Choice of planes for the next Print run?
OK, Fun time.
Was looking at some of the variants of planes used but yet to be produced for the game, SO I compiled a list of 4 planes, 2 for each side and 1 recon and 1 fighter.
Post what your wishes would be, only thing is they must have seen action and produced in fair numbers (over 100)
My List
French 2 seat recon........Salmson 2
Russian fighter.......Anatra-DS
German Fighter....Pfalz D XII
Austrian 2 seat Recon.....Brandon Burg CI
Have at it...
Oh yeah I would love to see the Pfalz produced. Nice list
Sopwith Pup
Royal Aircraft Factory BE2
Italian twoseaters:
Pomilio PC
SAML S.2
Voilą le soleil d'Austerlitz!
As the next WWI release is new planes, I'm hoping for a reprint run on Pflaz DIII & SE5a. But yep, Pups would be lovely too.
Foz, I am assuming they will do a reprint next followed by a new batch. We all want the Se5a.....EVERYONE wants the SE5a..But I was looking for new planes, ones you never hear of because they were overshadowed by the Camels and Fokkers. We are in serious need of early war stuff and some of the mid and late war odds and ends that never got proper notice for their services.
Also as it would be a new run we would need a fighter and a 2 seater from each side.
Keep em coming though.
Etrich Taube
Bleriot 10-2
Lloyd C.II
Be2c
Round out the early war stuff.
The Sopwith Pup really has to be the Entente Scout - at this stage I'd say it's by far the most glaring omission from the official miniatures line.
I agree the Pfalz D.XII is a good call for the other side, or if they want a more suitable opponent for the Pup, either the Roland D.II or the Fokker D.III.
If going for a 4 scout series, I'd add the Sopwith Dolphin, which would be a decent match-up for the Pfalz. If going with 2 scouts and 2 2-seaters there are still many options, although an Fe2 would be nice.
Entente scout - Sopwith Pup (RFC, RNAS, Imperial Russia)
Entente 2 seater - Salmson 2 A2 (France, USA, Soviet Russia)
Central Powers scout - Fokker D.II (Luftstreitkräfte x 3)
Central Powers 2 seater - Hansa-Brandenburg W.12 (Kaiserliche Marine x 3)
Fighters - Sopwith Pup and Pfalz DXII
(The Pup is long overdue)
2-seaters - BE2c and Albatross CVII
Good thinking, Ken. I had actually been planning a poll on this myself.
BTW, my understanding is the mainline production sequence is Series 9 (the next wave with Nieuport 11s), Series 3 reintroduction under Ares, then Series 10 (what we're discussing ideas to fill), then Series 4 relaunch. Looks like one each New, Rerun and Special per year for both WWI and WWII, and a fair bit slower on Sails (fair, since Sails costs a good bit more and a completist needs twice as much).
I agree with above except for one iconic German plane missing.
'German 2 seater LVG C.V or DFW C.V'
Fokker D.II / D.III
Sopwith Pup
Salmson 2 A2
Hmmm so Far the Sopwith Pup and Salmson2 A2 seem to be favorites.
For the other side Fokker DII and DIII get a lot of interest but the Pfalz XII has gotten a few votes also. The Central Powers 2 seater seems to be up in the air though.
Lots of good stuff here, keep em coming.
I second all of those selections.Originally Posted by LOOP
id like to see;
roland DII
sopwith dolphin
taube
fe2b
As long as we're kicking this idea around again might as well throw in some ideas - depending on what part of the war they want to base the series on will influence ideas -
Toward front end - BE2c is a must, FE2b another, Bristol Scout, Sopwith Pup, Armstrong-Whitworth F.K.8,
Toward the back end - Pfalz DXII, Roland D.VIb, SSD.IV, Sopwith Dolphin, Airco DH9
Sapiens qui vigilat... "He is wise who watches"
I like the thought of a Pfalz XII but it is like the Snipe and Fokker DVIII, quite late to the party. I'd rather see planes with a bit more use in them.
The problem is we are fast running out of Central Powers aircraft. Whilst we are still waiting for Entente mainstays like the Sopwith Pup, the BE.2c/d/e and the BE.12 scout variant, the FE.2b, FE.8, AW FK.8 as well as the Sopwith Dolphin and many other less well known types, bringing something new to the table is becoming much more difficult for the Central Powers. The Roland D.II was considered inferior to the Albatros types and saw limited use (it was big in Macedonia). The Pfalz D.XII saw limited service in late 1918 as it was considered inferior to the Fokker D.VII. I agree two seaters like the LVG and DFW are iconic but do they bring anything to the table that the Albatros C.III and Rumpler C.IV don't already provide?
