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Thread: How to do a Heinkel 177

  1. #1

    Default How to do a Heinkel 177

    By popular request – well the Oberst and Nightbomber requested it – and it being a slow day in the office, I give you my ‘How To’ for painting the Heinkel 177, accessorised with a couple of Henschel glide bombs.

    Why the Heinkel 177 for the Bomber Compo?
    Working on the theory that a lot of entrants would go for Ares official models (B17, B25, Heinkel III, Lanc) I looked at my resin stash to find something different. I came up with a Junkers 287 and a couple of Greifs that fitted the bill. I ruled the Junkers out on the grounds that it was not operational and I couldn’t be arsed to develop a scenario so it could be entered in the competition.

    What scheme?
    Again I was looking for a camo scheme that stood out. I found many illustrations for the Greif, ranging from standard light blue underside/2-tone green splinter pattern upper surface scheme to the nightmare scheme that became my entry. Given the small scale and the fact that I was brush painting rather than airbrushing, I ruled out any scheme that had a spray mottle finish as I couldn’t get the mottle to look ‘right’. I settled for the KG100 scheme shown in Airfile’s book “Adler Gegen England”. This gives a port-side view, and a quick Google turned up a plan view of the scheme. As an aside, Google also turned up a picture of a FW190/He177 Mistel combination, which got me salivating somewhat!

    Prepping the model
    The plane itself came from Armaments in Miniature, as did the two Henschel glide bombs.



    This got a quick going-over with sanding sticks, holes were drilled where guns and aerial should be, and piano wire superglued into the holes. A domed hole was bored underneath to eventually take the ballbearing that would form the gimble. A smaller hole was then drilled through the middle of this big hole to take a length of brass rod, which did service as a handle during painting. A quick degrease in soapy water followed by an overall spray of Tamiya Superfine Grey Primer, and we were ready to rock & roll.

    Painting
    I had so many good ideas for this: producing paint masks, airbrushing the camo scheme...... 5 minutes looking at the model and working what needed to be done on such a small scale plane convinced me that life was way too short, so away went the airbrush and out came the paint brushes.

    All glass was painted in Vallejo French Mirage blue, Games Workshop blue ink then highlighted in lighter shades of Mirage blue. That was the easy bit. The rest of the painting was done with Life Color paints, which are designed for airbrushes and are very thin. Therefore you need at least two coats of everything to get the necessary depth of colour when hand brushing, but you don’t get an obvious build up of paint you sometimes get when overpainting surfaces with several layers.

    The AIM model has finely etched panel lines which I first painted with a thin coat of a darker shade of the overall surface colour (RLM 65 Hellblau undersides, RLM 76 Lichtblau upper surfaces) The lower panels were carefully painted in (much restoring of panel lines and harsh language ensued), masked off and the process repeated on the topside with the Lichtblau (The original apparently had green uppers oversprayed with Lichtblau, but I did it the other way round as I felt painting a light colour over a darker one would cause problems). I overpainted the green pattern freehand then painted in the panel lines in the green area. If I had dispensed with the panel lines I think painting time would have been cut by 75%. That left the guns and the swirly bits on the prop bosses and removal of masking tape, and it was ready for a coat of Life Color gloss varnish.

    Decals and finishing
    All decals came from Mehusla, either 1/200 or 1/144 scale. The large codes on the original were not edged with white/black, but I used a bit of artistic licence to make them stand out a bit more. A couple of coats of Testor’s Dullcote, removal of the brass rod and installation of the ballbearing, addition of AA Perspex props and it was ready for photographing.

    Painting the Hs293s
    Paint blue – sorted!



    Mistakes
    Mistakes Andrzej? How very dare you!

    Actually there’s only two I can think of (apart from picking this flaming scheme in the first place), the first was carelessly overpainting bits of the panel lines on occasion (OK, many occasions) and having to restore them. This took up a lot of time. The second was a couple of times when I got confused painting the upper surface and sent squiggles in the wrong direction and had to overpaint them (SWMBO calling for me to tone down the language...).

    Hints
    Not much to offer here, other than what’s gone before – use of a brass rod saved having to handle the plane with greasy mitts while painting. Good quality masking tape is a must to stop paint bleed. See Jame’s (FarEast) article on masking tape here

    Oh and remember children, when using a can of spray primer make sure the nozzle is pointing towards the model, not away from it (that’s another T-shirt I won’t be wearing again!).

    In conclusion
    It wasn’t the easiest paintjob to apply and there was a point where I more or less lost the will to live, but I have to say I was pleased with the end result. If I was just painting this up for gaming I wouldn’t have bothered with panel lines, saving myself a lot of grief (greif, grief – geddit?). I still have another He177 to paint, which will probably end up as a 2/KG100 machine which had black under surfaces and green splinter pattern on top, and will be armed with 2 BBBs (Bloody Big Bombs). On the other hand the pic of the Mistel combo is tempting.....
    Last edited by Guntruck; 11-26-2015 at 03:29.
    Run for your life - there are stupid people everywhere!

  2. #2

    matt56's Avatar May you forever fly in blue skies.
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    What a gorgeous job on this one, Steve - and well worth the headache when all is said and done!

    Your work on the camo scheme and picking out the panel lines really made this stand out wonderfully.

    Thanks for the tips and play-by-play - I think a Greif is definitely going to eventually make its way into my limited collection of Dark Side aircraft...

    All the best,
    Matt

  3. #3

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    Exceptional Steve, and you may feel better when I tell you that it was the panel work which swung it for me in the end.
    Rob.
    "Courage is the art of being the only one who knows you're scared to death."

  4. #4

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    Wonderful model, Steve.

    Rep gun already fired at your direction.
    Voilà le soleil d'Austerlitz!

  5. #5

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    That is the business Steve and you got my vote - what a cracker !

    "He is wise who watches"

  6. #6

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    You forgot the last step: "Soak in lighter fluid and apply flame." (-177s were infamous firetraps.) :)

  7. #7

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    This description of your marvellous work alone deserves a , Steve!
    while rerading it .
    Of course there were no mistakes on your side.
    You will be surprised what mistakes I made working on my Heinkel, old chap. And there will be no reason to , but rather to ...
    <img src=http://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=2554&dateline=1409073309 border=0 alt= />
    "We do not stop playing when we get old, but we get old when we stop playing."

  8. #8

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    Many thanks for your great comments guys, and the rep points that have come my way. Much appreciated.
    Run for your life - there are stupid people everywhere!

  9. #9

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    Excellent Steve, as all your models are, got my vote also. Well done that man

  10. #10

  11. #11

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    Certainly a striking bird you painted, Steve. And one that's on my eventual to-do list.
    Can't rep you, but I can

    Karl
    It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus

  12. #12

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    Great work Steve. REP for sure.

  13. #13

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    Many thanks for the rep Peter
    Run for your life - there are stupid people everywhere!

  14. #14

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    Perfect Steve!
    Thanks so much!
    REP!

  15. #15

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    Many thanks Joaquim
    Run for your life - there are stupid people everywhere!

  16. #16

  17. #17

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    Thank 'e kindly Tim
    Run for your life - there are stupid people everywhere!

  18. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by Guntruck View Post
    On the other hand the pic of the Mistel combo is tempting.....
    It would have to be a what-if, as they never completed one, just talked about them.
    From the new Osprey combat aircraft 112: Luftwaffe Mistel Composite Bomber Units:

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Karl
    It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus

  19. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jager View Post
    It would have to be a what-if, as they never completed one, just talked about them.

    Karl
    Obviously, but still no reason not to Karl
    Run for your life - there are stupid people everywhere!

  20. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by Guntruck View Post
    Obviously, but still no reason not to Karl
    Of course not; I'm never one to say nay to a what-if
    (pity the poor Fw-190 pilot, though )
    Karl
    It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus

  21. #21

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    The -177 would have caught fire long before it reached the launch zone, anyway.

  22. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by csadn View Post
    The -177 would have caught fire long before it reached the launch zone, anyway.
    No they fixed that issue by the time they were consider expending them as munitions
    Karl
    It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus

  23. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jager View Post
    No they fixed that issue by the time they were consider expending them as munitions
    Karl
    Not so -- the -177's problems were such that they could never be fixed. (The problem was with the packaging of the engines and fluid lines; the only possible way to fix it was to go with a 4-prop design.)

  24. #24

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    Hmmm...

    You don't need anyone to do up a card for your plane, do you Steve?

    Click image for larger version. 

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    I grabbed some drawings (unfortunately not very good ones) and started this, without considering who owned the plane.

    Want the rest?
    Mike
    "Flying is learning to throw yourself at the ground and miss" Douglas Adams
    "Wings of Glory won't skin your elbows and knees while practicing." OldGuy59

  25. #25

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    Mike, I think the relevant phrase here is: "Do bears crap in the woods?" A card is on my "I'll get round to it someday" list, but as you appear to be halfway there, one would be most acceptable,

    Only one thing - I think there was only 1 13mm MG in the rear dorsal turret.

    Edit: I see I cocked up the model by only putting one gun in the forward ventral turret. I suppose I shall have to give back the first prize now...
    Run for your life - there are stupid people everywhere!

