B-17s and Lancasters now available for pre-orders!

[Oberst Hajj]

Most of you know by now that we are getting two versions of the Avro Lancaster B Mk.III, the "Grog's the Shot" and a "Dambuster". We are also getting a B-17F "Memphis Belle" and a B-17G "A Bit of Lace". These new four engine bombers are now on pre-order at Aerodrome Accessories (http://www.aerodromeaccessories.com/index.php/miniatures/wings-of-glory/wwii-miniatures.html). They are due for release in October and the retail price is $34.90.

http://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=137493&d=1405594304

http://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=137494&d=1405594305

http://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=137491&d=1405594299

http://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=137492&d=1405594301


Pre-order the set through the AA store and you can pick them up for $24.99 and each order will get a free set of Bomber Special Damage Markers (only on order placed before Oct 27th).

http://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=137495&d=1405594551

[Black Sheep One]

Yes! Order placed!

[Dan-Sam]

Huh, why only A guns for Lancaster? :eek:

[kaufschtick]

Very nice, very nice indeed.:pint:

[kduke42]

Might that headline actually intend to be PRE-orders?

[Oberst Hajj]

Might that headline actually intend to be PRE-orders?

137496

lol, thanks for catching that.

[OldGuy59]

Well,
I guessed right on the maneuver deck, but the damage is 50! Is this because of the armor, self-sealing fuel tanks and redundant structure? We estimated this plane at 44. Quite a difference.

Also on the B-17F (just looking to update my cards with the "approved" versions):
The #2 gun is a 200 degree forward firing arc? What is that, a chin turret?

Is there some mis-coloring on the base for arcs 6&7? 6 appears to be the Right Waist Gunner, and 7 the Tail Gunner, both are yellow on the side panel.

Any input/suggestions?

Mike :)

[Oberst Hajj]

Well,
I guessed right on the maneuver deck, but the damage is 50! Is this because of the armor, self-sealing fuel tanks and redundant structure? We estimated this plane at 44. Quite a difference.

Mike :)

Fifty looks (https://www.google.com/search?q=b-17+battle+damage&client=firefox-a&hs=LB&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&channel=sb&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=qO3HU7K_JISp8AHZm4HwCQ&ved=0CB4QsAQ)about right to me. lol

[Guntruck]

Order placed, bombs away!

[Naharaht]

Daniel, the Lancaster guns are A because they were .303 Brownings. You will notice that the tail turret has 4 Brownings and so is a B. The B-17, of course, had .50 Browning machine guns.

[Flying Officer Kyte]

I like the look of them, but am mulling over which ones to get and in what numbers, considering that none of them figured in the Malta siege, but I have to have at least one Lanc.
Rob.

[Blackronin]

Are the bases bigger than the B-25 and He-111 bases?

[Marechallannes]

Nice planes, Herr Oberst.

Unfortunately I need them all... :money:

[Marechallannes]

Daniel, the Lancaster guns are A because they were .303 Brownings. You will notice that the tail turret has 4 Brownings and so is a B...

Beside this the front gunner's and the rear gunner's position of the Lancaster's base are marked with Position 1. :confused:

...and the Dam Buster version has a third gunner position on it's base.

[csadn]

I suppose I might get them for the sake of completeness; but I can't imagine they'll be very interesting to use -- "move in straight line; hope the fighters don't draw damage worth a damn".

[Marechallannes]

I really like the Lancasters for a develpment of night fighter missions & rules. ("Schräge Musik" :slysmile:)

Got a Beaufigther and two Bf.110 in night camouflage.

Maybe I'll run a scenario at Prague Summer Con with them next year. :minis:

[Dan-Sam]

Daniel, the Lancaster guns are A because they were .303 Brownings. You will notice that the tail turret has 4 Brownings and so is a B. The B-17, of course, had .50 Browning machine guns.

Yes, but Stuka has 2x 7,92 mm (= A deck) in front and 1x 7,92 mm (= A deck too) in the rear. I think we need a half A deck :confused:


By the way, Lancaster Mk.III has 2x 7,7 mm in front (= A deck), 2x 7,7 mm in turret (= A deck) and 4x 7,7 mm (= B deck), but the colour of the circle No.3 is white, so it looks there will be a B deck for turret and A for rear gunner :confused:

[Marechallannes]

The numbers on the bases in the pictures aren't correct.

[Dan-Sam]

The numbers on the bases in the pictures aren't correct.

Obviously :(

Edit: But the B gun should be in red (not white) circle.

[Xen]

killer!

[OldGuy59]

Obviously :(

Edit: But the B gun should be in red (not white) circle.

Dan,

We'll have to wait for someone to get their hands on them. They look messed up to me. The base for the Lanc has two "1" arcs, and no "2" or "3". I can only assume the "3" is supposed to be the tail gun. So, for the two gun position Lanc, there is one too many arcs.

The "2" should be the top turret, and it should be a white center.

Mike :)

[Dan-Sam]

Dan,

We'll have to wait for someone to get their hands on them. They look messed up to me. The base for the Lanc has two "1" arcs, and no "2" or "3". I can only assume the "3" is supposed to be the tail gun. So, for the two gun position Lanc, there is one too many arcs.

The "2" should be the top turret, and it should be a white center.

Mike :)

Mike, I understand what you are traying to say, but if No. 3 (B damage) should be for tail gunner, there is no reason why he could fire only to the same and higher altitude. So the tail gunner would have a red circle, not white one. This seems that B damage are from turret gun, but there were only two 7.7 mm guns.

PS: sorry for milimetres, but I can not counting immediately imperials.

[OldGuy59]

Mike, I understand what you are traying to say, but if No. 3 (B damage) should be for tail gunner, there is no reason why he could fire only to the same and higher altitude. So the tail gunner would have a red circle, not white one. This seems that B damage are from turret gun, but there were only two 7.7 mm guns.
...

Dan,
We are in agreement, just not expressing it well. It depends on what the firing arcs are supposed to be. The base on both Lanc versions have only "1" arcs indicated, but three gunners. If the "3" arc is B damage, then it should be for the tail gun, with 4 .303 (7.62mm) machine guns. The tail gun should be good for all altitudes, and therefore solid red (I'm not sure how the WGS system works for firing arcs, so I could be messed up, too). The B-17 firing arcs show the dorsal turret as white centered ("2" on the F, and "3" on the G). This should be firing arc "2" for the dorsal turret on the second Lanc. If ARES intended the "3" arc to be the dorsal turret, then "2" should be solid red, and "B" damage at short range. In any event, it is messed up, from what I can determine using the posted pictures.

Does that help with explaining what I mean? I think we actually agree.

Mike :)

[Dan-Sam]

Yeah, I know we are in compliance, I just tried to point another thing :) But you are right - there are everything clear now :)
I think Lanc turret could have 360° to the same.and higher altitude, so there would not be a necessary to have the third arc.

[BobP]

Can't wait to see what our outstanding painters do with these. I think I will only get one of each for the first buy but after that might have to have a few more B-17's.

[Brambo]

Anybody else suffer from Schizophrenia, I suddenly found an email from Keith saying thankyou for your order, what order I thought! Oh yes the four new bombers. I'm going to have to double the medication!!!!!!

[Flying Officer Kyte]

Anybody else suffer from Schizophrenia, I suddenly found an email from Keith saying thankyou for your order, what order I thought! Oh yes the four new bombers. I'm going to have to double the medication!!!!!!

Thank you for your order Trev.
Dried Frog pills are packed and ready for shipping.;)
Kyte.

[OldGuy59]

... Avro Lancaster B Mk.III, the "Grog's the Shot" ...

http://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=137493&d=1405594304

...



I think the base is messed up, and to illustrate what I think it should be is in the Plane Card below.

137700

I wasn't going to do a Lanc card, as there were going to be an "official card" released. Silly boy, there will be custom paint jobs. The template is coming together. If the "official plane card" is like the base above, it might be prudent to have an alternative.

Mike :)

[Marechallannes]

Nice plane card Mike, but I'm afraid your Lancaster isn't in the middle of the card, is respectively too small.

[Marechallannes]

Any statements from Ares Games about the wrong Lancaster bases (pictures)?

(...wrong numbers on bases and the dam buster version has a non existent 3rd gunner position on the base.)

I would not order order them with an incorrect base. :hmm:

[OldGuy59]

Nice plane card Mike, but I'm afraid your Lancaster isn't in the middle of the card, is respectively too small.
Yes, I threw this card together a bit fast. It does show the right arcs, as I think they should be. I was trying to save work between the Plane and Management cards. That does affect playability, so I will have to fix that.

Should the plane be scaled to 1/200 wingspan? Should all planes be scaled on all cards?

Mike :)

[Marechallannes]

The plane card and firing arcs should fit to the used base.

[OldGuy59]

The plane card and firing arcs should fit to the used base.

Sorry for being confused. The plane image needs to be bigger. However, the actual plane is bigger than the base.

How much bigger should the image be?

