Ares Games
Results 1 to 12 of 12

Thread: Night Fighters

  1. #1

    Default Night Fighters

    From http://1914-1918.invisionzone.com/fo...ummer-of-1918/

    It seems that the Allieds had one or more night fighter units in the summer of 1918. There was also a German counterpart, in the form of the Masosta or Sonderstaffel A operating from the Vlissegem and Stalhille aerodromes.
    There is quite a lot of material left in the record about British night fighter units - in the last six months of the war it was the subject of a lot of theoretical and practical investigation, much of which survives. It was seen as a definite element of war-making potential.

    The night-fighter units in France were 151 and 152 Sqn, flying night fighter Camels. These moved the cockpit aft and (usually) had twin Lewis guns on Foster mounts on the top plane above - in order to minimise glare problems from firing etc. These units seem to have been used as test beds, as much as anything else, but were definitely quite active - 151 Sqn from about June 1918 and 152 from late October. Some night fighter Camels from 151 Sqn were attached to the night bombing FE2b units (eg to 101 Sqn for a week or so in late June at Famechon).

    Whilst these units did achieve a number of aerial victories at night, one of their primary tasks was to mount standing patrols above enemy airfields to prevent the German bombers and others from taking off. Regarding typical aerial victories 151 Sqn claimed about 26 of the enemy - 24 of which were bombers, including two "Giants." Notably they suffered no fatalities due to enemy action.
    Home Defence had rather a mixed selection. So any of the below could have ended up going against Gothas and Zeppelin Stackens.

    RAF night fighter units in the last 6 months of the war included:

    37 sqn BE 12 and BE 12a

    38 sqn FE 2b

    39 sqn Bristol Fighter

    44 sqn (already mentioned) Sopwith F1 Camel (including 'Comic cuts version)

    50 sqn SE 5a

    51 sqn FE2d

    61 sqn SE 5a

    75 sqn Avro 504 K Night Fighter version

    76 sqn BE 12b

    78 sqn Sopwith Camel F1

    112 sqn Sopwith Camel F1

    141 sqn Bristol Fighter

    143 sqn SE5a
    I've not been able to find much on the German side, apart from firsthand accounts of "Halberstadts", presumably CL.IIs, as an account of a crash mentioned two crew.

    The French were apparently the first to put dual lewis guns over the top wing on Nieuport 11s, 17s etc and use them as nightfighters. There are many photos of French naval Nieuports used for defence of Dunkerque, Calais etc against the incessant and rather successful German night bomber attacks.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Dunkerque_Malvoisin_Ni.jpg 
Views:	61 
Size:	25.5 KB 
ID:	221336Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Dunkerque-Barbier.jpg 
Views:	61 
Size:	37.9 KB 
ID:	221337

    He delivers his experience on the nocturnal hunting, then completely experimental at the time, to the newspaper " La guerre aérienne illustrée ": "

    Really, you can distinguish an enemy machine in the middle of the night?
    By moonlight, certainly! You are also guided by the green flames of the engine exhaust. The bows which come to bombard us are all the better, as they send only two-engined or tri-engine engines.

    And how do you avoid the risks of attacking each other?
    They are patrolled in separate stages of at least 300 meters and 500 meters at most. On each floor there is, moreover, only a hunting apparatus. What is most delicate is not to attack the big British cuckoos that return to bombard the Belgian cities. We use signals of recognition that allow us to recognize ourselves as best we can.
    http://albindenis.free.fr/Site_escad..._Dunkerque.htm

  2. #2

    Thumbs up

    Very interesting info Zoe!

  3. #3

    Default

    Further surgested reading is "The First Blitz" which gives a very informative read.

  4. #4

    Default

    Interesting reading, Zoe.
    Voilà le soleil d'Austerlitz!

  5. #5

    Default

    That took some extra courage, or, madness,

    "He is wise who watches"

  6. #6

    Default

    Night fightwta interdicting a bomber airfield could make an interesting scenario

  7. #7

    Default

    I seem to think that early WW11 Night Fighters were not at all successful to start with. Is this another case of forgetting, or ignoring, the lessons of WW1, convoys for example?

  8. #8

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Rebel View Post
    I seem to think that early WW11 Night Fighters were not at all successful to start with. Is this another case of forgetting, or ignoring, the lessons of WW1, convoys for example?
    Possibly -- the big problem with Night Fighting is Night Flying Is Required; and that leads to more than its share of peacetime fatalities, which don't go over well in the press. There's also a limited number of pilots who can be effective at night, even with Radar; I forget the details, but to be accepted for NF in the USAAF, one had to have even better than normal vision. And note how big the night fighters of WW2 were -- most of them were modified light-bomber designs (Blenheim; Havoc; Ju-88), as there weren't that many fighters which could carry a radar set; the resulting low top speeds made intercepts difficult at best.

    End result is: The folks in WW2 had to start over from square one.

  9. #9

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by csadn View Post
    Possibly -- the big problem with Night Fighting is Night Flying Is Required; and that leads to more than its share of peacetime fatalities, which don't go over well in the press. There's also a limited number of pilots who can be effective at night, even with Radar; I forget the details, but to be accepted for NF in the USAAF, one had to have even better than normal vision. And note how big the night fighters of WW2 were -- most of them were modified light-bomber designs (Blenheim; Havoc; Ju-88), as there weren't that many fighters which could carry a radar set; the resulting low top speeds made intercepts difficult at best.

    End result is: The folks in WW2 had to start over from square one.
    Take your point on the flying but I am correct about the re-introduction of convoys!

  10. #10

    Default

    Nice find,Zoe-and Chris is right about the WW 2 night fighters. Pretty much starting over from scratch.

  11. #11

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Rebel View Post
    Take your point on the flying but I am correct about the re-introduction of convoys!
    Convoys were another example; but there a large part of the problem was not only a paucity of suitable equipment (which is why Churchill wanted those US "four-stack" DDs), but also advances in tech which allowed U-boats to better communicate and co-ordinate. A convoy helps, as it turns what was a "guerilla war" into a set-piece battle (the transports are Here; therefore the U-boats must come Here; therefore we can concentrate the Anti-U-Boat Ships Here); but there's still the question of when the U-boats show up, and from which direction(s), and in what numbers -- radio is a mixed blessing....

  12. #12

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by csadn View Post
    Convoys were another example; but there a large part of the problem was not only a paucity of suitable equipment (which is why Churchill wanted those US "four-stack" DDs), but also advances in tech which allowed U-boats to better communicate and co-ordinate. A convoy helps, as it turns what was a "guerilla war" into a set-piece battle (the transports are Here; therefore the U-boats must come Here; therefore we can concentrate the Anti-U-Boat Ships Here); but there's still the question of when the U-boats show up, and from which direction(s), and in what numbers -- radio is a mixed blessing....
    Yes Chris you are correct in what you say. The American Navy was dead against it to begin with. However there was a dramatic decrease in shipping losses once the convoy system was re-introduced albeit it did continue at a very high rate for years to come.



Similar Missions

  1. _Air & Space_ Article on Night Fighters, Esp. P-61
    By csadn in forum Officer's Club
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 07-22-2016, 16:11
  2. New HBM 1:200 USAAF fighters now available
    By Ragnar200 in forum Metal and Resin Models
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 08-18-2015, 11:45
  3. Austro-Hungarian Army Fighters Part 3 the Phonix fighters
    By john snelling in forum WGF: Historical Discussions
    Replies: 19
    Last Post: 08-19-2013, 16:14
  4. The First Dog-Fighters 1-5
    By CappyTom in forum WGF: General Discussions
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: 02-02-2011, 15:28

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •