Official Bristol Scout painting thread.

[johnbiggles]

I would like to introduce you to my first Bristol Scout, courtesey of Kampfflieger
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The side mounted Lewis gun is by jbmacek in WSF, the mount is .020 in (,51mm) brass rod, with fine copper wire for the front attachment
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The rondels are from Dom's Decals
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The pilot is from reducedAircraftFactory
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The union flags are home made, printed on white decal paper using an ordinary, rather cheap inkjet printer
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The stand is one of Col Hajj's creations, with the correct firing arc for an angle mounted gun
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[Boney10]

Nice model, not got any of these, I shall have to remedy this

[Flying Officer Kyte]

Looks good John. Nice work on the side mounted gun.:thumbsup:
Rob.

[Teaticket]

Great incentive to get mine painted for the early war campaign. Nice job!

[john snelling]

I like the color. What paint did you use?

[johnbiggles]

I use Humbrol acrylics, and enamels where the acrylics are unavailable or don't work very well
The main body is H103, the wood is H62, the silver is H11(enamel), black H33 engine H53 gunmetal
The WSF is prepped with 1:1 white glue:water, then H103 all over as an undercoat.
The tail is hand painted white, then the blue, then the red.
when it has dried, I paint the woodwork and wheels, then the silver for the front engine area a ring of gunmetal in the front of the cowl for the engine.
then I touch up all the CDL again where age and eyesight has caused paint gaffs.
finally the decals, Doms I cut out and soak in a saucer like the old Airfix decals 40 years ago, the home made ones I moisten the backs with a wet paint brush for about 5-10 seconds and use 6 to get 4 good ones.
Finally a coat of vallejo acrylic laquer over the decals to fix them.

[fast.git]

Great looking kite... and quite the kit-bash!


model by Kampfflieger...
Lewis by jbmacek...
pilot by reducedAircraftFactory...
flight stand & gimbal mount by Herr Oberst...
roundels by Dom...
acrylics by Humbrol...
Union Jack and labor by johnbiggles!


It truly does take a village! ;)

[ReducedAirFact]

A great example of "the sum is greater than the parts"!

[johnbiggles]

Scout number two, alternative gun mounting
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note the lack of top wing roundels, common during the early phase of adoption of the roundel as a national marking on british aircraft
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a slightly out of focus shot of the top wing Lewis mounting, the front V is fine copper wire twisted once round the barrel
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[Flying Helmut]

My first Skytrex / Red Eagle metal 1/144 aircraft kit
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[Lt. S.Kafloc]

John fantastic looking scout and Tim another lovely job (100 x 1mm mini-mags on the way now all I need is the Fe2!).

[Captain Chum]

Wonderful work John. I noticed that you prep with white glue and water. I do the same when I have worked with this material. I do some pre-sanding with a very light grit and sanding pencils before putting on the glue/water concoction. Nice finished result John.

[Captain Chum]

Your example it nice too Tim. Like the attention to the decals as well.
I have never worked with metal, is there a lot of prep work involved?

[Flying Helmut]

Your example it nice too Tim. Like the attention to the decals as well.
I have never worked with metal, is there a lot of prep work involved?

Thanks!:)
There wasn't much prep work on this kit - the moulding was fairly clean. Just a little trimming of what little flash there was, filing down any lumps and bumps with needle files and a mousetail file, then opening out the location holes with a pin. The only problem was that the tiny cabane struts came on a little metal sprue, and it was tough to tell where the strut finished and the sprue began!
I began a BE2c at the same time, and haven't finished it yet; there was quite a bit more cleaning up required (and lots more struts!) on that one.
I finished the Reviresco Sopwith 1 1/2 Strutter at the same time as this Scout; the moulding on that was MUCH more detailed than this kit, and all the parts were much thinner - I almost broke the top wing in half several times, it was so thin! I had to replace the interplane struts; they just weren't strong enough to support the upper wing for gaming use.

[Captain Chum]

Thanks!:)
There wasn't much prep work on this kit - the moulding was fairly clean. Just a little trimming of what little flash there was, filing down any lumps and bumps with needle files and a mousetail file, then opening out the location holes with a pin. The only problem was that the tiny cabane struts came on a little metal sprue, and it was tough to tell where the strut finished and the sprue began!
I began a BE2c at the same time, and haven't finished it yet; there was quite a bit more cleaning up required (and lots more struts!) on that one.
I finished the Reviresco Sopwith 1 1/2 Strutter at the same time as this Scout; the moulding on that was MUCH more detailed than this kit, and all the parts were much thinner - I almost broke the top wing in half several times, it was so thin! I had to replace the interplane struts; they just weren't strong enough to support the upper wing for gaming use.