Mike :)

[Flying Officer Kyte]

Now I'm getting confused Mike. Maybe it is because I don't play using the cards, but only use them if planes are on top of each other on the table, but as far as I can see the size of the aircraft is immaterial as long as the red dot and arcs are correctly positioned and in proportion in relationship to each other and distance from the card edges.
Rob.

[Marechallannes]

... The plane image needs to be bigger. However, the actual plane is bigger than the base.

How much bigger should the image be?

Mike :)

You are right Mike.

Of course the bomber is bigger then his base.

As long as the firing arcs and the red dots on the card fits 100 % to the base of the use miniature you can make the plane on the card as big as you want or want it to fit.

We don't speak about the crew management card. Size doesn't matter there.

[alpine]

Can you tell us how long until this deal is up? Have to wait until next week for my paycheck and I'll place an order ASAP!

[tikkifriend]

That B17 looks peachy. I believe I had the Airfix model of a bit of lace some 40 odd yrs ago :):

[Ragnar200]

Order placed. They look really good!

Ron

[Oberst Hajj]

As with all of the initial production ready photos Ares puts out, the bases are not real. They are mock ups only and used just to show the miniatures as they will go into production.



Can you tell us how long until this deal is up? Have to wait until next week for my paycheck and I'll place an order ASAP!

Oh, you have plenty of time.

[Oberst Hajj]

Okay, just confirmed with Ares, for the standard Lanc, the 2nd firing arc is the white circle. On the dam buster, there is no number 3 firing arc.

[Nightbomber]

The B-17 mini (is it the right word?) is slowly growing on me, but the crew/engine management may be kind of hell...

[Marechallannes]

...if you can handle a WGS He.111 or a WGF Zeppelin Staaken, you can handle a WGS B-17 too, wingman. ;)

Extended crew damage seems to be a must have for those heavies.

[Marechallannes]

Okay, just confirmed with Ares, for the standard Lanc, the 2nd firing arc is the white circle. On the dam buster, there is no number 3 firing arc.

Thank you for this clarification, Herr Oberst.

:salute:

I'll order next month.

:money:




Do we know anything about the (planed) map lay-over-pieces for the Lancaster dam buster version?

[Flying Officer Kyte]

That clinches it for me also Keith.
Rob.

[OldGuy59]

Nice plane card Mike, but I'm afraid your Lancaster isn't in the middle of the card, is respectively too small.

Another try?

137857

I've put the #3 firing arc over the stats boxes to provide better sight lines. Comments?

Mike :)

[Marechallannes]

Perfect, Mike. :thumbsup:


...again:

Does anyone know if in the dambuster special pack map tiles are included? :confused:

A dam for example...

[Oberst Hajj]

Does anyone know if in the dambuster special pack map tiles are included? :confused:

A dam for example...

Yes, I just found out. It is going to be a double sided paper poster designed to work as an overlay to the City Game mat. It will measure 21cm x 30cm and you will place it over the city portion of that mat. Side A (shown below) is of the Eder dam and Side B will be of the Moehne dam.

http://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=138115&d=1406219656


Enjoy!

[tikkifriend]

OOOH Happy days :):

[Flying Officer Kyte]

What a corker.:clap:
:eek:I guess I'll have to get two planes now.:slysmile:
Rob.

[Black Sheep One]

What a corker.:clap:
:eek:I guess I'll have to get two planes now.:slysmile:
Rob.

Okay... How do I convince SWMBO that I need Lancasters as well... Hmmm :hmm:

[Black Sheep One]

Another try?

137857

I've put the #3 firing arc over the stats boxes to provide better sight lines. Comments?

Mike :)

Well done, Mike, well done...

[Naharaht]

It would be better if the overlay was made of thin plastic but I dare say we can all dig out a roll of 'sticky backed plastic', with which to cover the paper one.

[Marechallannes]

Cool maps, Herr Oberst. :thumbsup:

Thank you for the information.

[alpine]

Just placed my preorder!

[Marechallannes]

Order placed... :money:

[Nightbomber]

Order placed... :money:

So now you can start inventing Prague 2015 Big Birds scenario, old Friend;) Can't wait to shoot down some big ducks :embarrass:or escort them. But not to fly them :lol:

[Marechallannes]

I had a look on the special pack at the ARES GAMES hompage.

There's a two-sided bonus map in each special pack.

Lancaster "dambuster" version has dams. All other bombers have maps of industrial complexes. :thumbsup:

As well as I expected a historic city center map for the second Lancaster bomber "Grog's the Shot". :erk:

http://www.aresgames.eu/games/ww2-wings-of-glory-line/ww2-wings-of-glory-special-packs/avro-lancaster-b-mk-iii-grogs-the-shot

[TGalante]

Anyone know what the special rules are?

[Marechallannes]

Same as the extra rules in the He.111 & B-25 special packs, I think.

How to handle engine damage with a 4 engined bomber, etc...

[Oberst Hajj]

I thought I posted some place that the target "cards" are going to be 21x30 paper posters designed to be placed over the city on the city map. Here is the Eder dam (the other side is the Moehne dam):

http://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=138115&d=1406219656

The Ares logo is only on these online images, not the actual products.

[Dan-Sam]

Hope that some other than me would be like play Lancasters during Operation Chastice - the vision of exact corridor scare me even with minis. Respects to crews :salute:

[Naharaht]

The Dambuster will need some low flying rules because the bouncing bombs were dropped from 60 feet.

[Xen]

These B17's make me want Me 262's / 163's etc so badly... Its funny though, because the movement cards would have to be even bigger than the late war fighters release, they would need a bigger box!

What sort of table space do you think we'll be needing for these bombers!?! iIn terms of Wings of Glory mats.. what do you expect will be the minimum to properly fly around these massive birds!?

[Marechallannes]

I think the 3 regular gaming mats would be a perfect choice.


The bombers come in over the costal side, cross the country and bomb the city/industrial complex/dam on the city map.

I don't think the heavies ars good curve fighters I would let them fly straight out of the smaller edge of the map, turn them around for 180 degrees and let them fly the same way straigth to the home base.

[Xen]

That makes good sense... give your attacking force time to form back up for another crack..

[Xen]

I wonder what other bombers might be considered in the future.. I would LOVE some PE2's or TU 2's.. but Im guessing a Japanese bomber would take priority..
Vickers Wellington? Dornier 17?

Somehow I don't expect we'll be seeing a Kondor or Sunderland..

[Marechallannes]

A Japanese medium bomber would be cool.

[Black Sheep One]

A Japanese medium bomber would be cool.

Oh yes, I would love to have a few Bettys in my collection!

[Marechallannes]

Of course, we need food for our Pacific fighters, Randy. ;)

Ares, where are the promised F4U Corsairs!! :mad:

[Black Sheep One]

Of course, we need food for our Pacific fighters, Randy. ;)

Ares, where are the promised F4U Corsairs!! :mad:

Sven, as I wait for Ares, I found this: http://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/showthread.php?19329-F4U-Corsair-fair-bet-to-use-P-deck&p=313029&viewfull=1#post313029

Got 3 more coming! :thumbsup:

[Boney10]

Do17 & JU88 please :)

[Naharaht]

Zvezda produce a /200 scale model kit of a Ju88. There is another thread on this site discussing 1/182 scale Betty models, which are available from Model Power.
http://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/showthread.php?18044-Has-anyone-come-across-these-items-please&highlight=Betty

[Jager]

Zvezda produce a /200 scale model kit of a Ju88. [/URL]

Still not available in the States, as near as I can find :(
However, AIM has almost everything mentioned here (no Kondors or Sunderlands, but you could ask Clipper about those ;))
And yes, Sven: he has Corsairs, both F4U-1A and F4U-1D models. $4.00 is a good price.
Not shrilling for his business, but he has expanded his offerings in the last 2-3 years, so I wonder if demand from WGS players is driving it? ;)
Karl

Karl

[Boney10]

Zvezda produce a /200 scale model kit of a Ju88. There is another thread on this site discussing 1/182 scale Betty models, which are available from Model Power.
http://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/showthread.php?18044-Has-anyone-come-across-these-items-please&highlight=Betty

Got some zvezda Ju88 and some AIM JU88 & Do17s, but would really like to see some official ones

[Jager]

Got some zvezda Ju88 and some AIM JU88 & Do17s, but would really like to see some official ones

well, frankly, I would too. Just don't know how long we need to wait :hmm:
Karl

[Пилот]

These B17's make me want Me 262's / 163's etc so badly... Its funny though, because the movement cards would have to be even bigger than the late war fighters release, they would need a bigger box!

What sort of table space do you think we'll be needing for these bombers!?! iIn terms of Wings of Glory mats.. what do you expect will be the minimum to properly fly around these massive birds!?
I'm crying for M-262s and Fw 190s for a long time, but nobody seems to care :cry: ;)

[csadn]

I'm crying for M-262s and Fw 190s for a long time, but nobody seems to care :cry: ;)

WW2 needs Me-262s the way WW1 needs Fokker D.VIIs.... >:)

[Jager]

WW2 needs Me-262s the way WW1 needs Fokker D.VIIs.... >:)

Exactly right. :slysmile:

Karl

[Oberst Hajj]

WW2 needs Me-262s the way WW1 needs Fokker D.VIIs.... >:)

To increase sells? lol

[Diamondback]

Hey, at least the D.VII had a long period of combat service, unlike the Wunderwaffen...

