in the well.
Looking at the site, reminds me of why I'm in the R.F.C. and not the P.B.I.
Rob.

flash
10-30-2010, 03:41
Cracking pictures Alex - seen some of the programs & good works being done out there - keep it up !

Von Rotherham
10-30-2010, 05:10
Rob, I haven't been working on the well personally, but my mate who is up to his knees in it has found some Roman pottery I believe.

Dave, thanks, I'm glad you liked the shows and the photos.

Goering Ace
11-04-2010, 15:55
Scott, here are some photos of the site I'm on at the moment. There is a couple of shots of some of the preserved wooden artefacts we are finding.

Thanks for the photo link, Alex. Great pics!! I just got back from three long days on a new job in NE Pennsylvania, near the banks of the Susquehanna river. The area is surrounded by prehistoric indian sites, many of them amazing village sites. Unfortunately, our first two test units yielded nothing but fill and sterile soil (in what was labeled a "High probability area"). Very disappointing considering the soil scientist said that we'd most definitely find something on the site. However, all hope is not lost. We have another high probability area to test starting Monday so I'm hoping for the best. It's much closer to the river so it should have a good chance of yielding artifacts. Nothing would be worse than digging 26 1x1m units and finding nothing.

Scott

Von Rotherham
11-07-2010, 08:48
Hi Scott, how are you carrying out the testing? I remember something about US Archaeologists doing 1m x 1m test pits over sites. Is that correct?

Tomorrow I'm off to watch a machine dig out a drainage system for a new housing estate. Joy...

Goering Ace
11-07-2010, 09:21
Hi Scott, how are you carrying out the testing? I remember something about US Archaeologists doing 1m x 1m test pits over sites. Is that correct?

Yep. You got it right, for the most part. We have three Phases of investigation -
Phase I most often involves shovel test pits (50cm in diameter), usually at 15m (50') intervals across the project area. The interval is often cut in half if we uncover artifacts in an STP and want to better define the artifact density. Phase I is primarily to determine if there is a site present or not.

Phase II is used to define the limits of the site and gain further information to determine if the site should go to Phase III which is full scale data recovery. Phase II's are where you most often see the use of 1x1m units. However, in areas where you anticipate deep excavations to get to potential artifact bearing soils, 1x1m units can be used in Phase I surveys also, like in my case right now.

Phase III is full scale data recovery, as I said before, and involves opening up huge areas using 1x1's and also stripping the top soil layers to reveal features. Often we'll open up 5x5m or greater areas in this phase. These are the ones that make news headlines.

That's US archaeology 101 in a nutshell. :D