Sounds like some of the metal is just as or more tedious than some of the plastic kits.

[Flying Officer Kyte]

Sounds like some of the metal is just as or more tedious than some of the plastic kits.
If you have a look at a few of these Kelly, you will see some of the baggy wrinkles we use to get over problems when building the metal kits. The amount of bother does vary from kit to kit, even with the same manufacturer. Usually the more recent kits are better, but this is not a given.

http://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/content.php?9-kit-building

Rob.

[Captain Chum]

Thanks for the link Rob. Definitely looks like hit and miss. Not sure if metal is for me. Maybe a combination of metal and plastic like your Handley Page Bomber.

[johnbiggles]

really good finish on this one Tim, and thanks for the tips,
I shall be refering back to this when I start the Baby I acquired at Salute

[WWIflyingace]

These are beautiful!

[Teaticket]

Here are my 3 Scouts. Shapeways, WSF, decals by Dom. I still have to add a pilot and a machine gun off to the side on each of these babies.

Green Scout is Valejo, 094 Russian Uniform on black prime, yellow sides are a craft acrylic, Anita's Marigold 11163 over white, underside Valejo 120 Buff
Canvas Scouts are Valejo 120 Buff. I paint one coat of Buff on black prime, then paint a medium brown along the wing ribs, then another Buff coat. I'm trying
to get the effect of seeing the ribs through the canvas.
The Buff looks a little too yellow in these photos compared to the real thing. I took them in the evening under artificial lighting.

If the model has, which these do, relief on the wing ribbing I will do a few dry brush passes, something darker first then to lighter. Sometimes it disappears
when I spray a clear protective coating. (one clear gloss then one clear flat)

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[7eat51]

Once again, very nice work. I would love to see your collection.

[Teaticket]

Once again, very nice work. I would love to see your collection.

Thanks Eric. I've only just started painting my own. I think I only have about a dozen finished so far. I do have all the Ares and Nexus planes but now have the itch to paint my own. I'll have to post photos of all I've finished in my album. I'm quite bad with that.

[flash]

Very nice Peter, they look terrific - could you add to the post paint colour and decal details please :)

[Flying Officer Kyte]

Another fine showing Peter. Together with your Rumpler certainly worth some Kudos.:hatsoff:
Rob.

[johnbiggles]

Some cracking paintwork there Peter
now you have to work out which of the many armament variations to use!

[WWIflyingace]

Very nice plains. The paint scheme for the two light yellow ones are very similar to two of mine. The other two are yellow and green. I made my own decals. Are you going to use similar gun mountings to those in the geginning of the thread?

[Teaticket]

Very nice plains. The paint scheme for the two light yellow ones are very similar to two of mine. The other two are yellow and green. I made my own decals. Are you going to use similar gun mountings to those in the geginning of the thread?

I already have a few holes drilled into the fuselage sides. I plan on putting one gun on each. One on the left for each of the canvas and one on the right for the green. I haven't yet decided if I will add a 2nd gun to any. I think having more than one gun could make them to strong for early war. I know you've done a bit of research on this but I don't have a feel myself on what the ratio would be for up gunned planes.

[Teaticket]

Very nice Peter, they look terrific - could you add to the post paint colour and decal details please :)

I'll get the paint details tonight. (my time) Canvas is Valejo Buff, I think the green is Valejo Russian Uniform, the yellow sides are a craft acrylic.

[Lt. S.Kafloc]

Peter yet again a lovely paint job. Can't wait for the lewis guns to be fitted and pilots, please post again when done.

[Teaticket]

Peter yet again a lovely paint job. Can't wait for the lewis guns to be fitted and pilots, please post again when done.

I'm sadly slow with the pilots. The little buggars are tough to paint and fit in the cockpits at the right level. I'm really dragging my feet on getting them into my Rumlpers.

[Teaticket]

Very nice Peter, they look terrific - could you add to the post paint colour and decal details please :)

Painting details added as requested. :)

[prymus]

Very nice aircraft all, you should be proud of your fine work. I do love the planes, very delicate looking. Some of the craft like this look like just anybody could jump in and start flying around, though I'm sure that's not how it is really.

[WWIflyingace]

I already have a few holes drilled into the fuselage sides. I plan on putting one gun on each. One on the left for each of the canvas and one on the right for the green. I haven't yet decided if I will add a 2nd gun to any. I think having more than one gun could make them to strong for early war. I know you've done a bit of research on this but I don't have a feel myself on what the ratio would be for up gunned planes.

