Firing Range from bombers question

[Malibumax]

Hi chaps

While playing a test game for a planned B-17 raid over Germany last Monday evening we came across a problem whereby the B-17 guns were able to outrange the guns on the attacking fighters.

In particular the chin turret, measuring the range from the dot on the bomber base, was able to reach an attacking fighter, while the attacking fighter, measuring the range from the centre of the flight stand as per the rules, fell short by about a quarter of an inch.

Has anyone else noticed this? I've done a search of the forums but found nothing. The obvious solution as far as I can see is to agree that if a defending machine gun can hit an attacking fighter then the fighter is also considered to be in range to return fire.

Max

[jbmacek]

You call it a problem, we call it a feature.
In short, yes. Sometimes the base sizes make firing solutions seem a little odd.
Our group doesn't worry about it, and plays 'em as they fall.

[Warhawk]

I drew an explosion from a Zero once that was attacking my B-17 from the rear and was out of range of my tail gunner so I think it works both ways.



Must be because the bombers base is quite large.
Actually out of range of the dorsal gunner, the Zero was out of the firing arc of my tail gunner.

[Warhawk]

Or is there a special rule regarding where you have to hit the bomber? We just played anywhere on the base.

[Flying Officer Kyte]

The size of the model is really the stumbling block. If you use the scale between the dots on the aircraft, and then apply it to a different scale used on the ruler, it makes the distance from front dot to rear much bigger than it would be in real terms. The easy answer is to shoot from peg to base in both directions. That means that if you can hit him he can hit you. Just take the arcs of fire for each gun as the limiting factors for traverse as if you were doing a normal run against any other smaller aircraft.
Rob.

[Warhawk]

The size of the model is really the stumbling block. If you use the scale between the dots on the aircraft, and then apply it to a different scale used on the ruler, it makes the distance from front dot to rear much bigger than it would be in real terms. The easy answer is to shoot from peg to base in both directions. That means that if you can hit him he can hit you. Just take the arcs of fire for each gun as the limiting factors for traverse as if you were doing a normal run against any other smaller aircraft.
Rob.

That makes a lot of sense, I'd have to agree with Rob.

[Malibumax]

Thanks chaps - it seems to be a cause of take your pick as to which option you want to use.

I'll discuss it with the guys I game with and see which option they would prefer to go with.

[LOOP]

I have only played WGF but the problem only apears only when a fighter are attacking from the front as the reargunner use the centerdot as measuringpoint.
Even if I from an tecnical point of view agree whith you Rob I see it as such a little advatage for the bomber that it is ignoreable.
I measures as it stands

[Flying Officer Kyte]

I have only played WGF but the problem only appears only when a fighter are attacking from the front as the rear gunner use the center dot as measuring point.
Even if I from an technical point of view agree with you Rob I see it as such a little advantage for the bomber that it is ignorable.
I measures as it stands

Ah yes Per, but wait until you get a Staaken. Attacking from the side and using the official peg to peg rule, to get a close range hit you would actually have to be inside the space between its forad wings and the tailplane.
I actually don't mind which way it is done, as long as all players agree on the day.
Rob.

[LOOP]

Ah yes Per, but wait until you get a Staaken. Attacking from the side and using the official peg to peg rule, to get a close range hit you would actually have to be inside the space between its forad wings and the tailplane.
I actually don't mind which way it is done, as long as all players agree on the day.
Rob.

Maybe my point was lost in translation. I measure peg/dot to base. It makes it easier for an attacker to hit from the side but easier for the bomber to hit from the front. But as you say Rob, if everyone agrees there is no problem

[Flying Officer Kyte]

Maybe my point was lost in translation. I measure peg/dot to base. It makes it easier for an attacker to hit from the side but easier for the bomber to hit from the front. But as you say Rob, if everyone agrees there is no problem

Right Per.
That is the way I usually do it too.
Rob.