[csadn]

To increase sells? lol

Funny way to spell "to appease the Munchkins", but.... >:)

[Oberst Hajj]

In the case of the D.VII and the 262, I think both are historically important enough planes to warrant a mini release for them. I'm less convinced about the merit of the Fokker D.VIII though. To me, that one smells of Munchkin-ism a little.



I think they should release the 262 in a dual set with Chuck Yeager's P-51 "Glamorous Glennis III".

"The first time I ever saw a jet, I shot it down." Chuck Yeager.

[Black Sheep One]

I think they should release the 262 in a dual set with Chuck Yeager's P-51 "Glamorous Glennis III".

"The first time I ever saw a jet, I shot it down." Chuck Yeager.

Capital idea! :thumbsup:

[Dan-Sam]

Magic the Gathering has sometimes a special funny edition (silver or gold edges). A special edition of Wunderwaffen for WGS would be nice one time. Maybe Me.262, Gloster Meteor, some Japaneese kamikaze machine and Do.335 Pfeil? Just brainstorming, do not take me serious :)

[Flying Officer Kyte]

I think they should release the 262 in a dual set with Chuck Yeager's P-51 "Glamorous Glennis III".

"The first time I ever saw a jet, I shot it down." Chuck Yeager.

Hear hear, Chuck sounds like my sort of chap Keith.
Rob.

[csadn]

Hear hear, Chuck sounds like my sort of chap Keith.
Rob.

He's a nice guy -- I speak from experience. ;)

I'm in agreement with the idea of keeping the jets as "specials"; they looked and sounded impressive, but really didn't have a bearing on the conflict (Denis Leary: "Too little, too f***in' late, pal").

[milcoll73]

In the case of the D.VII and the 262, I think both are historically important enough planes to warrant a mini release for them. I'm less convinced about the merit of the Fokker D.VIII though. To me, that one smells of Munchkin-ism a little.



I think they should release the 262 in a dual set with Chuck Yeager's P-51 "Glamorous Glennis III".

"The first time I ever saw a jet, I shot it down." Chuck Yeager.





i like that idea!!!

[Marechallannes]

Hey, at least the D.VII had a long period of combat service, unlike the Wunderwaffen...

Me 262 stood in combat from mid 1944 to May 1945.

Fokker D.VII from April 1918 to Nov 1918.


We can't generalize the term Wunderwaffen.

[Kaiser]

I will attend the SPIEL 2014 games fair in Essen at saturday. It seem that i will be able to pick up some of the Vier-Mots :)

[Oberst Hajj]

Me 262 stood in combat from mid 1944 to May 1945.

Fokker D.VII from April 1918 to Nov 1918.


We can't generalize the term Wunderwaffen.

I wonder what a combat sortie comparison would show between those two planes?


I will attend the SPIEL 2014 games fair in Essen at saturday. It seem that i will be able to pick up some of the Vier-Mots :)

I think this might be the first opportunity for us to see the final production models... please take lots of pics and share with us.

[Kaiser]

I will see what i can. They are listed as 30€ and 35€.

[Oberst Hajj]

I'm surprised at the two different prices. Is one of the planes that much larger than the other?

[P-51D]

I am really excited for these! We are now roughly two weeks from November. Are theses still on track for a November release? If so, early in the month or late?

[LOOP]

Even if the dambuster Lancaster is a beuty and an important piece of history, isn't it a bit...... limited in its use in a game?
I don't play the WWII version of the game but if I did I'd rather get two "Grog's" that one of each.

[Oberst Hajj]

With everyone from Ares at SPIEL this week, I doubt we get any updates at all.

[Marechallannes]

Even if the dambuster Lancaster is a beuty and an important piece of history, isn't it a bit...... limited in its use in a game?
I don't play the WWII version of the game but if I did I'd rather get two "Grog's" that one of each.

We'll see. ;)

We have Bf.110s and Beaufighters in black.

With the Lancasters - all you need for an "at ease" night fight.

[Nightbomber]

Even if the dambuster Lancaster is a beuty and an important piece of history, isn't it a bit...... limited in its use in a game?
I don't play the WWII version of the game but if I did I'd rather get two "Grog's" that one of each.

Right.
As I play both versions of the game I can understand Sven's love for the Lancs (which are beautiful planes, no doubt about it), I too think their game usage IS and will be VERY, VERY limited. What bothers me is the ARES publishing policy in the matter. I can understand that US market soaks 60% of their products, thus B-17, P-38, P-51s are their priorities, but I can not understand and will not understand their plane choices AT ALL, when they use their resources to provide the community with planes like Lancasters and we still do not have some of the most popular WGS planes like: Bf 109 F/G, Ki-43 Hayabusa, Il-2 Sturmovik, Macchi 200, 202, Spitfires V, Fw 190A and of course MOSQUITOS or even Japanese medium bombers, to mention the few. [Insted of those ARES will publish Me 410, that saw very little action at all]. I bet their sells would vastly increase with the planes I mentioned. Personally I would bought at least 20 of such models, but I will never ever buy a single Lanc, for I do not think anybody of my group, including me would like to play with it. Night fights? How? And what for? Managing Lanc's crew? Not fun at all.
I am sorry Sven;) I will eventually play as a fighter against a Lanc, but only when you would run the game in Prague:)

[P-51D]

Right.
As I play both versions of the game I can understand Sven's love for the Lancs (which are beautiful planes, no doubt about it), I too think their game usage IS and will be VERY, VERY limited. What bothers me is the ARES publishing policy in the matter. I can understand that US market soaks 60% of their products, thus B-17, P-38, P-51s are their priorities, but I can not understand and will not understand their plane choices AT ALL, when they use their resources to provide the community with planes like Lancasters and we still do not have some of the most popular WGS planes like: Bf 109 F/G, Ki-43 Hayabusa, Il-2 Sturmovik, Macchi 200, 202, Spitfires V, Fw 190A and of course MOSQUITOS or even Japanese medium bombers, to mention the few. [Insted of those ARES will publish Me 410, that saw very little action at all]. I bet their sells would vastly increase with the planes I mentioned. Personally I would bought at least 20 of such models, but I will never ever buy a single Lanc, for I do not think anybody of my group, including me would like to play with it. Night fights? How? And what for? Managing Lanc's crew? Not fun at all.
I am sorry Sven;) I will eventually play as a fighter against a Lanc, but only when you would run the game in Prague:)

I can understand your frustration. As an American, I can say I am ecstatic to see so many of the American planes finally be released over the last couple years. When all we had to represent America through the first couple of sets was a Wildcat, I have to say I was up in arms! The problem with only doing 4 units at a time is that somebody ultimately always gets left out. Every plane you listed as proposed releases is high on my wish list, very high in most cases. I do find the Axis choices for series 7 a tad odd myself. Why pick the Tojo over the Oscar? The only thing I can think of is the fact that the Tojo ended up being a great interceptor over the Japanese homeland during the B-29s raids late in the war. The same goes for the ME-410, it was an interceptor. But still, I get and agree with your frustration. We are getting the Heavies in the next 45-60 days, however we won't be seeing series 7 for at least a year and more than likely a year and half. While there are plenty of other aircraft to take on the Heavies, the argument that series 7 is in support of the Heavies release comes across to me anyway, as quite a stretch. I am not saying that Keith or those at Ares are lying to us, there is no reason to believe that, it is simply the long delays between releases at times can make this seem unlikely to matter much as far as synergy to sell more aircraft. That being said, Ares and for that matter keith know a lot more than I do, so perhaps they will be able to bring series 7 to market a lot faster than anticipated by prior release schedules. If we aren't going to see series 6 until May/June 2015, then the Midway/BOB make sense as a late 2015 release. Where does that put series 7? Early 2016 at best. Perhaps, they will just dump a bunch all on the market in a couple of months and let us start complaining about how we can't afford to keep up. One thing I have learned about table top gaming is if it isn't one thing, it is another!! There will always be something to laud and always something to gripe about!

I say bring em all on! As fast as they can manage!

