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Thread: Tables With Basic Statistics

  1. #1

    Default Tables With Basic Statistics

    I rediscovered my old copy of The Rand McNally Encyclopedia of Military Aircraft (1914-1980), published in 1980 by Enzo Angelucci.
    It is full of great illustrations and information about planes from WWI, WWII (between and after).
    For fun, I thought I'd share a couple of simple tables about WWI aviation and an illustration of the anatomy of a Handley Page 0/400.

    Click image for larger version. 

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  2. #2

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    Tim,
    Thanks for posting this. For those into limited fuel games, the endurance table is illuminating!
    Mike
    "Flying is learning to throw yourself at the ground and miss" Douglas Adams
    "Wings of Glory won't skin your elbows and knees while practicing." OldGuy59

  3. #3

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    That sounds like a good reference book. I did a Google search and noticed that there are two editions '1914 to 1980' and '1914 to the present'. Does anyone know whether the second one is simply the first with extra material or has material from the first been omitted in order to add more recent aircraft, please?

  4. #4

  5. #5

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    It was through reading the Rand McNally Encyclopedia of Military Aircraft that I got to thinking about the endurance of the individual planes. The same page in fact as RedTop put on the first post in this thread, where 'range' is used rather than 'endurance'.
    It seemed a bit unfair that we fly planes as though they can go on forever, advantaging those with a short endurance and disadvantaging those with a long endurance. I tried to think of a way of limiting the flying time of planes in a game related to their endurance.
    Being relatively new to WoG I suspected that somebody would have thought of this already. OldGuy59 refers to 'those into limited fuel games'. So somewhere someone must have what they use for that. Can anyone point me in the right direction or provide information?

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by Windy Jack View Post
    ... So somewhere someone must have what they use for that. Can anyone point me in the right direction or provide information?
    Search limited + fuel in Advanced search and you will find a number of threads on it Doug, quick and dirty solution are game turn limits to either just end it or turn for home.

    "He is wise who watches"

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by Windy Jack View Post
    It was through reading the Rand McNally Encyclopedia of Military Aircraft that I got to thinking about the endurance of the individual planes. The same page in fact as RedTop put on the first post in this thread, where 'range' is used rather than 'endurance'.
    It seemed a bit unfair that we fly planes as though they can go on forever, advantaging those with a short endurance and disadvantaging those with a long endurance. I tried to think of a way of limiting the flying time of planes in a game related to their endurance.
    Being relatively new to WoG I suspected that somebody would have thought of this already. OldGuy59 refers to 'those into limited fuel games'. So somewhere someone must have what they use for that. Can anyone point me in the right direction or provide information?
    Should be scenario driven. A lot of variables.

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by Windy Jack View Post
    Being relatively new to WoG I suspected that somebody would have thought of this already. OldGuy59 refers to 'those into limited fuel games'. So somewhere someone must have what they use for that. Can anyone point me in the right direction or provide information?
    WGS RAP has fuel rules. In WGS a fast manoeuvre uses 2 fuel points and a slow manoeuvre uses 1 fuel point. You decide how many fuel points the aircraft have available before the start of the mission. Good for use in Battle of Britain scenarios for example where 109s had only 20 min flying time over SE England.

  9. #9

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    Limited fuel and ammo I have used in games but can render games pure book keeping. Works well in campaign style games IMHO.
    See you on the Dark Side......

  10. #10

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    Thanks for posting the charts...an excellent source of information...have a copy in the basement library but cannot currently access due to inability to descend or climb stairs for a while...not sure which of the two editions I own...will update when possible if that query isn't answered by that time.

    Regarding the endurance/range concern...seems rather unimportant in the context of a game that normally consists of 20-40 full game turns for most scenarios...
    I don't recall the thread/threads that addressed the time per turn/phase, but recall the range of time per card was somewhere between 6-10 seconds per card...
    at 30 seconds per full three movements per turn the full time in a 40 turn game (a long scenario from my experiences) would only total roughly 20 minutes...at thirty minutes to combat and thirty minutes back to base that would total 1 hour and 20 minutes of flight time...well in limits for all planes currently available for combat...thus range/endurance doesn't seem a factor with much consideration. Could be wrong re time per card/turn but shouldn't be far off.

    Perhaps more worthy of consideration is the endless supply of ammo...we don't currently have a method for tracking usage...how many bursts before ammo is expended? And what about long versus short bursts? Food for thought....

