CR-42`s

[richard m schwab]

Some photos of my F-Toys CR-42`s, these lovely pains in the butt!:surrender: If you want to experience these little gems for yourself be my guest!:eek: From the tiny parts that were always airborne just as you were ready to attach them, to the missing paint on one set of landing gear. Building these was a once in a lifetime experience for me!:surrender:


Rich


P.S. My going rate for construction of a CR-42 is $100 US cash up front. No questions asked about missing struts, exhausts or unpainted undercarriages! :eek:

P.S.S. Backward decals are also not to be mentioned!:mad:

[Nightbomber]

Wonderful models, Rich! Great camo painting there:) :thumbsup:

[Baldrick62]

Rich,
Interesting that you mention problems with paint on landing gear; I had the same. it seems F-Toys may have had some quality control issues with this batch.
BdeB

[BobP]

I build one so far and can say the same thing as you did. The one thing I did notice is that the one (#45/3B) with the white band has different landing gear then the other two that is why the one set is not painted (check out the pictures). I sat there for a few minutes looking at the instructions and figured that out. However I put them in the wrong position (L&R) anyway. I do see you used all the struts. I gave up on the one set after trying to figure out how to attach them. I have to commend you on the job you did putting them together. :salute:

[BobP]

Andy those are F-Toys 1/144 models and pre painted which is one reason I like them. The WWII planes are not much of a problem but these are a bear to put together. I have to give KUDOS to Rich for what he did in putting them together. And again have to say the 3B has different landing gear so all other be careful when building these.

[BobP]

134834

Here is a scan of the pictures of the planes. Note how 3B has different gear than 3A/3C. I checked Osprey 90, Fiat CR.42 aces and plate 17 is the only one with that type landing gear.

[Flying Helmut]

Great-looking planes Richard!

[Baldrick62]

BobP,
On re-examination you're quite right. The landing gear for each of the models is completely painted: it's the 'spare' set on each sprue that's incomplete, so apologies to F-Toys' quality control for my earlier comment!
BdeB

[richard m schwab]

Thank you all. I bought three and should have stuck with one. It took a week from start to finish on those three! I like the wheel pants on look so i went with that. It is obvious that some sort of robotic painting system is used. They did not waste the paint on the parts they felt you did not need! I did break one strut and did without, half.



Rich


P.S. No more Bi Planes!!!!

[BobP]

Having built one of these I think Rich should get a medal for building 3 of them. After the one I build I did a Kate and finishing a Buffalo (Finnish one) and then going to do an I-16 (Finnish).

[Flying Officer Kyte]

Well Rich, whatever the trials and tribulations of the build, you have a fine trio of aircraft there.
I hate to think what it would be like building them in 1:200.
Rob.

[Marechallannes]

Nice new planes, Richard. :thumbsup:

[BobP]

If Rich built them does that mean we will be doing a Malta game in August?

[csadn]

134834

Here is a scan of the pictures of the planes. Note how 3B has different gear than 3A/3C. I checked Osprey 90, Fiat CR.42 aces and plate 17 is the only one with that type landing gear.

The SO says: The top line of each description reads (essentially) "Italian Air Force" ("air army"). 2B is "flying group training school". 2A and C are "Number [arabic numerals] Aviation Group [arabic numerals] Aviation Squadron". So perhaps trainers had the spats taken off for the same reason as Eastern Front units -- to prevent them getting packed full of crud, and causing accidents.

[BobP]

Reading about the plate in Osprey it was a plane in East Africa and shot down. Good catch as to the spats being taken off. May have to do with snow/mud or sand.

[richard m schwab]

Bob

A medal or a cold beer! Yes i am re evaluating my games for August. May be B-29`s Friday and the Med for both games Saturday. I need to get them registered.


Rich

[richard m schwab]

Rob

Your Gladiators came out great in 1:200.:thumbsup: Shapeways have a CR-42 listed listed, correct? The struts are all done for you!


Rich

[richard m schwab]

Sven

Thank you, i can enjoy them now they are done! I have enough Last Biplanes sets to fly them!


Rich

[BobP]

I have 2 Swordfish and now that I did the CR42 I have to take my time with them. Hope they go easier than the others.

[richard m schwab]

Bob

I found practice did not make perfect on the second and third Cr-42. I placed an order for three Gladiator MK2 form Shapeways. It should make a good mix for our August games!

Rich

[BobP]

Well now when back from my trip north the SM-79's are the top of the list but should not take that long to get them built. I have checked them and only a few parts to put on. I have an idea on the stands and after doing the B-17's I know it will be good.

[richard m schwab]

Bob

Are they the AIM SM-79`s?


Rich

[pbhawkin]

I am coping a post by Moresby an Italian modeller on the Kampfgruppe144 forum who had this to say about the Cr-42s:
"Wing struts are thinner than the ones on the best Shapeways model (Decapod'): as in all biplane models, having them properly fixed and aligned will require effort and patience (both Kampfflieger's and Decapod's Falcos come already finished and ready to be painted, so they could still be a good option for inexperienced modellers).
In every model, sprues contain landing gear parts both with and without wheel fairings.