  26. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by Guntruck View Post
    Mike, I think the relevant phrase here is: "Do bears crap in the woods?" A card is on my "I'll get round to it someday" list, but as you appear to be halfway there, one would be most acceptable,

    Only one thing - I think there was only 1 13mm MG in the rear dorsal turret.

    Edit: I see I cocked up the model by only putting one gun in the forward ventral turret. I suppose I shall have to give back the first prize now...
    Steve,
    It could be that there is an off-center gun in the rear dorsal. I had to mirror a Top/Bottom drawing to get this, and patched the forward turret to get the off-center mounting correct. I can check other drawings and patch this together.

    Do you have any stats for this plane? Maneuver deck, damage? I can figure out the arcs for the most part. What damage ratings for each gun I could probably fake, but if you have a suggestion, I'd run with it.

    Another version (corrected upper details):
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Last edited by OldGuy59; 12-04-2015 at 17:30.
    Mike
    "Flying is learning to throw yourself at the ground and miss" Douglas Adams
    "Wings of Glory won't skin your elbows and knees while practicing." OldGuy59

  27. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by Guntruck View Post
    Edit: I see I cocked up the model by only putting one gun in the forward ventral turret.
    He 177s didn't have ventral turrets -- just the "Bola" gondola under the nose (1x 20mm forward; 1x 13mm aft).

  28. #28

    Dom S's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by csadn View Post
    He 177s didn't have ventral turrets -- just the "Bola" gondola under the nose (1x 20mm forward; 1x 13mm aft).
    Yes and no - the A1/R2 had a ventral turret with a single MG131, controlled remotely from the gondola, but they rapidly ditched it as the extra weight to mount just one HMG was deemed unjustifiable, so they cut out the remote control and the turret, and just stuck the gun in the back of the Bola gondola on later marks.

    Quote Originally Posted by OldGuy59 View Post
    Steve,
    It could be that there is an off-center gun in the rear dorsal.]
    I'm struggling to find photos offhand, but on the drawings I have (of an A5 variant) the rear dorsal turret does indeed appear to have a single gun offset to the gunner's right.
    Last edited by Dom S; 12-04-2015 at 18:20.

  29. #29

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    Quote Originally Posted by csadn View Post
    He 177s didn't have ventral turrets -- just the "Bola" gondola under the nose (1x 20mm forward; 1x 13mm aft).
    I meant dorsal
    Run for your life - there are stupid people everywhere!

  30. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by OldGuy59 View Post
    Steve,

    Do you have any stats for this plane? Maneuver deck, damage?
    Not yet Mike, I'll see if I can work some up over the weekend
    Run for your life - there are stupid people everywhere!

  31. #31

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    Draft Firing Arc Card:

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	WGS-He177-4KG100-PlaneCardV2a.jpg 
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ID:	250206
    Updated with Unofficial Stats input.
    Edited: Axis color in stats box.

    Comments or suggestions?
    Last edited by OldGuy59; 06-26-2018 at 22:04. Reason: Updating card
    Mike
    "Flying is learning to throw yourself at the ground and miss" Douglas Adams
    "Wings of Glory won't skin your elbows and knees while practicing." OldGuy59

  32. #32

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    As usual, any thread done about creating cards for planes is absolutely wonderful. This one specially is. Thank you, people for all of this.

  33. #33

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    Quote Originally Posted by OldGuy59 View Post
    Draft Firing Arc Card:

    Attachment 182937

    Comments or suggestions?
    I've replied to your query on the Unofficial planes thread. Sorry I've possibly picked a few holes.
    Last edited by Foz; 12-05-2015 at 08:34.

  34. #34

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dom S View Post
    Yes and no - the A1/R2 had a ventral turret with a single MG131, controlled remotely from the gondola, but they rapidly ditched it as the extra weight to mount just one HMG was deemed unjustifiable, so they cut out the remote control and the turret, and just stuck the gun in the back of the Bola gondola on later marks.
    [nod] As best I can tell, the A1/R2 never entered service.

  35. #35

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    Well, the Management Card should be OK?

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Edited: Axis color in stats box.
    Last edited by OldGuy59; 06-26-2018 at 22:02.
    Mike
    "Flying is learning to throw yourself at the ground and miss" Douglas Adams
    "Wings of Glory won't skin your elbows and knees while practicing." OldGuy59

  36. #36

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    A fine Masterclass Steve. Look forward to your next endeavour.


    I'm learning to fly, but I ain't got wings
    Coming down is the hardest thing

  37. #37

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    The Plane Card is updated with the latest from the Unofficial Stats thread.

    The XB deck is a bit slow on the fast arrow, but about right on the slow (full payload). Until I get the XBF deck posted, with the longer fast arrows, use the XB deck.