[Oberst Hajj]

I can understand your frustration. As an American, I can say I am ecstatic to see so many of the American planes finally be released over the last couple years. When all we had to represent America through the first couple of sets was a Wildcat, I have to say I was up in arms! The problem with only doing 4 units at a time is that somebody ultimately always gets left out. Every plane you listed as proposed releases is high on my wish list, very high in most cases. I do find the Axis choices for series 7 a tad odd myself. Why pick the Tojo over the Oscar? The only thing I can think of is the fact that the Tojo ended up being a great interceptor over the Japanese homeland during the B-29s raids late in the war. The same goes for the ME-410, it was an interceptor. But still, I get and agree with your frustration. We are getting the Heavies in the next 45-60 days, however we won't be seeing series 7 for at least a year and more than likely a year and half. While there are plenty of other aircraft to take on the Heavies, the argument that series 7 is in support of the Heavies release comes across to me anyway, as quite a stretch. I am not saying that Keith or those at Ares are lying to us, there is no reason to believe that, it is simply the long delays between releases at times can make this seem unlikely to matter much as far as synergy to sell more aircraft. That being said, Ares and for that matter keith know a lot more than I do, so perhaps they will be able to bring series 7 to market a lot faster than anticipated by prior release schedules. If we aren't going to see series 6 until May/June 2015, then the Midway/BOB make sense as a late 2015 release. Where does that put series 7? Early 2016 at best. Perhaps, they will just dump a bunch all on the market in a couple of months and let us start complaining about how we can't afford to keep up. One thing I have learned about table top gaming is if it isn't one thing, it is another!! There will always be something to laud and always something to gripe about!

I say bring em all on! As fast as they can manage!


Getting the heavies now is part game play and part marketing.

Game play
By giving intoroducing heavies into the game, they give players more scenario options. More and different fighters are always great, but the game play does not change... just more dogfights. Besides just scenario options, the heavies give the option for a more complete campaign possiblity. We don't have all the needed fighters yet to play from start to finish, but you can fudge the figher part with current released minis... not so much if heavies don't even exist.

Marketing
Just like high performance sports cars for a car company, these heavies give WGS some much needed eye candy. The 1/200 scale means everything is small out on the table and these large planes will help draw attention to said table. This plays very well in to games ran at Conventions... something Ares is wanting to encorage as it helps grow the game.

As for how long it will take Series 7 to come to market, I think Ares actually plans for two releases per year. But as we know, production delays (for whatever reason) keep this from happening. Even production bandwidth could be a hurttle for them. But as a company, Ares has to look at the game as a system, not as individual releases. Even if it takes 2 years to get complamentry planes out, they still have to come out.

For the Lanc, I would not be surprised to see official night fight rules released in the next 2 years. They are slowing giving us the minis to do night missions, so it seems like a natural step for them to take... once again giving more varity to game play.

[Nightbomber]

Getting the heavies now is part game play and part marketing.

Game play
By giving intoroducing heavies into the game, they give players more scenario options. More and different fighters are always great, but the game play does not change... just more dogfights. Besides just scenario options, the heavies give the option for a more complete campaign possiblity. We don't have all the needed fighters yet to play from start to finish, but you can fudge the figher part with current released minis... not so much if heavies don't even exist.

Marketing
Just like high performance sports cars for a car company, these heavies give WGS some much needed eye candy. The 1/200 scale means everything is small out on the table and these large planes will help draw attention to said table. This plays very well in to games ran at Conventions... something Ares is wanting to encorage as it helps grow the game.

As for how long it will take Series 7 to come to market, I think Ares actually plans for two releases per year. But as we know, production delays (for whatever reason) keep this from happening. Even production bandwidth could be a hurttle for them. But as a company, Ares has to look at the game as a system, not as individual releases. Even if it takes 2 years to get complamentry planes out, they still have to come out.

For the Lanc, I would not be surprised to see official night fight rules released in the next 2 years. They are slowing giving us the minis to do night missions, so it seems like a natural step for them to take... once again giving more varity to game play.

Sounds reasonably:)
Not every player must like the heavies and play them:D
If it is - as you wrote - good for Ares and the giants would draw newcomers' attention, then why not?
Fortunately there is a well developed "unofficial" market of the minis ;).
What I find a real change and a marketing HIT is Aerodrome Accessories ;) move to produce unofficial planes' bases! :clap: Ju 88, SM 79, Fiat Br 20 and even the Blohm&Voss! Order placed!

[Ragnar200]

There are probably a whole bunch of issues intertwined here. As a plane nut I see the question as how rapidly Ares can hit the market with something approximating a representative collection. That brings us back to Blackronin's posts about important planes from the fighting powers in WWII. A couple of hundred types would do the job. A hundred would establish a powerful bridgehead. A big selection of planes as nice as the WoG would effectively ensure total domination of the market for a generation. The question for Ares and their distributors is whether that is financially viable. The prototyping, tooling, finishing, packaging and shipping requirements for a WoG model make introducing large selections very costly.

Bringing out something like a dozen (or fewer, as Keith writes) new models per year, split between WWI and WWII has to be considered as an experiment. If Ares recovers its costs between new offerings, any failures will not kill them. Once you get down to a handful of new types per year, how might you as a producer make the choices? Should you be guided by fame and achievements, which would call for a whole bunch of Mustangs, Spitfires, 109's, 190's, Sturmoviks? Maybe numerical importance? Add in the B-24, B-17, Halifax, and other aircraft produced in huge quantities. As a game-oriented producer, I am a bit surprised we are not seeing selections built around game scenarios. A B-17F or B-17G is a natural centerpiece for a selection built around the 8th AF, with companions representing AAF and RAF escorts and Luftwaffe adversaries. The Lancaster brings up the Blind Man's Buff of massed night raids, but it also (by simply changing bomb bay fairings and ordnance,) lets you reenact all the Tallboy and Grand Slam missions. Those likewise call for a distinctive set of support pieces. Just trying to hit the Tirpitz in a deep fjord and protected with torpedo nets would be a gaming challenge. ( If you were as perverse as I, you would wait until your buddy builds a Tirpitz and then send him a homemade X-Craft Royal Navy midget sub, which actually sealed the fate of the battleship by planting explosive charges under the keel.)

I really like the models and will keep ordering regardless. But at a few a year I could get even more annuated waiting for particular treasures.

Andrzej, please tell us more about the new "unofficial" releases.

Ron

[Nightbomber]

Andrzej, please tell us more about the new "unofficial" releases.

Ron

Thanks for your interesting remarks, Ron.
I meant 1/200 planes sourced from Shapeways, AIM and Zvezda, which offer some interesting choices.
I already have (if memory serves well) 3-8 pieces of:
Shapeways: I-16, PZL P-11, PZL P-24, Spitfire V trop, Bf 109 F/Early G,
AIM: Fw-190A, Ki-48 Lily, Ki-43 Hayabusa, Nakajima Kate, Dauntless, Fiat Br 20, Mc 200, Hs 129, Airacobra.
Zvezda: Ju 52, Ju 88.
Painting and decalling them is part of the fun:).

[Flying Officer Kyte]

These are the WW2 bases, unofficial and official, that the Oberst has produced so far Ron.

http://www.aerodromeaccessories.com/index.php/flight-stands/wwii.html

Rob.

[Ragnar200]

Good for all to know about those. I'm looking for the database of 1:200 aircraft. It is only a bit dated, and it will help everyone find bits that they need.

[Marechallannes]

Good point Ron, those Tirpitz and U-Boot shelter attacks with the Lancasters.

The eye candy is another argument [I]Herr Oberst[/] and I would like to see night fight rules.


The problem I see with (masses of) alternative miniatures: No plane cards, no movement decks, no original bases, etc...

I like my minis in Nexus/Ares style: complete with all you need to play. A table full of replacements isn't that attractive in my opinion.


I don't understand why each WGS announcement is in immediate company with statements like: Why not this mini instead of this mini and I wish this model, etc...

I think we all handle the new series the same. If you like the mini, you buy it.

...and in general I have to say that the quality, equipment and price of an Ares Games WGS mini is that nice that I buy models even if I didn't prefer that mini much, when they announced it. I took me half a year to buy two night fighter Bf.110s and a night fighter Bristol Beau for example. ;)

The announced Judy bomber of series 6 is such a plane. Of course we get another small Jap bomber but If I imagine, how cool those will look beside the KI 84 Franks. :thumbsup:

[LOOP]

We'll see. ;)

We have Bf.110s and Beaufighters in black.

With the Lancasters - all you need for an "at ease" night fight.

I just might have been a little misunderstod here...
I have nothing against the Lancaster or the release of some in WoGS. It's just the DAMBUSTER-version.
How many missions did this version fly? Two? I draw parallells with the Sopwith Snipe in WoGF. It flew for some 47 days and everybody are hating (or just don't want it....) it.
But now everybody just love an aircraft that flew for two???
I do understand that a Dambuster is eye candy but I like my aircrafts... well... more multipurposed. A paintscheme is possible to alter (by all of you brilliant artist out there) but the dambuster will allways be
a dambuster.

Just a thought.....
P-G

[LOOP]

Hoping not getting my head cut of for this :surrender:

[Marechallannes]

No, you're well out of range, Per-Gunnar. ;)


Just change to the dark side (WGS) and you'll see clearer. :serious:


The dambuster Lancs executed exactly one mission.

Do you know how much missions the Doolittle B-25 Mitchell solved?

Why should this be an obstacle to buy or play this mini?

(...and don't forget the nice dam target card)

[LOOP]

No, you're well out of range, Per-Gunnar. ;)


Just change to the dark side (WGS) and you'll see clearer. :serious:


The dambuster Lancs executed exactly one mission.

Do you know how much missions the Doolittle B-25 Mitchell solved?

Why should this be an obstacle to buy or play this mini?

