Blue on Blue.

[Tonx]

Everyone ...

I would like to let you know that over the last ten days two Aerodrome Members have left us. Though I will refrain from revealing identities and citing incidents because it's not the who's it is the what's which have lead me to post this. Especially when they have both PMed me to thank me for being a friend or being diplomatic before saying goodbye I now feel that this is something which we ought to be aware of.

Not ashamed of ... AWARE of and there is a difference between the two.

Member 1 left us five days ago over an argument which developed in a thread of theirs. I was the only person they PMed over their decision to go. As they are staying in touch with me I am able to urge them to continue to enjoy the game and now I am a WGF player too promise them that we will get a few games in too over time.

Member 2 leaving us has just brought me off Microsoft Flight Simulator 2004 leaving 295 persons dangling virtually in mid-air somewhere near Huddersfield! They have PMed a few Members as opposed to just myself. But as a thread which has now been deleted went out of control yesterday this made their mind up that they had seen what they wanted to see and heard what they wanted to hear. They will also continue to play WGF and I will also be getting a game or two in with them in the future.

Both joined in good faith and have left disillusioned and disappointed at what they found. In other words recent goings on have driven these two Members away and I can't help feeling that as both of these developments are own-goals for us as a collective. Or if anybody would like a scaled up equivalent there have been two blue on blues here: Friendly fire from the Aerodrome which supposedly values new Members / FNMs (Fairly New Members) and appears to have begun to drive them away ...

I know and appreciate after a serious incident called Squadrongate last year during which a new player left in disgust that the Aerodrome is not to everyone's liking. We also welcome Members every year who then drift away because of life-circumstances or external influences ... With some drifting away because they live in Wings of Glory Deserts where nobody else except them plays. These we cannot do anything about but I feel that in terms of what these two blue on blues have been about we maybe could.

Though the Admin Staff are excellent in these circumstances as shown yesterday nobody took the game up to experience unpleasantness and nobody joined the Aerodrome to have to put up with unfavourable instances and conduct. I have been known to use the saying I joined the Aerodrome conscientiously not controversially but I never realised that I would have somebody referring to me as the Aerodrome Diplomat one day. I think this was partly inspired by the way this person witnessed me being the first to recognise that a situation was in the making and trying to do something about it.

To conclude I would like us to remember why we are all here and what this is all about: Wings of Glory. The game we all play ... and S***s when it suits too. Please if unsure about a posting then stop and think / don't post and read and re-read at least once what we are about to post. Remember that the spirit of Wings of Glory banter is laughing with each other not at each other. Members are starting to leave over the current state of affairs and it's down to all of us to stem this flow ...

Anyway ... Enough from me. Because I had better go and rescue my 295 Flight Sim passengers

[Canestri10]

Well said Barney.

I love this community and I'm grateful to say I've been treated very well since joining. I hope others can say the same about me.

In the famous words of WAR

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5DmYLrxR0Y8

[Yell]

Well said Barney.

I love this community and I'm grateful to say I've been treated very well since joining. I hope others can say the same about me.

because it nearly caused a third person to leave yesterday

Hi Sam. So do I and so am I particularly from our neck of the woods. We have got some fantastic members to our credit but there are others worldwide too ...

What I nearly threw in the towel over was what brought Barn off Flight Sim. It has gone now but it started and he was the only person who tried to stop it. Then what happened made him look just like Cyril Ellis as the train went flying past him.

My addition to that list is don't be impulsive. I don't do Facebook but many of my friends do and go on there after drinking a few. Only to end up in all sorts of trouble and regret. Barn missed don't let emotions cloud stuff or judgement off his list too. I just feel sorry for the two members whose patience ran out. I genuinely do

[milcoll73]

well im sad to see, once again weve lost new players to what, seems to me, are fairly minor misunderstandings.
its only a game people.
the aerodrome is only a website (and a damn good one at that).
the ranks are only a courtesy.
the medals and sorties are only so many electrons organized in a certain way.

lighten up people.

personally ive been treated with nothing but kindness and respect and nothing ive seen so far has seemed to me to be reason enough to quit.

sure there have been incidents like the necrothread spammer but such things were easily enough dealt with.

if you read something that seems to be an insult, almost without exception, its simply someones attempt at humor that may have lost something in translation either due to cultural differences, a reference that one party doesnt know about, or simply from being put into written form. take a step back and try to see it in a humorous or at least non insulting light and i think most of these issues could be cleared up before they become an issue.

lighten up people. life is too short.

this website is too much of a safe haven from the chaos and maddness of the world to imperil with the kind of pettiness weve all dealt with on other websites or clubs.