    Sample Straight XBF card:

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Mike
    "Flying is learning to throw yourself at the ground and miss" Douglas Adams
    "Wings of Glory won't skin your elbows and knees while practicing." OldGuy59

  38. #38

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    Good stuff Mike, thanks.

    Sorry I didn't get back to you on the stats - I put my back out at the weekend and spent it laying on the bed staring at the ceiling
    Run for your life - there are stupid people everywhere!

  39. #39

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    Quote Originally Posted by Guntruck View Post
    Good stuff Mike, thanks.

    Sorry I didn't get back to you on the stats - I put my back out at the weekend and spent it laying on the bed staring at the ceiling
    Not good, I hope you have an interesting ceiling. Don't rush on stats, between Karl, Mike & myself we are thrashing it all out. It's an awkward bugger I must say.

  40. #40

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    Quote Originally Posted by Guntruck View Post
    ...I put my back out at the weekend and spent it laying on the bed staring at the ceiling
    Get well soon old chap, nasty things dodgy backs.

    "He is wise who watches"

  41. #41

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    Quote Originally Posted by Guntruck View Post
    Good stuff Mike, thanks.

    Sorry I didn't get back to you on the stats - I put my back out at the weekend and spent it laying on the bed staring at the ceiling
    Quote Originally Posted by Foz View Post
    Not good, I hope you have an interesting ceiling. Don't rush on stats, between Karl, Mike & myself we are thrashing it all out. It's an awkward bugger I must say.
    I have a chronic bad back, and an allergy to muscle relaxants. So, occasionally, I have periods of attempting to move around in agony, waiting for the muscles to stop spasming. I feel for you, Steve [Guntruck].

    And, as Steve [Foz] says, we have the stats pounded out. The movement deck is as sorted as possible, with the available decks. I don't agree with the solution, but it is a function of the mechanics of card movement. Give me a few days, and the XBF deck should be posted in an album.

    Oh! And Thank You, Steve [Guntruck] for putting me over the 1500 Rep mark!
    Mike
    "Flying is learning to throw yourself at the ground and miss" Douglas Adams
    "Wings of Glory won't skin your elbows and knees while practicing." OldGuy59

  42. #42

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    Quote Originally Posted by Foz View Post
    Not good, I hope you have an interesting ceiling. Don't rush on stats, between Karl, Mike & myself we are thrashing it all out. It's an awkward bugger I must say.
    Jolly good, carry on Steve et al
    Run for your life - there are stupid people everywhere!

  43. #43

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    Quote Originally Posted by OldGuy59 View Post
    Oh! And Thank You, Steve [Guntruck] for putting me over the 1500 Rep mark!
    You are most welcome my friend, considering what you do for Aerodrome members
    Run for your life - there are stupid people everywhere!

  44. #44

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    Quote Originally Posted by flash View Post
    Get well soon old chap, nasty things dodgy backs.
    Cheers Dave. Ironically I did the damage hefting boxes of wargames figures into my car. A friend of mine passed and I got the job of moving all his wargames gear. I stupidly thought this small box couldn't be that heavy - wrong...
    I drove home but couldn't straighten up when I got out of the car. SWMBO thought it hilarious. I had a different opinion.
    Run for your life - there are stupid people everywhere!

  45. #45

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    Take care Steve. It is a health problem noone should underestimate.
    <img src=http://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=2554&dateline=1409073309 border=0 alt= />
    "We do not stop playing when we get old, but we get old when we stop playing."

  46. #46

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    Steve, absolutely beautiful. Thank you for the how to.

    Wishing you a speedy recovery.
    “You can discover more about a person in an hour of play than in a year of conversation.” ― Plato

  47. #47

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    Quote Originally Posted by Guntruck View Post
    You are most welcome my friend, considering what you do for Aerodrome members
    Hear, hear.

    Great work, Mike.
    “You can discover more about a person in an hour of play than in a year of conversation.” ― Plato

  48. #48

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    The new XBF maneuver deck is in an album here: XBF Deck Album
    Mike
    "Flying is learning to throw yourself at the ground and miss" Douglas Adams
    "Wings of Glory won't skin your elbows and knees while practicing." OldGuy59

  49. #49

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    Quote Originally Posted by OldGuy59 View Post
    The new XBF maneuver deck is in an album here: XBF Deck Album
    Run for your life - there are stupid people everywhere!

  50. #50

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    Finally!

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Click image for larger version. 

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    Last edited by OldGuy59; 06-26-2018 at 22:05.
    Mike
    "Flying is learning to throw yourself at the ground and miss" Douglas Adams
    "Wings of Glory won't skin your elbows and knees while practicing." OldGuy59

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