The Pfalz DXII arrived in Bavarian units at the front in July 1918, only 6 weeks or so after the Fokker DVII. Far more useful than a Snipe or a Fokker DVIII.
I laugh in the face of danger - then I hide until it goes away!
Yep. In terms of numbers that actually saw service, it's the biggest omission from the German scouts - by the end of August 1918 there were a dozen squadrons' worth of Pfalz D.XII in service - 168 aircraft with front line units on the 31st August strength returns. The Roland D.IIa is the only other German scout that hasn't been done, and reached more than 100 in service at the same time (128 at the end of June 1917.)
How about a DFW C.V? Large production run, well regarded by friend and foe, serving from its introduction in 1916 through the end of the war and beyond.
Served on all fronts.
Last edited by BB401; 05-14-2016 at 04:41.
Not just large production run, but by *far* the most numerous German aircraft of the war - peaked at about 1500 simultaneously in service, waaaay more than anything else. But nobody's heard of it....
Lot to be said for the DFW it seems...
I have noticed we are running low on aircraft for the Central powers BTW. That does give us a chance to bring out more of the forgotten ones. Also some good points about early or late theme for our choices.
Keep it up guys.
Nice thread....seems the key issue is time-frame...early war or late war.
Only question for Taube lovers...for what purpose...no guns, just bricks...very limited use...novelty wears off quickly and sales would probably be horrid...Shapeways offers excellent option for those who must have a useless but pretty plane...just my opinion.
I personally would vote for the early war... the Pup is looooong overdue!
Spot on Tim & Dom, and the Roland D.VI came into service about the same time as the Fokker D.VII. Now, they may not have been in huge numbers or hugely popular with all the pilots but both the Pfalz & Roland are better than an Albatros, esp in game terms, with Q & F deck respectively so are worth having in the inventory.
Sapiens qui vigilat... "He is wise who watches"
Now hear this, we need/want/covet the Sopwith PUP! Bring us this amazing plane that has somehow lost out and not yet been produced in miniature form. As you were....
What about an iconic early war French two seater : Voisin 3 and Voisin 5.
It can be part of a regular 4 planes serie (same dimensions as the RAF FE2b : Same wingspan as the Breguet 14 and same length as the Airco DH4. Voisin 8 and 10 are much bigger).
First aircraft to shoot down an enemy plane (October 1914 against an Aviatik B).
Used for strategic and tactical day then night bombing, and also ground attack (with a 37 or 47mm gun instead of the machine gun).
Mainly by French squadrons, but also in England , Italy, Belgium and Russia.
I agree Thomas. The Taube was only in front line service for the first six months of the war, after which it was withdrawn for training use only. Unarmed aircraft were certainly plentiful on both sides in the early war period (Albatros B.I etc) but how much fun is it flying these aircraft?
Yes! Yes! Yes! Yes!
And I very much agree with others that we need a Pup.
For the Germans, I think that the best mid/late war two-seater is the DFW C-V. Single seater? For the Central Powers, how about the Hansa-Brandenburg D-I (aka "Star Strutter").
Question: How do we break time up into Early vs Late War, with or without a Mid option? I'm gonna build a data table for this thread and need those cutoffs to help shape it.
July 1915 to the end of 1916 early, 1917 mid, and 1918 late are as good a set of dates as any.
I think having had an A-H bird in series 9, going back to the Boche for Series 10 would probably be wise.
Those timespans are just what I was about to sugest
You beat me to it Dom
That would keep it simple, I'd go for that.
Sapiens qui vigilat... "He is wise who watches"
The Sopwith Pup and Salmson2 A2 seem to be good choices. For the Central powers, the DFW seems to be a good choice for a 2 seater. For the scout, please not another Albatross/Paltz with no special maneuvers. A short sideslip, a 90 degree turn to one direction or another, something to distinguish it.
A Pfalz DXII use the Q-deck so there you have 90-turns
Steep turns, one each of Left and Right, just like the SE5aA Pfalz DXII use the Q-deck so there you have 90-turns
Also a candidate for extended overdive house rules, as its wing style was based on the SPAD
I laugh in the face of danger - then I hide until it goes away!
I like all 4 of theseEntente scout - Sopwith Pup (RFC, RNAS, Imperial Russia)
Entente 2 seater - Salmson 2 A2 (France, USA, Soviet Russia)
Central Powers scout - Fokker D.II (Luftstreitkräfte x 3)
Central Powers 2 seater - Hansa-Brandenburg W.12 (Kaiserliche Marine x 3)
Will fill in the blanks as we go and I check dates... if you can add dates with your suggestions it just saves me the trouble.