[fast.git]

I've not been too active in the last couple of days, so this thread has me somewhat at a disadvantage as I don't know who's left, when they left, or why they left. The fact that they felt it necessary to do so saddens me, as my thoughts echo those of milcoll73 (Phillip). I have certainly had my share of disagreements with folks over the years, but they've always been at least civil, and at most quite informative.

I hope these departures do not mark a trend, as I've found this community to be incredibly supportive, home to a wealth of knowledge, and a pleasant distraction from the stresses of the real world.

In all such cases, I would ask that those interpreting insult or defamation in what they've read or have had said to pause and reflect before making any such decisions. As others have mentioned, misunderstandings and misinterpretations appear to be the root cause of resentment far more often than purposeful insult.

Regards,

Chris

[grumpybear]

Develop a bit of a thick skin . Some times a thread or comment will rase your hackles , if in doubt don't reply and let it pass.

[Tonx]

sure there have been incidents like the necrothread spammer but such things were easily enough dealt with.

lighten up people. life is too short.

Phillip Well Said Sir!

The Mav1624 Incident came to a head on August 23rd last year. All he seemed to prove to us was ... He had been a legit Member for a couple of years but he had obviously learned jack about the Aerodrome - or the game!

Life is too short especially when you get to hear about it on a regular basis at work as Members I am aware of being a firefighter (not heard from him for a while though?) and in the Medical Profession will agree wholeheartedly with you. But just like war not deciding who is right anymore but who is left it's something to quietly consider as we concentrate on playing and enjoying the game.

I have a lot of respect and admiration for our EFL (English as a Foreign Language) Speakers on the Aerodrome. Mind you we have the occasional query between American English and UK English speakers too like me going along like the clappers a few months ago for instance ... When going like a bat out of hell would have not only been understood better but funnier on reflection too!

PS - Cyril Ellis. Nice analogy Yell: I never thought of that one.

[gully_raker]

Must admit I am confused by this or did I miss something along the way?

I have found this the most friendly Forum I have ever had the pleasure to visit & I have made firm friends in the USA, Canada, UK, Poland, Germany, France & other European Countries.

[Tonx]

I've not been too active in the last couple of days, so this thread has me somewhat at a disadvantage as I don't know who's left, when they left, or why they left.

Chris, Hi. You will just have to take my word on this ... But yesterday looks like it nearly cost two Members now not just one. You would not have wanted to be here to witness a now-deleted thread going completely out of control. Five days ago another Member left over a separate argument leaving just me a PM to say Bye & Thanks.

I too hope this isn't the way we are going forward haemorrhaging Members as we blunder through the rest of this mess. From what I can tell so far things are making a swift and healthy recovery though - if you don't mind me saying I noticed you have been missing for a few days and it is great to see you back

[Tonx]

Must admit I am confused by this or did I miss something along the way?

Terribly sorry Barry but as I mention above we experienced a bit of a pile-up yesterday. But the Admin Staff were fantastic and the thread has now been deleted.

Trust me as somebody who found themselves in the middle of all this having tried to stop it - if you didn't see what happened it's definitely for the best. What is most important I feel is that we learn from what's almost cost and lost us three Members and eventually turn this negative into a positive that way. Turning it into a learning experience is the key to achieving this says me whose been told in the past that doing this is one of their major strengths: Well you can just imagine what I'd have to deal with if a fight broke out on a plane and you have got 155 feet of length and 222 inches across ... With nowhere to run.

Cyril Ellis ... What a strong analogy THIS in fact is. Received the George Medal for bravery in 1954. Whereas I just hope that life here goes on and we all get on with focussing on the game.