Colour schemes:

The smoke-ring CR-42 (B) has only one decal set and correctly reproduces a machine used in late 1942 in an advanced training unit.

The dark green/dark brown model (C) offers markings for a couple of 1942 planes used as light fighter-bombers: they are correct (158th and 15th Gruppo Assalto) but I'm afraid the models need repainting: the brown spots should be lighter than the dark green (not olive drab!) background. Also, there aren't underwing bombs (I'd suggest using spares from Sweet Macchi 200).

I haven't received the 'A' model, but I've seen the marking options on the common leaflet: the first option shows a gaudy 'yellow 9' 85th squadriglia Falco from the CA.I. in Belgium, Autumn 1940

(These planes actually clashed with Hurricane and Spitfires in two air battles: in both cases GCI placed RAF interceptors in optimal positions to bounce the Italian formations, allowing them a first, quite effective surprise attack: the fight then broke in single, less unbalanced, duels between clouds where the nimble Italian fighters proved quite hard to outmanouver. Both missions ended in a disaster for Regia Aeronautica as many more CR-42s were lost when unable to get back home for lack of fuel and foul weather).

Markings are correct, but the brown and green mottling over sand yellow is poorly reproduced and requires repainting.

The second option for 'A' model is for a 161 Squadriglia, Rhodes-based CR-42. Same re-painting considerations, plus the need to cancel the large fuselage yellow band (only engine cowling should be left yellow).

https://www.google.it/search?q=cr-42+162&client=firefox-a&hs=OEw&rls=org.mozilla:it:official&channel=fflb&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=EzOUU5-QIabL0AWI-4D4DA&ved=0CCQQsAQ&biw=1400&bih=850&safe=off#facrc=_&imgdii=_&imgrc=OBkv5cSWLMv-oM%253A%3BngSLMkHjUDIF5M%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.finn.it%252Fregia%252Fimmagini%252Ffiat%252Fcr42_162.jpg%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.finn.it%252Fregia%252Fhtml%252Fseconda_guerra_mondiale.htm%3B1024%3B 685

A few last words about the Luftwaffe 'special'. I cannot see clearly colour and markings, but I see that it's another model without wheel fairings, so check your documentation: many German CR-42 kept the upper part of their wheel fairings and all of them featured long-flame dampener exhaust tubes: also, bomb racks should be present.

https://www.google.it/search?q=cr+42+luftwaffe&client=firefox-a&hs=hDw&rls=org.mozilla:it:official&channel=sb&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=6DKUU8mEK7GN0wWJo4Fg&ved=0CAgQ_AUoAQ&biw=1400&bih=850&safe=off

[BobP]

Thanks for the post of that. I have to look at my Osprey book better to see which ones are in it.

[BobP]

I have some AIM SM 79's in 1/200 but the others are BIG BIRDS 5 in 1/144. 2 have the dark green paint scheme and one the splinter camo. All have torpedo's.

[pbhawkin]

Bob,
here is a link to some info on the SM79 and the Algernon BigBird planes in particular:
http://www.kampfgruppe144.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=761&hilit=sm79&start=40

[csadn]

The smoke-ring CR-42 (B) has only one decal set and correctly reproduces a machine used in late 1942 in an advanced training unit. [...]

The dark green/dark brown model (C) offers markings for a couple of 1942 planes used as light fighter-bombers: they are correct (158th and 15th Gruppo Assalto)[...]

I haven't received the 'A' model, but I've seen the marking options on the common leaflet: the first option shows a gaudy 'yellow 9' 85th squadriglia Falco from the CA.I. in Belgium, Autumn 1940

So pretty-much what I said upthread, based on translating the kanji. Even nailed B as a flight-school unit. :)

[pbhawkin]

Yes Chris, you were correct about the squadrons from reading the kanji.
Although, I had put the quote here more for the information on the colours and markings of the models versus the real thing.

[BobP]

Looks like the Big Bird plane is based on the Italeri kit. When I build their armor models they seemed like scaled down versions of Tamiya kits so I guess could be the same with aircraft.

[kaufschtick]

Thank you all. I bought three and should have stuck with one. It took a week from start to finish on those three! I like the wheel pants on look so i went with that. It is obvious that some sort of robotic painting system is used. They did not waste the paint on the parts they felt you did not need! I did break one strut and did without, half.



Rich


P.S. No more Bi Planes!!!!
Oh great, I've got two of the unpainted under carriage ones on the way to me right now. Looks like I picked the wrong week to stop smoking cigarettes.

[csadn]

Oh great, I've got two of the unpainted under carriage ones on the way to me right now. Looks like I picked the wrong week to stop smoking cigarettes.