Well, this is about all I know: of the 236 RFC scouts 80 served on the Western Front; 32 in the Middle-east; and, 9 Home Defense. The rest were trainers. Many front line aircraft were never armed, but my best guess for the armed scouts would be less than half had two guns. It appears the standard configuration for the D was an over the wing Lewis gun or a Vickers on the port side (with interrupter gear or deflector gear). The Scout C had just about every imaginable combination; one even had three guns. The favored gun mountings for the RNAS seems to be a port or top mounted gun (Lewis or later Vickers) without interrupter gear OR same with a wing mounted Lewis.

It looks like you're going with RFC crates so I don't think you could go wrong with 2 single gun and 1 with twin guns.

Of the four I painted I have one with 1 port side Lewis gun, 1 with twin Lewis guns, one with a port side Vickers and a wing mounted Lewis, and 1 with two Lewis guns mounted on the wing.

I am really impressed with your work...

[Teaticket]

Well, this is about all I know: of the 236 RFC scouts 80 served on the Western Front; 32 in the Middle-east; and, 9 Home Defense. The rest were trainers. Many front line aircraft were never armed, but my best guess for the armed scouts would be less than half had two guns. It appears the standard configuration for the D was an over the wing Lewis gun or a Vickers on the port side (with interrupter gear or deflector gear). The Scout C had just about every imaginable combination; one even had three guns. The favored gun mountings for the RNAS seems to be a port or top mounted gun (Lewis or later Vickers) without interrupter gear OR same with a wing mounted Lewis.

It looks like you're going with RFC crates so I don't think you could go wrong with 2 single gun and 1 with twin guns.

Of the four I painted I have one with 1 port side Lewis gun, 1 with twin Lewis guns, one with a port side Vickers and a wing mounted Lewis, and 1 with two Lewis guns mounted on the wing.

I am really impressed with your work...

Thanks Chuck. I think I may do one with a port gun and a wing mount. I am assuming they don't fire at the same time and should take 3 cards to reload?

[johnbiggles]

Hi Peter,
you also need to watch the manouvers, particularly with the over wing mounting as the pilot will be standing on his seat to change drums!!

[Teaticket]

Hi Peter,
you also need to watch the manouvers, particularly with the over wing mounting as the pilot will be standing on his seat to change drums!!

No steep manouvers right? Or they don't count towards the 3 cards if you have a steep manouver in the sequence?

[johnbiggles]

No steep manouvers right? Or they don't count towards the 3 cards if oyu have a steep manouver in the sequence?

Over wing, straight line only, if you accidently plan a turn while changing a drum, choose a method to see if the pilot falls out!+ add an extra firing phase
side mounting no steep manouver, any steep manouver, add an extra firing phase to the time required
crew served (e.g. gunbus) any manouver.

[Teaticket]

Thanks John. I do hope to get these in the air soon but will have to be careful with the reloading. Tough enough to fly with the odd angle shooting to the side and then the reloading fun!

[ReducedAirFact]

Hi Peter,
you also need to watch the manouvers, particularly with the over wing mounting as the pilot will be standing on his seat to change drums!!

I assume you've heard the story of Louis Strange and his adventures changing drums? This quoted from http://www.firstworldwar.com/airwar/earlyfighters.htm:


Louis Strange experimented with a solution using a Martinsyde S I biplane. He fixed a Lewis gun on top of the upper wing, high enough to clear the airscrew. While this seemed quite a good solution, it introduced new problems, as Strange himself discovered on the 10th of May while attempting to shoot down an Aviatik. After firing off a whole drum from his Lewis gun he broke off in order to reload.

Unfortunately the drum jammed, and Strange stood up on his seat in order to try and pry it loose. The plane stalled, flipped over, and began to spin earthwards upside-down. Strange was flung out of the plane, and found himself dangling below the upper wing, hanging on by the very drum he had been trying to shake loose.

By swinging his legs wildly he managed to get a foothold inside the cockpit and drag himself back inside in time to right the plane and avoid a crash. In his wild thrashing he had smashed all the dials in his instrument panel and broken the seat.

[Teaticket]

Thats a wild ride! Now how to get that into a random event while reloading....hmmmmm.

[WWIflyingace]

Thanks Chuck. I think I may do one with a port gun and a wing mount. I am assuming they don't fire at the same time and should take 3 cards to reload?