[OldGuy59]

I recently I made a comment in a thread that someone took as a personal attack. I made an immediate apology, but I have to say that I am somewhat in agreement with Darell [grumpybear] that a more resilient outlook needs to be taken at times. Not having been part of this thread gone wrong, I could have been in that situation, had I come back with my knee-jerk reaction to the thread I posted in. That could have gone so wrong, very quickly.

Thanks is owed to you, Barney, for jumping to my defense, BTW, while I obliviously went on with other posts.

There have been incidents where members have taken umbrage with others' remarks. I have seen people leave the Forum in those incidents. I hope I have not been the cause, in my passion during a discussion, to members leaving. There will always come a time, somewhere along the line, where people will have to agree to disagree, and hopefully continue to be civil to each other.

Not seeing the thread deprives us of an object lesson in how not to behave? Perhaps you are right, and we don't need to see it to learn. Your guidance provides words to post by, and I thankfully took that sober second thought you have suggested. I much rather have the Forum of friends, and the occasional civil adversary. Friendly teasing and rivalry is not too bad, either?

PS: I don't post when I have been drinking, any more either. Another lesson learned.

[Yell]

There is something I wish to post in relation to the pile up yesterday. Amidst which I became angrily over-defensive about one member in particular causing me to post something I now regret about another.

This is how rotten and upset I now feel. I want everyone to see this PM which I sent Tim after what happened. In the hope that it never happens again.

To: Mr Tim Hague.

Dear Mr Hague

Re: Formal Apology About Conduct.

I wish to apologise profusely for what happened on the Aerodrome on 9th March 2016.

You were not treated with the respect, dignity and fairness you deserved. It was never my intention to cause any offence and I hope my actions did not cause any irreparable damage. The thread has now been deleted and I do not wish to draw further attention to the matter. However this thread seems an appropriate place for the posting of this instead.

Please accept my apologies and be rest assured that something like this won’t happen again. This experience has taught me to consider the consequences and refrain from impulsive actions.

If you have any thoughts you would like to share, please PM me on the website.

Sincerely,

Danielle.

11th March 2016.

[Marechallannes]

Is there a reason to start this thread in the UK-Wing?


I'm a member since 2011 and I know a lot of comrades here in person.

This Aerodrome is a special place and differs a lot from other forums.

Yes we treat each other with respect, but that does not mean that each one has to be handled like a raw egg.

We're men and woman in the best age and exchange each other about the game, modelling, painting, history around the game and our different national points of view about history, pilots and planes.

That's the essence. If you go to mix it with other subjects you will get problems. That's the reason for: No religion & No politics.

...and it works.


So we should not use this great place for a discussion forum of "general" problems we and others have and to push it in the same direction many other forums goes.

That causes trouble and you'll see that this gentle community can quickly turn into something very strange.


It's an unwritten law to keep this things outside and I can understand that forum members will not only harvest sympathy and understanding for each opinion, point view or personal stories that they write here.


Somtimes we have trouble here too, especially with historic points of views, but like gentlemen & ladies - after the trouble - we reach the hand to each other and concentrate on the essential topics of the aerodrome again. So it's not 100% of harmony her, but: That's ok for me! We're playing with war machines that slaughtered hundereds of thousands of humans, so this Aerodrome is not the save harbour for hyper sensible people which love to push plastic toys over the table.


This is for gamers, model builders, painters, historical interested people who like the international exchange with each others and love WoG, history and the hobby that unites them. We try to handle each other with respect and accept each other like officers.


So I can understand if somebody does not find what he seeks at the Aerodrome community.

...and so he has to leave.


I think that's a win-win situation.


I get my daily portion of Aerodrome input here. From my point of view I can't name any frequent members that active try or tryed to push anybody out here.


So please don't start a discussion about something that does not exist since I joined the Aerodrome.




If I annoyed anybody - I don't care. I'm a Hun and Huns never care.

[Yell]

So please don't start a discussion about something that does not exist since I joined the Aerodrome.

If I annoyed anybody - I don't care. I'm a Hun and Huns never care.

Please don't write stuff like this about what happened here on March 9th. Something really awful happened on here and one person ... Barn acting alone tried to do something to stop it. He couldn't.

Whereas I just hope that life here goes on and we all get on with focussing on the game. This is the last comment he wrote upon here. The thread is now deleted. But IMHO Barn's actions must be remembered because I am so proud of what he tried to do.