I don't know about smoking cigarettes, but I suspect you *will* be sniffing a lot of glue getting them built.... >:)

[richard m schwab]

Rob

Give up drinking coffee until after you build them!


Rich

[Blauer Baron]

CR-42s were amongst Italian planes shot down over Britian in 1940. The latest edition of the "Britain At War Magazine" published in the UK ((February 2015, (p48-56) carries an article on an attack by Hurricanes on an Italian bombing raid aiming for Harwich consisting of Fiat BR.20s with fighter support (CR-42s). The magazine gives background to the deployment of Italian planes operating from Belguim to attack Britain. This forces' 20 attacks took part between October 24th 1940 and the 2nd of January 1941. It is well worth a read, as the eye witness account of the action by the Hurricane pilot Flt Lt Blatchford is quite revealing! A good reason to use the Wings of Glory CR-42s models!!

I rate the "The Britian At War Magazine" highly, because it is well written and gives a lot of detail which can also be used for scenarios. It always has avaiation stories in it too. It is always however, a full dose of a sad reminder of so many young lives lost.

(I hope it is OK adding this post to this thread as I do not know how to start a thread and I think this post fits best here. I also researched to see if this had already been mentioned anywhere but I found no indication after a long search. So here it is.)

[Flying Officer Kyte]

The Osprey Combat Aircraft 106. Savoia- Marchetti S.79 Sparviero Torpedo-Bomber Units by Marco Mattioli has some interesting information about Italian operations over the channel.
Rob.

[Warlock]

I'm not "Britain At War Magazine" but, if you want, Kevin, I could share infos about "Corpo Aereo Italiano", the italian aviation force in Belgium.
This is the Wikipedia page in english http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corpo_Aereo_Italiano
but, obviously, the italian version has more details http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corpo_Aereo_Italiano

[csadn]

Kind of ironic: The Germans had decent fighters escorting inadequate bombers; the Italians had decent bombers being escorted by inadequate fighters. (It's also a comment that of the Italian bombers losses, most were the result of accidents.)

[richard m schwab]

Kevin

Look at the dates for some of those Italian missions on Britain. CR-42 in winter, it must have been toasty in that cockpit.



Rich

[Jager]

Kind of ironic: The Germans had decent fighters escorting inadequate bombers; the Italians had decent bombers being escorted by inadequate fighters. (It's also a comment that of the Italian bombers losses, most were the result of accidents.)

Why do you think the Br.20s were much better than the He.111s? A bit faster, but lighter built, and less bombload.
Karl

[Dom S]

Totally agreed - the BR.20 was a fine bomber in 1937, but far from suitable for the Battle of Britain. If they'd sent SM.79s or Cants instead, they'd have been a tougher proposition, but the BR.20 was past it.

[Blauer Baron]

I'm not "Britain At War Magazine" but, if you want, Kevin, I could share infos about "Corpo Aereo Italiano", the italian aviation force in Belgium.
This is the Wikipedia page in english http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corpo_Aereo_Italiano
but, obviously, the italian version has more details http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corpo_Aereo_Italiano

Thanks Warlock! I'll be onto this now. I haven't got any Axis Italian aeroplanes yet, (you have to save money somewhere!) but this is getting interesting!

[Blauer Baron]

Kevin

Look at the dates for some of those Italian missions on Britain. CR-42 in winter, it must have been toasty in that cockpit.



Rich


Yes, the fighter escort of a few Luftwaffe 109's and 46 Italian G50's turned back due to bad weather (according to the magazine). If the CR-42 had run out of ammo, they could probably have thrown snowballs or at least icicles.:surrender:

[BobP]

Going to Cold Wars in a few weeks so have to look for this Osprey book while there. Looks like something to check out.

[grumpybear]

Some photos of my F-Toys CR-42`s, these lovely pains in the butt!:surrender: If you want to experience these little gems for yourself be my guest!:eek: From the tiny parts that were always airborne just as you were ready to attach them, to the missing paint on one set of landing gear. Building these was a once in a lifetime experience for me!:surrender:

One of my favorite planes, nice job
Rich


P.S. My going rate for construction of a CR-42 is $100 US cash up front. No questions asked about missing struts, exhausts or unpainted undercarriages! :eek:

P.S.S. Backward decals are also not to be mentioned!:mad:

[csadn]

Why do you think the Br.20s were much better than the He.111s? A bit faster, but lighter built, and less bombload.
Karl

I said "decent", not "better" -- the -111s were OK; however, their defensive armament was (like all German bombers) inadequate. I was thinking more of the Ju-87s (oy vey) and Do-17s when I said "inadequate"; the -87's faults are well-documented, while the -17 suffered from the same substandard defensive array as everything else in the Luftwaffe.

Meanwhile, the Br.20s, while also not brilliant, were a sight better than anything else the Italians brought to bear -- fully-enclosed cockpits; retractable landing gear; monoplane design. The only unit more advanced than the Br.20s were the 5 CANT Z.1007s recon birds.