I went through all my pictures and from those I have the following: 8 single Lewis port side; 1 single Lewis starboard, 1 single Lewis center, 5 single Lewis center wing and 2 single Vickers port side. For multi-gun I have 1 port side with center wing (both Lewis), 1 starboard with center wing (both Lewis), 2 twin Lewis (port side and starboard guns), and 1 with twin guns and a center wing (all Lewis).

In addition I have a couple where the airplane is described but no picture supplied: 1 with a port side and center wing (both Lewis) and 1 with two wing guns (both Lewis).

So in total:

17 single gun
6 double gun
1 triple gun

24 out of 121 serving in combat roles. I think that is a good number to extrapolate from. Roughly 70% had only 1 gun...

[Lt. S.Kafloc]

Do we know how the added guns affected speed/climb etc? Should there be different decks for different combinations?

[Teaticket]

Nice work. So I think having 1 out of my 3 with two guns will be close enough to the ratio to justify.

[Teaticket]

Do we know how the added guns affected speed/climb etc? Should there be different decks for different combinations?

Good question. I know of the problem with the Eindeker IV and a 3rd gun so an extra gun(s) more than likely did have an adverse effect on performance.

[WWIflyingace]

I cannot say, but there are enough official planes where some have an 'A' gun and some a 'B' but still use the same deck; SPAD VII, Nieuport 11 and 17 to name a few. Also keep in mind two Lewis guns weighed about the same as a single Vickers so my guess is there would be no effect on the maneuver deck for having two Lewis guns. But, you could always just drop a side slip.

I think 1 gun versus 2 was more for convenience and feel; like shooting a rifle. I can shoot left or right, but a lot of people can only shoot resting the butt on their right shoulder. My guess is that Scout pilots had the same limitations...

As far as the plane with three guns. I'm guessing it's unique. And since its three Lewis guns it would be like having 1 1/2 Vickers guns. I'd take away a side slip for sure in this case.

[flash]

Fascinating though this all is chaps this is the painting showcase not the armoury - please take this discussion elsewhere :thankyou:

[Captain Chum]

Once again, very nice work. I would love to see your collection.

Agreed....nice work mate! :thumbsup:

[johnbiggles]

Fascinating though this all is chaps this is the painting showcase not the armoury - please take this discussion elsewhere :thankyou:

Do we have an armoury?
Should we have an armoury section? there are many similar diversions in threads across the Forum. Well done Dave for highlighting this deficiency.

We NEED an armoury!!!

[Flying Officer Kyte]

No we don't John.
Just have it moved to the General, or Historical section. There are far too many sub forums as it is.
Rob.

[WWIflyingace]

My Bristol Scouts:

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Both Canvas aircraft are based on actual aircraft; each armed with two Lewis guns (although the two wing mounted guns is based on a written description rather than a picture). The green one is based on a later C-type equipped a Vickers using deflector/interrupter gear. The goldenrod Scout is based on a scout flown by Ball, but the color isn't quite right.

[Teaticket]

Nice looking Scouts there Chuck. I still have to put my guns and pilots on mine but too busy painting my Nieuport 11s and sausage ground crew for this month's scenario.

[WWIflyingace]

Thank you. I look forward the seeing the Nieuport 11's in action!

[Flying Officer Kyte]

That should give your boys a bit more bite Chuck.
Rob.

[WWIflyingace]

Indeed...

[Captain Chum]

Very nice work on your scouts Chuck! :thumbsup:

[WWIflyingace]

More pics of my Bristols:

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[Flying Officer Kyte]

I love the variety of colours on these early machines. Pity they descended into Olive Drab so soon.
Rob.

[Teaticket]

I like the brighter canvas one.(dark yellow) What color did you use?

Here are mine finally with pilots and gunners.

This one is the only one I up-gunned with an over the wing Lewis.
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[Flying Helmut]

super paint jobs - well done!

[WWIflyingace]

I like the brighter canvas one.(dark yellow) What color did you use?




The color is "Golden Sun"

[Teaticket]

Thanks Chuck. I know I still have a 'few' canvas planes to paint. One will definitely get the "Golden Sun" treatment.

[flash]

Here's m'humble effort on a Bristol Scout by Decapod in WSF material from Shapeways:

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Humbrol 155 & what used to be bleached bone from GW give the PC10/cdl colours; Lewis gun robbed from a Strutter conversion

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Peter Pig pilot and some of Dom's decals finish the job nicely

[Teaticket]

Very nice. Getting ready to go early war again? Grrrr, REP gun jammed...:(

[flash]

You guessed it Peter