[Tonx]

Sven. I know you care really and I think we all share and respect your views. But this started in the UK wing because I said so after yesterday.

Mike. Jumping to your defence on this occasion was a pleasure. A misunderstanding occurred and on this occasion I was able to have a positive influence on the situation.

Yell. When I can finally describe how proud of you I am I'll say so. Well Done ... Just Well Done for now though. REPPED.

Finally. Speaking of Cyril Ellis - why isn't the film Tangiwai: A Love Story available on DVD anywhere? Now ... Before everybody starts cracking chick-flick jokes (no offence taken if there are any!) This is actually not as soppy as it sounds. Even better have any of our Members Down Under / New Zealand way either seen it or got it on DVD?

Night all - been a long one so see you in a bit

[Diamondback]

Most important observation I'll probably ever make here, something we all need a reminder on every now and again: there isn't a damn thing on this site or anywhere on the whole bloody Internet that's worth a heart attack, an ulcer or a nervous breakdown (or for some of us, another of any of these.)

Hang in there... there'll be times you'll be offended without the other intending, and times you offend without intent--it's the nature of the beast with such impersonal communications where you can't look the other person in the eye. (Not that anybody can ever do that with me even face-to-face given the polarized lenses I have to wear to see at all, but...)

[Marechallannes]

Please don't write stuff like this about what happened here on March 9th. Something really awful happened on here and one person ....

That's your point of view and you're a member of this Aerodrome since... 1 month.

I read this "ignore button" thread. (...and tried to disarm it a little bit.)

This is no circus arena with a one person show.

[Nightbomber]

This is the virtual place I love the most.
What Barry and Sven wrote!
Funny, but you Eng/US/Can/NZ forumers do not know how nervous I sometimes get posting not in my mother tongue being afraid of using words or expressions that may be right for my understanding, but stupid, unproper or even offensive for you.
So let me apologize in advance if anythng like this ever happen .

The minor Ally,
Andy.

[Diamondback]

Goes to my point, amigo--eventually you're gonna step on somebody's toes without meaning to, and somebody's gonna step on yours similarly, so remember to cut 'em the slack you'd want 'em to cut you.

One exception: do not, EVER, throw a "Mom's basement" chairshot unless you want to see me go Full Metal B****y Little Girl* about it--as someone who had to walk away from a career before it really had a chance to start and take care of an invalid reltive, that one's just A Bridge Too Far.
*In the "behavioral" sense as used by Sam Axe (Bruce Campbell on Burn Notice), not the "gender" one.

[Mrs Kyte]

[QUOTE=Nightbomber;395843]This is the virtual place I love the most.
What Barry and Sven wrote!

I'll second that, Andy!
The friendships on this forum are what this is about - the fallings-out................. try to get over it and move onto better things.
Eileen

[Lt. S.Kafloc]

My thoughts ally themselves with what has been said.

I was part of that thread.

I posted the picture.

I took it all as tongue in cheek humour.

Not once was any individual or group mentioned.

Perhaps my sense of humour is eccentric and individual.

Now pass the port and don't pee on the aspidistra. It is definitely the last one.

[Teaticket]

Like Neil, I also posted as a joke but I saw a reply that seemed to take offense by someone not who I was joking with. I chose not to respond to that one as I did not wish to throw gas on the fire.

It's too easy to mis-interpret a comment. Immediate gut response is usually not a good thing. As many have said above, this is a wonderful place, full of great people from all over the world that I love and admire. Seeing a flare up is sad as I don't think anyone here really want that to happen. Other sites I have abandoned because of the trolling that is not present here. That said, it's water under the bridge. Let's lighten up and enjoy what a great place we have here.

[7eat51]

Folks, we're moving on. Such public comments about past events, current or past members, etc. are not conducive to enhancing our gaming experience or creating an environment that fosters community. If such sentiments need to be expressed, do so via PMs with interested parties. Every member on the Aerodrome or Anchorage is an adult, an autonomous individual. As such, every member is free to choose whether to ignore a comment, to ignore a thread, to choose the level of activity on these sites, or to leave. If something on this site causes anyone concern, that member should contact an administrator. This thread is now closed.