(...and don't forget the nice dam target card)

Well nothing of course. Every AC made to the WoG is an individual AC that flew for, a day, a week, a month, a mission, but that is not my point. As long as the AC is a "standard" you can alter it to
fit your personal taste.
The Dambuster Lancaster is a specialversion made only for one thing. And it is altered to fit that one thing. Without its dorsal turret and with the special fitting of the drumbomb it is (to me anyhow)
limited in its use.
I may be a bit cruel but if you make a senario with the dambuster Lanc you.... blow up a dam or .... blow up a dam......or blow up a DAM!!

I'm not trying to be a drag. Just speaking my mind...

Sorry if I offend anyone....

[Nightbomber]

Well nothing of course. Every AC made to the WoG is an individual AC that flew for, a day, a week, a month, a mission, but that is not my point. As long as the AC is a "standard" you can alter it to
fit your personal taste.
The Dambuster Lancaster is a specialversion made only for one thing. And it is altered to fit that one thing. Without its dorsal turret and with the special fitting of the drumbomb it is (to me anyhow)
limited in its use.
I may be a bit cruel but if you make a senario with the dambuster Lanc you.... blow up a dam or .... blow up a dam......or blow up a DAM!!

I'm not trying to be a drag. Just speaking my mind...

Sorry if I offend anyone....

Respect, Sven:)
But I am totally with Per-Gunnar this time.
What I like in both games is the social fun factor, plus ease of play, plus their flexibility, giving players a full scope of creativity.
Lancs and DamBuster Lanc specifically is the contrary of all of the above.
Fly one mission to a dam, fly straight, manage 7 crewmen and 4 engines and drop the bomb sooner or later. It is as fun and exciting as piloting a cupboard. :erk:
Not my cup of tea as a casual gamer-pilot.

[LOOP]

Thank you for the support :thumbsup:

[Flying Officer Kyte]

Got to agree there Andy.
It's far more fun to shoot bombers down than to fly them.
The only reason I'm getting one of each is because of the Iconic nature of the aircraft, and because there may be some mileage in using them at shows.
Rob.

[Dan-Sam]

I see a paralel with D&D. Many years ago, I ask my friend why he is a GM - his.character could not earn any XP during his story leading and he answered: someone has to be a GM because there is no fun for.you without him.

Someone just have to fly bomber...

By the way, I have no problem with dambuster Lancaster - all the mechanism are hidden under the plane, so for the first look it is OK. And answer me - who knows that one of D.VII in WGF have violet wings? Just rhetorical question... So for me: no problem with dambuster.

[Marechallannes]

Thank you Daniel, for rear cover.


...

I'm not trying to be a drag. Just speaking my mind...

Sorry if I offend anyone....

Noticed.

Treat the Dambuster version as a special WGS minature.

A tribute to an unique, exact planed, well executed WW II bombing raid and the men who flew into those bombers.


...Fly one mission to a dam, fly straight, manage 7 crewmen and 4 engines and drop the bomb sooner or later. It is as fun and exciting as piloting a cupboard. :erk:

Not my cup of tea as a casual gamer-pilot.

Why not?

I once spottet a Norwegian Gladiator in a bombing raid with a He.111.

Why not spot a Lancaster without a top turret in a misson? :minis:

[LOOP]

Well as allways. It fun to argue ;)
And even if we disagree aboute the use, we can at least agree upon the looks. The Lancasters are splendid :thumbsup:
Have fun with them :pint:

[Oberst Hajj]

What I find a real change and a marketing HIT is Aerodrome Accessories ;) move to produce unofficial planes' bases! :clap: Ju 88, SM 79, Fiat Br 20 and even the Blohm&Voss! Order placed!

Thanks. Only time will tell. So far the three of you that like them, like them pretty well. lol

[Oberst Hajj]

I'm expecting the normal Lanc to out sell the Dam Lanc abour 2 or 3 to 1. I can only see me needing 2x normal and 1x Dam for convention games... and I'd run that Dam Lanc as a normal in most of those games. Until the night fighting rules come out (if they ever do) I don't see the Lanc getting much table time at all.

[Teaticket]

Well as allways. It fun to argue ;)
And even if we disagree aboute the use, we can at least agree upon the looks. The Lancasters are splendid :thumbsup:
Have fun with them :pint:

I'm getting one of each. I will use the Dambuster as a regular Lanc when needed. :eek: I know, blasphemy for some! Through my decades gaming I have wanted to play battles I didn't have the correct figures for. Do I wait months/years to play the battle while I paint what is correct or substitute in what I have? (Napoleonics/SYW/ Ancients/WW2...) I try to get as much correct as possible but am not afraid to substitute in some.

Thanks for pointing out the new bases Andy. Off to the Aerodrome shop....

[Ragnar200]

My personal assessment is that almost all modellers (build, chop, and paint people) are closet collectors. Otherwise we would not accumulate models and kits and supplies much faster than we complete models. That's OK. We live with it and enjoy it. Under 10% of the kits made are EVER built. If we did not accumulate the hobby industry would collapse. We also need to recognize the fine line separating the collector from the pathologic hoarder. It is more than my perspective versus the viewpoint of my mother-in-law in full self-righteous dudgeon. I keep coming back to the play factor. We get a bigger and more lasting bang out of mini's that are assembled and finished enough to play with.

We are touching here on the fundamental issue of what a model should represent.

Part of the issue is how specific to be about the sub-types and mod's of an aircraft type. Looking at the Lancaster, for which the SAM monograph is a wonderful resource, the basic airframe was manufactured in 4-5 visibly different configurations (radial engines, Merlin engines, the Lancastrian transport, and a variety of stripped down Lancaster Specials). The Lanc Specials, in turn, differed in bomb bay fairings, the exposed ordnance, whether the nose and dorsal turrets were faired over. The model producer cannot offer every possible variation. Someplace along the line the customer has to be willing to drag the model kicking and screaming to the work bench and have his/her way with it. We made 5 different Lanc's as HBM models, and there must be at least another dozen extant. We will shortly have instant access to the two Ares Lanc's. I call this a Golden Age.

Same general issue has been raised with regard to the specificity of finish. Go to an IPMS contest and you will see an aircraft that can only have had one pilot, represented on one day, before or after painstakingly applied dirt, damage, or repairs were applied. (Listen to the contestants argue about infinitesimal details of the non-visible aft control cables! Watch them jump and scream when you pick up the model and simulate a strafing run across the contest table! Hear how you just got paynim fingerprints on a model on which the builder has spent a few hundred hours!) At the other extreme of detail, go visit your local armoury or base and watch the lads and lasses do CP or sand table exercises using models painted a monocolour shade of gray (for which I am told there are now several hundred variations). Who's correct? I would argue that it is so easy and inexpensive to customize with decals, hobby paints, and weathering that we should respect the producer's choices.

I finally found a version of Chris Sayer's 1/200 model database. I will post that as a new thread later today. There will be a Word document explaining all the abbreviations, and then an Excel spread sheet containing the actual data.

Have a great weekend.

Ron

[Angiolillo]

Yes, the Dambusters Lancaster has all you need for a dam attack.

148109148110148112

[Oberst Hajj]

Cool play test photos Andrea.

[7eat51]

I greatly appreciate the detailed orientation of many of my fellow members and wingmen; I learn a lot from them and really enjoy looking at their fine modeling skills. As for the folks I play with, I think all of them would look at the dam-busting Lancaster, for example, think it looks cool, hear a little history about it, think it is cooler, and then forget about it once the game begins, however the Lancaster is being used in the scenario. This has been a growing realization for me. It is causing me to rethink how I am collecting planes and ships (SoG).

I enjoy collecting due to the aesthetics and the history reflected in the color schemes and markings. I am wondering, however, how expansive a collection I need, especially given other interests and responsibilities. Do I need planes painted in North African schemes to play a North Africa scenario? No. Do I need the correct versions of the given planes? No. Would I enjoy having such a collection? Yes. Am I going to work toward such a collection? Not sure anymore. The one collection I would like to have, and will continue to pursue, is the Polish-Soviet War. This is due to several reasons, all personal. As for building my collection in the future, the main criteria is plane type variation that enables different types of scenarios; though, even here, I can substitute planes if push comes to shove.

[7eat51]

Uli posted some pictures on the Anchorage of these planes at Essen: http://sailsofglory.org/showthread.php?2840-Spiel-2014-in-Essen

[csadn]

Yes, the Dambusters Lancaster has all you need for a dam attack.

Truly the most impressive mini by a dam site.

>:)

[Marechallannes]

If you like Lancasters, you'll spend the money for a dam version, too.

I'm pretty shure. ;)


I wonder about the silence of our British WGS friends here. (Beside honorable Flying Officer Kyte, of course.)

[Marechallannes]

Cool play test photos Andrea.

Yes.

Nice pictures, Andrea. :thumbsup:

[Jager]

Uli posted some pictures on the Anchorage of these planes at Essen: http://sailsofglory.org/showthread.php?2840-Spiel-2014-in-Essen

Given the "database" issues with the Anchorage, could you post them here?
Karl

[Oberst Hajj]

Here is the pic from the Anchorage...