Timeframe Entente Single CP Single Entente Tandem/Float CP Tandem/Float Entente Special CP Special Early
pre-1/1917Sopwith Pup Fokker D.I
H-B D.I
Fokker D.IIIRAF BE2
Voisin III
Vickers FB5 GunbusHansa-Brandenburg C.I
Etrich/Rumpler/et al Taube
Lloyd C.II
DFW C.V
Albatros C.VIIMid
1917Nieuport 24bis/27 LFG Roland D.II Salmson 2 A2
Anatra DS
SAML S.2 (mod. Aviatik B.I)
Pomilio PC
AMC DH5H-B W.12
LVG C.VLate
1918Sopwith Dolphin Pfalz D.XII
Alb. (Oef.) D.III Ser. 253
LFG Roland D.VI
SSW D.IV
Junkers D.I
Junkers J.I(A-H) Anatra C.I (=DS)
H-B W.18
Junkers CL.I
All props to OP, I'm just helping assemble the data.
As has been said (here and elsewhere), the choices for the CP are dwindling faster than for the Entente, and most were less than effective, widely used or even known :P
I would love to see the Pfalz D.XII, which was an extremely effective fighter, but was overshadowed by the supremely effective D.VII. Having the ground crews forced to go back to servicing a well braced plane after working on the unbraced D.VII caused an undercurrent of resentment. From my readings, I would rate the D.XII to be as good a plane as the D.VII.
The Fokker D.II/III was a fairly ineffective plane. I would rather see the Albatros D.III (Oeffag) series 253
If 2-seaters are part of the series, I would like either the DFW C.V or the H-B W-12.
For the Entente, the Pup is the obvious and long overdue choice. For the second choice, a scout should be the Sopwith dolphin; a 2-seater should be the Salmson.
Karl
It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus
How do we slot the Late 153 and 253 variants? Can they share a sculpt, or are they two all-new sculpts? Wikipedia's skosh on date details there...
Sopwith Pup: Early
Albatros D.III (Oeffag) series 253: Late (wow, go figure)
Fokker D.II: Early
Hansa-Brandenburg W.12 : Mid or late
Salmson 2 A2: Late
DFW C.V: Early to Late
Voisin 3/5: Early
Roland D.VI : Late
Roland D.II: Technically Early, most used in Mid
Be.2: Early
Pomilio PC: Mid;
Albatross CVII : early
LVG C.V: Mid
Hansa-Brandenburg D-I: Early
Etrich Taube: Pre-early
Bleriot 10-2: Early
Lloyd C.II: Early
Think I got everything mentioned.\
Karl
It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus
Sadly, no. The late 153 series had the spinner removed, so had a flat nose:
The 253 series introduced the slightly rounded nose with no spinner.
For dates, the A-H started producing the Oeffags in May '17, but I'd have to check sources back home next week (on vacation in the South right now) for the series dates. I would say that both the late 153s and the 253s are late.
Karl
It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus
Having a hard time finding design/role data on the Bleriot... this thread's the first thing that comes up on Google. Will add it to the table once I know where it fits...
On the Late 153: Use a Standard D.III sculpt mated to a 253 prop?
Wow...this thread took off today....Liking the debate and the time line mods done by Diamondback (thanks BTW)
Liking the way things are lining up for early war.
Sop Pup/Fok D3
Raf BE2/Hansa-Brandenburg C.I
Those pairs seem like a nice early line up though there is something to be said for the Voisin 3 and Voisin 5.
Seems we may be coming up with more then one list at this rate.
keep em coming...
Also, take a look at a similar thread I had a while back (OP in process of update) at http://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/sho...-sets-are-left
We can safely assume that if Nexus did a card for it, Ares will probably want to do it as a miniature at some point...
Scanned the thread a bit...good list and interesting ideas and comments from 3 years ago (shows how slow things are moving).
One good point was batted around sort of, we need a list that can stand on it's own and not just fill in the blanks. With the slow progress of releases and questionable avalibility of past runs it may be difficult for some to get earlier runs. SO....whatever is printed has to be playable on it's own and not just filling in. Hence our list has to be planes that can stand on their own and compete in the time frame we pick. As more planes are released it seems they will have to break the game down into time lines to keep things from getting out of hand too badly. I can see early/mid/late eras with planes falling into certain ones. Playing with my lady some night I have noticed some planes have a problem keeping up with others already. Throw a D7 against the Morane-Saulnier N and watch how fast things spin out.
I don't think these scouts have been mentioned:
Central Powers:
HB D.1. I guess you'd call it a mid, from late '16 - '18
SSW D.IV. Late
Fokker D.I. Early
HB W.18 Late
Allies:
DH.5 Mid.
Ni. 24bis/27 Mid.
My wants:
Pfalz D.XII
Pup
Spad 11 or an Italian 2 seater
HD C.I the most produced AH 2 seater
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote
Bookmarks