  11. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by redcoon2 View Post
    Thanks for posting the charts...an excellent source of information...have a copy in the basement library but cannot currently access due to inability to descend or climb stairs for a while...not sure which of the two editions I own...will update when possible if that query isn't answered by that time.

    Regarding the endurance/range concern...seems rather unimportant in the context of a game that normally consists of 20-40 full game turns for most scenarios...
    I don't recall the thread/threads that addressed the time per turn/phase, but recall the range of time per card was somewhere between 6-10 seconds per card...
    at 30 seconds per full three movements per turn the full time in a 40 turn game (a long scenario from my experiences) would only total roughly 20 minutes...at thirty minutes to combat and thirty minutes back to base that would total 1 hour and 20 minutes of flight time...well in limits for all planes currently available for combat...thus range/endurance doesn't seem a factor with much consideration. Could be wrong re time per card/turn but shouldn't be far off.

    Perhaps more worthy of consideration is the endless supply of ammo...we don't currently have a method for tracking usage...how many bursts before ammo is expended? And what about long versus short bursts? Food for thought....
    I tried that with friends and they thought is was not needed. Still, like to play that way solo. This is what I used.

    Firing Guns

    Only the Lewis, Parabellum and observers Schwartlose machinegun shots need to be tracked. Both have 5 shots.
    A long range shot use 2 ammo counts, short range uses 1 ammo counts. Thus the Lewis can only fire three times (2.5 rounded up) at long range, or 5 times at short range, or a combination. Once ammo is depleted it is gone, but Lewis and Parabellum guns can reload. Each pilot has an initial load plus 2 reloads and the rear gunner has initial plus 4 reloads.

    Reloading and Unjamming
    It takes 3 phases of flying straight to reload or unjam a gun.
    Non-synchro guns (Lewis, Parabellum and Schwartlose mounted on the top wing or observers gun) ignore green jams.
    Red and Green jam card jams one gun (ie half of a twin-barrelled Spandau). Twin gunned planes with one gun jammed can still fire, but as "B" damage instead of "A" damage.

    For a pilot to reload or to clear a gun jam the counter can be removed if:
    the plane is not on fire
    the plane maneuver that is not part of immelman or overdive
    the pilot can only do one thing at a time shoot, reload or clear a jam
    Only one barrel/gun can be unjammed at a time.

    other
    - When jammed and if the plane is armed with both a Vickers and Lewis guns roll a 6 sided die 1-3 is the Lewis and 4-6 is the Vickers. Remember the Lewis gun ignores green jams. To save ammo one may fire the Vickers gun only use the “B” deck instead of the “A

    - Schwarzlose equipped guns cannot be unjammed except in the later series of Aviatik D.I, Albatross D.III (later 153 and 253 series), observer’s gun and aircraft equipped with modified guns or mounts. If the Schwarzlose gun is mounted on the wing it ignores green jams and does not run out of ammo because it was belt fed.

    - Pflaz D.III cannot unjam (due to pilot inaccessibility; but problem was rectified with D.IIIa variant).

    I anyone has information that it on the subject please let me know.

    I keep track of the firing by using white plastic poker chips and reloads with blue chips. When the white chips or gone, trade in a blue one for 3 jam chits once the jam chits are gone give the player 5 white poker chips.

  12. #12

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    Thanks for posting that, John.
    Rep inbound ....

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    Thanks for the direction, Dave. I can see that there was quite a bit of discussion on the matter of limited fuel in 2009 to 2011, with the strongest conclusion being KISS.

  14. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by Windy Jack View Post
    Thanks for the direction, Dave. I can see that there was quite a bit of discussion on the matter of limited fuel in 2009 to 2011, with the strongest conclusion being KISS.
    I think that's because most people want to concentrate on the fighting rather than watch their fuel gauge Doug.
    As a game turn represents about six seconds of flight time I find there's little point myself but a scenario driven time/turn limit is as good as any to represent this.

    "He is wise who watches"

  15. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by Naharaht View Post
    That sounds like a good reference book. I did a Google search and noticed that there are two editions '1914 to 1980' and '1914 to the present'. Does anyone know whether the second one is simply the first with extra material or has material from the first been omitted in order to add more recent aircraft, please?
    Does anyone know the answer to this question? I'd like to know what the difference is between the two editions also -



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