148123

[Angiolillo]

Here a detail of the lower floor (hoping not being too OT):

148126

[Guntruck]

Here a detail of the lower floor (hoping not being too OT):

148126

For general release when exactly?

[Jager]

For general release when exactly?

Always a good question, Gunners ;)
Karl

[Angiolillo]

But I never have good answers. Please check the upcoming pages on Ares' site, where they are not listed yet.

[Thunderbolt]

Hi guys,

Am I correct that big birds will have overall decals camo? I've just noticed that on "Memphis Belle", but I'm not sure.

[Blackronin]

Hi guys,

Am I correct that big birds will have overall decals camo? I've just noticed that on "Memphis Belle", but I'm not sure.

I hope not...

[BobP]

I check the ARES site and just see a Nov release. Any idea of when in Nov the bombers will be released?

[Jager]

I check the ARES site and just see a Nov release. Any idea of when in Nov the bombers will be released?

15-DEC-14?

[Doug]

With the Dam buster Lancaster, it opens a wide range of conversion possibilities, the 1st one I am going to do is a Lanc model with a 10,000 pdr Tall boy bomb for a sink the the German battleship in the fiords of Norway. No the model in my view has lots of potential.

[Ragnar200]

We made alternative bomb bay fillets and a Tallboy for the Lancaster Special. Anybody want copies?

Come to think of it Dave Schmid/AIM is making reissues of my whole HBM Lancaster. Might make at least as much sense as chopping a $25+ finished model. Dave has the HBM Halifaxes and Stirling too.

Ron

[LOOP]

My personal assessment is that almost all modellers (build, chop, and paint people) are closet collectors.

You have a Point there. I know for I am one. But still..... I stand by my thoughts on the Dambuster as a gamingpiece.

[Ragnar200]

It's all in how you look at it. We're all "correct". I look at the Ares Lancasters and think about what wonderful starting points they would be for Manchesters or maybe the Orenda-Iroquois jet engine test plane. The Canadian in me gets all warm and fuzzy picturing a Lanc with that much thrust augmentation. Creative wizards like Clipper Dave may already be plotting new uses for four Merlin engines, two rudders, a funny looking barrel, and a gaming stand.

Have you connected up with the Swedish 1/200 collector group? A great group of guys and some wonderful collections. Meetings are generally around Stockholm, but members visit from as far as Copenhagen.

Are you familiar with the 1/200 scale models by Eskader? They made a nice set of white metal aircraft during and maybe after WWII, and then some metal models of Swedish jets that were used by the air force.

Ron

[Caveman]

If the Dambuster is an easy really an easy mission, it might be a great way for a beginner to learn how to fly bombers.

Doug, I really like your idea for the "conversion possibilities."

[Angiolillo]

It is a gradual scenario (or two double scenarios if you prefer). There is a mission of a single plane against an undefended dam (Eder dam) whose aim is to hit the dam with the bouncing bomb; the full scenario in which you have to destroy the dam within three attacks (representing the planes AJ-L, AJ-Z, AJ-N - you need two bombs on the dam to destroy it) and even better within two so that the third one can be used on another target; the quick scenario against Möhne dam that's defended by AA guns, and the full scenario against it with five attacks available (planes AJ-G, AJ-M, AJ-P, AJ-A and AJ-J) trying to use as less planes as possible.

[Flying Officer Kyte]

Sounds fine to me Andrea. It might be nice if I re-badge a couple as the other planes in the attack group though! then we can have several kids at an event making the run one after the other.
Rob.

[Angiolillo]

Well yes, I did the cheap trick of telling people that they can use again the same Lancaster coming to the table more than once to simulate the attacks of different planes (my family coms from Genoa, they are famed to value money as much as Scottish people up there and it would be a bit too much to ask everybody to buy 5 Dambusters for such a scenario).
In any case, in the Möhne dam full scenario AJ-G, if she survives her attack, can be present besides other planes in furher attacks to attract AA fire, as she historically did - at least a second miniature can be handy (Genoan, Scottish and other savings-oriented players can use the airplane card instead to simulate this second plane on the table).

[Marechallannes]

I really can't wait to get those beauties in my greedy hands... :pray:

[Naharaht]

How easy would it be to produce a Tallboy/Grand Slam conversion kit for the Dambuster Lancaster?

[Angiolillo]

It could be a feasible subject for a reprint, if the actual released planes go well enough.

[Flying Officer Kyte]

Well yes, I did the cheap trick of telling people that they can use again the same Lancaster coming to the table more than once to simulate the attacks of different planes (my family coms from Genoa, they are famed to value money as much as Scottish people up there and it would be a bit too much to ask everybody to buy 5 Dambusters for such a scenario).


Bearing in mind my Scottish Great Grandmother, I could just bring one re badged aircraft to an event and rely on other members bringing their aircraft.;)
Rob.

[Jager]

Bearing in mind my Scottish Great Grandmother, I could just bring one re badged aircraft to an event and rely on other members bringing their aircraft.;)
Rob.

The nice thing about gaming with like-minded groups is sharing resources. We've done this at Origins quite a bit (Tom: how many He-111s did we put on the table last year? :eek:)
Karl

[BobP]

I see the ARES site is still down. The bombers are due out in Nov. Any idea when this month?

[OldGuy59]

I'm on their site right now, and there isn't any dates on the release page, yet.

[Flying Officer Kyte]

Site is back up now Bob but still just says November.
Rob.

[Oberst Hajj]

If the shipment is on time, they will be landing at the warehouse early-middle of the month. So expect a release date towards the end of the month.

[Angiolillo]

The site is back. No reason to say that bombers will not be released this month.

http://www.aresgames.it/upcoming-products

[Nightbomber]

Gave up. Memphis Belle has been preordered at AA. :brickwal:

[Marechallannes]

You can rename it in "Stalingrad Beauty" ;)

[Nightbomber]

You can rename it in "Stalingrad Beauty" ;)

:D Good point! Of course you mean III World War and a 1946 scenario, assuming combined Allied, Polish and Wehrmacht forces turn East to fight the Soviets and B-17s fly to finally crush the defenders of Stalingrad. Good. I shall invent such scenario. Not commonly known is the fact that Operation "Unthinkable" was an option taken into account...

[Angiolillo]

149736

[BobP]

Thanks for the replies and that the site is back up. Looks like they will be out sometime this month so an early Christmas present.

[Nightbomber]

149736

Thanks Andrea:)
But it would be kind of pervertive to repaint ANY of the ARES's B-17s into this one :D
How did you find this Polish graphic :confused::)

[P-51D]

It seems like these bad boys are getting closer to my hangers with each and every day!!

[BobP]

Just looked and the date is 19 Nov. Looks like they will be out soon.

[Nightbomber]

Just looked and the date is 19 Nov. Looks like they will be out soon.

An early Xmas game with the Memphis Belle is still possible then :)

[Yenwing]

Just looked and the date is 19 Nov. Looks like they will be out soon.

Where did you see Nov19'th?

[P-51D]

Where did you see Nov19'th?

It on Aresgames.it, Ares' homepage!! This is great news!!! I hope to be able to get some battles in over Thanksgiving break!

[Yenwing]

It on Aresgames.it, Ares' homepage!! This is great news!!! I hope to be able to get some battles in over Thanksgiving break!

I don't know why I'm not seeing it on their website, but I'll take your word for it. Awesome news!

[BobP]

Look in the UPCOMING NEWS and it says 19 Nov.

[Flying Officer Kyte]

It certainly does Bob.
Rob.

[Yenwing]

Look in the UPCOMING NEWS and it says 19 Nov.

Ahh! I looked everywhere but upcoming! Duh. Thanks and that is awesome. B17's are my favorite!

[Marechallannes]

Another good reason to buy a few Lancasters:

"This shark needs food."

http://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=150707&d=1415859394

(Picture of a new German nightfighter)

[Marechallannes]

The searchlights caught him for a moment...

http://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=150706&d=1415859394

(Picture of a new German nightfighter)

[Angiolillo]

Dambuster's pack content.

150708

[Jager]

"This shark needs food."

http://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=150707&d=1415859394

(Picture of a new German nightfighter)[/QUOTE]

The searchlights caught him for a moment...

http://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=150706&d=1415859394

(Picture of a new German nightfighter)

Nice looking one too! Good job, Sven :thumbsup:
Karl

[Marechallannes]

Thank you Karl!


Dambuster's pack content.

We should coordinate our Lancaster promotion tour better, Andrea.

Thx for posting this informations.

[Flying Officer Kyte]

Great Shark Sven, and I see Andrea is kindly providing some food for it too.;)
Rob.

[Nightbomber]

Most impressive nightfighter, Sven. I love the dim lighting of the picture;) The antennas are :thumbsup:

[Teaticket]

The searchlights caught him for a moment...

http://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=150706&d=1415859394

(Picture of a new German nightfighter)

Thats fantastic. Incredible work Sven.

[OldGuy59]

The searchlights caught him for a moment...

http://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=150706&d=1415859394

(Picture of a new German nightfighter)

Unit and crew?

You really don't need to ask why, and you shouldn't make me ask, either.

[Marechallannes]

Damn it wasn't my intention to overcrowd this Lancaster thread with picture quotes of my

Junkers Ju88 C-6
6./Nachtjagdgeschwader 4
Movement deck: M*
Front short B-C-C-C-C / long A-C-C
Rear short A / long A
Schräge Musik C-C
Crew:
OLt. Löwenherz (pilot)
Uffz. Himmel (radar)
Uffz. Schneider (radio/gunner)

:smack:


As soon as I have more pictures I'll post it in the original Ju88 painting thread.

:takecover:

[Marechallannes]

150708

So we have a special instruction for a dambuster run.

A blue template for... throwing the bomb?

A crew of (only) 3 men.

Beside the map for the dam, an industrial complex for bombing missions.


Nice.

:thumbsup:

[Angiolillo]

To keep the game simple, as usual only pilots and gunners are relevant.
There is a ruler to drop the bomb and the bomb itself, plus a "searchlights on" counter and a counter with the Y device to judge dropping distance by the eye:

150774

Then you have three rulers, one shorter than the other, numbered 1/3: they are used to move the bomb in the next three turns, bouncing shorter and shorter. Here the prototype:

150776

This is the effect to be simulated:

150775

Or if you prefer:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lCRIsjJFRNo

[Diamondback]

Yeah, but on a B-17 EVERYBODY except the pilots is a gunner either full- or part-time...

[Angiolillo]

Ok, let's say that guns are emphasized over crew. And some simplification have been made., as with B-17 nose treated as a single firing cone with two men even if the firepower takes into account several weapons. After all, it seems that player are asking to keep things simple, isn't it? ;)

[Flying Officer Kyte]

Simple is good for me Andrea.:thumbsup:
I love to discuss the intricacies of extended rules, but seldom adopt them.
It seems to negate all the things which attracted me to the game in the first place.
Rob.

[Naharaht]

It looks good. I hope that we can flatten the mat of the dam easily. How are we simulating flying the plane at an altitude of sixty feet, please?

[P-51D]

In my best Tom Petty voice, "The waiting is the hardest part!"

[Angiolillo]

You fly at altitude 1, that in the game is "just above the ground". To be sure that you fly at a constant altitude when you drop the bomb, you have to lighten two searchlight that are fixed to converge on the water when the correct altitude is kept. No sorry, the mini has not two led lights for that, we just provide a cardboard counter to keep track that they have been lighted.

[Oberst Hajj]

It looks good. I hope that we can flatten the mat of the dam easily.

This is my chief concern as well, but there should be some easily solutions to this. I'll probably copy and print out a new one so I have a nice flat one to game with. If there are any crease marks during the copying, I should be able to tidy those up in photoshop or the like.

[Nightbomber]

This is my chief concern as well, but there should be some easily solutions to this. I'll probably copy and print out a new one so I have a nice flat one to game with. If there are any crease marks during the copying, I should be able to tidy those up in photoshop or the like.

Laminating the poster could be a solution, IMHO.

[Oberst Hajj]

Laminating the poster could be a solution, IMHO.

That's one way to go. I'll most likely Laminate my new copy so that I can still remove the crease marks.

[Thomatchef]

Wasn't really convinced about these big boys, but looking at the dambuster package the intrest is starting to grow. Those Lancasters really look so niceeeeeee.

[P-51D]

Wasn't really convinced about these big boys, but looking at the dambuster package the intrest is starting to grow. Those Lancasters really look so niceeeeeee.

Give in to your temptations! NO SET OF WGS IS COMPLETE without a Lanc and Fortress in them!

[P-51D]

Do you have these in your possession yet Keith? Seeing as they are set for release this Wednesday, I am interested to know if retailers have them yet or not.

[Marechallannes]

I'm curious, too. :)

Mid December we'll organize a WGF Christmas flight.

A bonus WGS misson with a B-17 would be nice. :minis:

[Angiolillo]

If it does not arrive in time, try this...

150956

http://etronsvolants.pagesperso-orange.fr/pagecadre.htm

[Marechallannes]

Too cute, Andrea.

Try this:

[FarEast]

This is my chief concern as well, but there should be some easily solutions to this. I'll probably copy and print out a new one so I have a nice flat one to game with. If there are any crease marks during the copying, I should be able to tidy those up in photoshop or the like.

Yes Ares just need to upload the file to their homepage so it can be downloaded and printed - simple

[OldGuy59]

If it does not arrive in time, try this...

150956

http://etronsvolants.pagesperso-orange.fr/pagecadre.htm

That is an absolute scream, Andrea! I am still laughing. Pierre is a comic genius. This should be translated and posted to our Forum, or perhaps we should ask Pierre for permission to borrow? His Boom Card description is too drole.

[Angiolillo]

The Etrons Volats have several genial stuff in their pages, have a look. ;)

Marechallannes' poster is great anyway.

[Doug]

After seeing the contents of the Dam busters Lanc will have to get one now!

[Flying Officer Kyte]

I had seen the Santa one before Andrea, but it is still great.
Sven,s poster is a totally different kettle of fish. Naughty children beware!
Rob.

[Honza]

The searchlights caught him for a moment...

http://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=150706&d=1415859394

(Picture of a new German nightfighter)

It maybe a nice idea to apply a green phosphoric paint in the cabin. :fixit:
It looks superb Sven.

[csadn]

If it does not arrive in time, try this...

150956

http://etronsvolants.pagesperso-orange.fr/pagecadre.htm

Next Mission Idea: "Red Sleigh Down...."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Sleigh_Down

>;)

[Diamondback]

Here's hoping MB got BOTH sides of her art done right... the pinup wears red on one side of the plane and blue on the other.

[OldGuy59]

If it does not arrive in time, try this...

150956

http://etronsvolants.pagesperso-orange.fr/pagecadre.htm


That is an absolute scream, Andrea! I am still laughing. Pierre is a comic genius. This should be translated and posted to our Forum, or perhaps we should ask Pierre for permission to borrow? His Boom Card description is too drole.

OK, I stole it, translated it, and posted it. It is too funny not to share: Jingle Bells, Machine Gun Shells, or Red Sleigh Down (http://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/showthread.php?20698-Jingle-Bells-Machine-Gun-Shells-Or-Red-Sleigh-Down&p=321644&viewfull=1#post321644)

There is even a really unique American/Canadian scenario suggestion...

Enjoy!

[Oberst Hajj]

Do you have these in your possession yet Keith? Seeing as they are set for release this Wednesday, I am interested to know if retailers have them yet or not.

No bombers here yet. Ares told me yesterday that the new release date is Nov 28th. Yes, that's Black Friday over here in the US.

[Flying Officer Kyte]

No bombers here yet. Ares told me yesterday that the new release date is Nov 28th. Yes, that's Black Friday over here in the US.

Most stores over here do special offers on goods for Black Friday Keith.
Maybe you will get your consignment at a discount!:lol:
Rob.

[Oberst Hajj]

So you Brits get the discounts without the associated holiday? That's interesting.

[Flying Officer Kyte]

So you Brits get the discounts without the associated holiday? That's interesting.

No way would our Government sanction a holiday to go with it. That would be just too much of a feel good factor. Very UN-British don't you know what.
Kyte.

[clipper1801]

No bombers here yet. Ares told me yesterday that the new release date is Nov 28th. Yes, that's Black Friday over here in the US.

Hmmmm . . . Black painted Lancasters approaching, Black Friday sounds like a mission name . . .

[Oberst Hajj]

No way would our Government sanction a holiday to go with it. That would be just too much of a feel good factor. Very UN-British don't you know what.
Kyte.

That and this little holiday of ours was really the beginning of the end for a certain British colony. lol

[Oberst Hajj]

Hmmmm . . . Black painted Lancasters approaching, Black Friday sounds like a mission name . . .

My thoughts exactly! Had they gotten here a week earlier, you guys could have tried to fly them past the :wafangry: at night on Black Friday.

[P-51D]

BOO to the delay! Yeah that it is only a 10 day or so delay!!

[Yenwing]

No bombers here yet. Ares told me yesterday that the new release date is Nov 28th. Yes, that's Black Friday over here in the US.

I checked with my local gaming store yesterday and their distributor said Nov 28'th too. I don't care as long as they are here by Christmas

[Flying Officer Kyte]

That and this little holiday of ours was really the beginning of the end for a certain British colony. lol

Do you refer to the most fortunate war we ever lost Keith!:D
Where would we have been in the World Wars, if America had remained a colonial backwater?:eek:
Rob.

[BobP]

Just checked Ares site and saw this so now another week. Maybe a reason to stop pre ordering and just wait for the actual release.

[Marechallannes]

Why stop the preorder?

My preorder was placed mid August this year.

A week more or less did not make a difference.

That's why it's called preorder.


...

Where would we have been in the World Wars, if America had remained a colonial backwater?:eek:
Rob.

Do you really need an answer on this question, Rob?

[Oberst Hajj]

Just checked Ares site and saw this so now another week. Maybe a reason to stop pre ordering and just wait for the actual release.

That would help only if you feel you are out money for the extra delay. Which is of course an except able and understandable feeling.

But pre-ordering does have a few benefits. The first is for me :D It helps me gauge interest in the minis and to know how many to order when they get closer to release date. The other benefit is for you guys. I typically offer some type of promotion or freebie with the pre-ordered sets (like the bomber smoke and flame markers with the WGS Heavies).

[Flying Officer Kyte]

Why stop the preorder?

My preorder was place mid August this year.

A week more or less did not make a difference.

That's why it's called preorder.



Do you really need an answer on this question, Rob?

No Sven. I don't.:erk:
Rob.

[BobP]

Just disappointed. Seems most of the time I preorder there is a delay. Was just venting because I know I will have the planes because of the preorder even if there is a delay.

[Diamondback]

Question that might have been missed: Anyone seen both sides of Memphis Belle to note if she has her correct double-sided nose art? I expect some P.O.'ed peeps if not...

[milcoll73]

Question that might have been missed: Anyone seen both sides of Memphis Belle to note if she has her correct double-sided nose art? I expect some P.O.'ed peeps if not...



im more concerned about the cockpit roof not bieng painted.:(

[Diamondback]

I'd rather paint a near-solid OD roof than try to paint nose-art from scratch... but that may be just me.

[Oberst Hajj]

Question that might have been missed: Anyone seen both sides of Memphis Belle to note if she has her correct double-sided nose art? I expect some P.O.'ed peeps if not...

:thumbsup:

http://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=151126&d=1416533284

http://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=151125&d=1416533284

[Marechallannes]

Damn!

Kameraden man your planes, the Yankees start their dayraids! :erk:

[Oberst Hajj]

Damn!

Kameraden man your planes, the Yankees start their dayraids! :erk:

:takecover::takecover::takecover:


LOL!

[Nightbomber]

HoHoHo, I have just got a nice email from AA: B-17 Shipped.

[Black Sheep One]

HoHoHo, I have just got a nice email from AA: B-17 Shipped.

Me too! Thank you Santa Keith!

[Marechallannes]

Hey Randy,

imagine the Origings staff as a B17 crew. :lol:

Me & you as waist gunners...

...and we need candy to lure Riley into the ball turret. ;)

[Jager]

Hey Randy,

imagine the Origings staff as a B17 crew. :lol:

Me & you as waist gunners...

...and we need candy to lure Riley into the ball turret. ;)

As long as we don't end up like this B-17 crew: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ELUP-oZQKM4&spfreload=10
At least we'd go out with a cool soundtrack ;)
Karl

[BobP]

151148

Bought these pins when the Memphis Belle was at Martin State Airport here in MD last year. They are still in the plastic but you can see the red and blue colors.

[Honza]

Niceeeeee :)

[Nightbomber]

151148

Bought these pins when the Memphis Belle was at Martin State Airport here in MD last year. They are still in the plastic but you can see the red and blue colors.
You gave me some pins like those during Origins 13 Bob and I must tell you I often wear them making people curious;) This is so nice to explain them what the planes are and how I got them:)

[Angiolillo]

If you are somehow interested in girls, do not forget our other B-17.

151151

151152

151150

Source:
http://www.447bg.com/42-97976.htm

[Jager]

If you are somehow interested in girls, do not forget our other B-17.

151151

151152

151150

Source:
http://www.447bg.com/42-97976.htm

I'm glad you did this one; I love the Mail Call comic Milt Caniff did during the war. :thumbsup:
Karl

[Flying Officer Kyte]

It's great to know that they are on the way.
Rob.

[milcoll73]

If you are somehow interested in girls, do not forget our other B-17.

151151

151152

151150

Source:
http://www.447bg.com/42-97976.htm

its a lovely a/c but i think ares would have sold more had they done one of they few remaining b17s in flying condition such as the sentimental journey, texas raiders, yankee lady, aluminium overcast, sally b, nine o nine, etc.

[milcoll73]

I'd rather paint a near-solid OD roof than try to paint nose-art from scratch... but that may be just me.

very true but id rather not have to paint either. oh well no biggie.

[Angiolillo]

its a lovely a/c but i think ares would have sold more had they done one of they few remaining b17s in flying condition such as the sentimental journey, texas raiders, yankee lady, aluminium overcast, sally b, nine o nine, etc.

It could be. Anyway this is pretty iconic. And for others, we have years of reprints ahead.

[Never Miss]

its a lovely a/c but i think ares would have sold more had they done one of they few remaining b17s in flying condition such as the sentimental journey, texas raiders, yankee lady, aluminium overcast, sally b, nine o nine, etc.

I've toured Sentimental Journey and it's a beautiful plane but the name and livery weren't adopted until she entered the commemorative Air Force, they aren't authentic to the war. Similar is true of at least Yankee Lady and Texas Raiders. Aluminum Overcast "commemorates" an actual B-17 lost over France but I'm not sure how authentic the livery is.

[P-51D]

its a lovely a/c but i think ares would have sold more had they done one of they few remaining b17s in flying condition such as the sentimental journey, texas raiders, yankee lady, aluminium overcast, sally b, nine o nine, etc.

I don't know....as has been said, most of them still flying are not in historical livery. Besides, these 2 done by Ares look absolutely amazing as is and personally, the price point they came in at just blows my mind. I was expecting to spend easily over forty dollars a piece on these things. I really didn't want to, but would have bought one of each anyway. Since they came in at a very reasonable price (especially online) I bought them in multiples! I have 3 of each coming and may drop some change on 2 to 3 more each of the B-17s for some really big raiding battles. The fact that they did Memphis Belle means they recreated what many argue to be the most important and iconic of the B-17s, due to the publicity she and her crew recieved after completing their 25th mission over Europe.

Here is a bit of trivia for you. Most people believe the Memphis Belle and her crew were the first to complete their 25 missions and get to go home. In reality, Hell's Angels and her crew completed their 25th mission nearly a week before the Belle. For whatever reason, Belle and her crew recieved all the laud and attention! As evidenced by the subsequent tour of the U.S., the documentary done at that time, and even the movie that came out in the 90's. The fact that Hell's Angels actually accomplished the task first is left to the history books and those that care to study such things.

Anybody know if any good books have been done on Hell's Angels and her crew?

[P-51D]

Forgot to mention, I think the B-17s in particular are going to sell really really well.

[BobP]

If you are interested the is an Osprey book about the 303rd BG. It has stories about all the planes including Hell's Angles. Another book I have is called Final Cut. It lists all the Post War
B-17's that are still around either flying or in museums.

[BobP]

I didn't stop my pre order. It seems every time I place a pre order the date is moved back. Just get bummed every time there is a release date and it gets pushed back. I forget what series but the release date was pushed back 3 times. I love the pre order because if they item sells out I know I will have it.

[BobP]

Andy I remember giving you the YANKEE FRIENDSHIP patch. Didn't remember the pins but since you have them glad I did get them.

[P-51D]

Great bits of info their Bob! I will check out both those books in the near future. Sadly, my library is bursting at the seams and some culling may be needed (from the fiction section mind you :) ) in order to make more room. My wife is looking forward to the day when I buy digital books only! Blasphemy I say, but every move I swear to par down the 5,000+ volumes that make up my reading horde...It very well may be the time to start making some cuts. The make up is about 50-50 nonfiction to fiction. I have not really read much fiction in the last decade. The Lord of the Rings/The Hobbit, Harry Potter, Mark Twain titles, and a handful of Star Wars titles aside, it may very well be time for the fiction side to receive a substantial thinning, upwards of 80-90%. I keep finding/learning about all these amazing history related books!!

So a couple more books on WWII heavies is very much welcome!

[Marechallannes]

Seems that all Aerodrome Acessoires heavies are "out of stock".

The Lancasters, too. :)

[Nightbomber]

Andy I remember giving you the YANKEE FRIENDSHIP patch. Didn't remember the pins but since you have them glad I did get them.

Oh Bob! You gave me not only the patch, but pins of B-17, the Black Widow and SPAD XIII as well! :) I wear them with proud!

[milcoll73]

I've toured Sentimental Journey and it's a beautiful plane but the name and livery weren't adopted until she entered the commemorative Air Force, they aren't authentic to the war. Similar is true of at least Yankee Lady and Texas Raiders. Aluminum Overcast "commemorates" an actual B-17 lost over France but I'm not sure how authentic the livery is.



certainly true but none of that affects the pieces game playability. and it certainly would have generated a lot more attention. i posted info about them on a b17 facebook page and was asked to keep people whove never heard of the game nor are gamers as to the release date. they just want another b17 representation.

[Angiolillo]

You are correct, but at the moment we prefer to stick to planes that were actually in service during the war. Up to now we also excluded some very colorful schemes that were not operative but just for training, propaganda or such, or outside the war period. The two B-17 we chosed are very iconic anyway IMHO.