Ares Games
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 50 of 59

Thread: your favorite pair to fly together?

  1. #1

    Default your favorite pair to fly together?

    I was wondering if any of you have a favorite pair of planes to use together for straight up dogfights, 2 on 2.

    I have not played enough to have a favorite yet but my plan is to fly an Fokker d VII and a Siemens Shuckert, and see if I can keep them together.
    Allied pair will be a snipe and a camel, tougher match but I like the planes.

    I am doing this just for fun not to be super competitive, I don't own 2 of the same plane yet so I can't do that but it may be more fun to use an unmatched pair.

    Please share your thoughts.

  2. #2

    Default

    Well,
    I haven't flown enough to have a favorite pair. But I've made up flights.

    The Black Flight of RNAS 10 for WWI, with five Sopwith Triplanes (six, if you count two for Collishaw: one with two guns, one with the usual single gun)

    I made up two pairs of Bf-109s: JG 26 - Galland and Horten; JG 53 - Molders and Fiel (two more wingers for JG 53 are coming)

    And I'm trying to produce decals for three Hawker Hurricanes for No.1 Squadron RCAF to fly against the Bf-109s.

    Hmmm... For a guy who professes he doesn't fly WWII stuff, I will have more custom planes in that era than the WWI stuff. Battle of Britain, here I come!
    Mike
    "Flying is learning to throw yourself at the ground and miss" Douglas Adams
    "Wings of Glory won't skin your elbows and knees while practicing." OldGuy59

  3. #3

    Dom S's Avatar
    Users Country Flag


    Name
    Dom
    Location
    People's Republic of South Yorkshire
    Sorties Flown
    2,081
    Join Date
    Jun 2010

    Default

    A little while ago my regular opponent and I played a mini campaign, with my 45 squadron Camels (evidently badly lost, since they should've been in Italy....) taking on Jasta 15 under his command. It was truly brutal - Fokker D.VIIs and SSW D.IIIs are a lethal combination....

  4. #4

    Default

    I always like to fly a Camel and an SE5 together against any other CP grouping. The versatility makes up for a lot.
    Rob.
    "Courage is the art of being the only one who knows you're scared to death."

  5. #5

    Mrkev's Avatar
    Users Country Flag


    Name
    Kev
    Location
    Merseyside/Cheshire
    Sorties Flown
    56
    Join Date
    Jul 2014

    Default

    I've had some pretty interesting fights with the DH2 and Camel teamed up. With the two planes being so wildly different I like to think of them as the carrot and the stick

    This leads me on to a good question actually. I like to buy planes in 2s: one entente and one central powers, to keep my set balanced. I'd like to get the Aviatik D1 next, and am torn between the Hanriot and the Tripe; what would you buy?
    Last edited by Mrkev; 10-25-2014 at 12:52.

  6. #6

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Mrkev View Post
    ...

    This leads me on to a good question actually. I like to buy planes in 2s: one entente and one central powers, to keep my set balanced. I'd like to get the Aviatik D1 next, and am torn between the Hanriot and the Tripe; what would you buy?
    That's a loaded question. I'd go for the Tripe, but another member of the Forum would warn you away from them on looks alone. I like the speed and maneuverability of the Tripe, regardless of the looks. I haven't flown the Hanriot, but I've not heard bad about it. Really, your choice. Mine was the Black Flight connection, so definitely the Tripe.
    Mike
    "Flying is learning to throw yourself at the ground and miss" Douglas Adams
    "Wings of Glory won't skin your elbows and knees while practicing." OldGuy59

  7. #7

    Default

    I have not flown my Tripes yet but have seen the Hanriot do very well in a game. Check out the manoevre card decks and see what the difference is.

  8. #8

    Default

    By the way I am talking WWI but post what ever you like, everyone is welcome, I just hope to see some good WWI pairs

  9. #9

    Default

    Snipe & Camel = very good combo! I love the Camel, but suffers on a right rudder jam. The Snipe is simply sick!

    If you are picking these combos, I think you are well on your way already

  10. #10

    Default

    DH4 and Bristol F2b for ground attack take some beating.

  11. #11

  12. #12

    Default

    Two Sopwith Camels.
    Voilà le soleil d'Austerlitz!

  13. #13

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Marechallannes View Post
    Two Sopwith Camels.
    I do like the camels.

  14. #14

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by grumpybear View Post
    A Dr1 and Albatross CIII
    Was the CIII from WOW? Or is that a 3rd party or custom plane?

  15. #15

    Smile

    Camel & SE Vs 2 Albatross D.Va's.

    As an aside we played an interesting game at our club last night. 2 players a side. Allied had 2 N.17's & a Sopwith 2 gun Tripe Vs 2 German Albatross D.II's. The Allies had to try to shoot down a German Balloon.
    Well all 3 Allied planes went down. One with 2 pilot wounds, one on fire & the balloon only had just over half damage. Counted about ten Zeros in that score so luck was on the German side. Both D.II's survived!

  16. #16

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Dom S View Post
    It was truly brutal - Fokker D.VIIs and SSW D.IIIs are a lethal combination....
    Why did you find it so; that is, what combination of stats made this a lethal combination?
    Karl
    It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus

  17. #17

    Default

    A pair of Spad VII, Advanced & Altitude Rules plus a couple of Ace Skills is my fav combo.

    But when I want an easy and fast game I chose a couple of Hanriots with their twin MGs.

    No matter the opponent as long as it remains under the historical availability.

    Mau

  18. #18

    Default

    SE5a & Camel vs. Fokker D.VII & Siemens Sch.

  19. #19

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by bmwrider View Post
    Was the CIII from WOW? Or is that a 3rd party or custom plane?
    Shapeways or Red Eagle

  20. #20

    Dom S's Avatar
    Users Country Flag


    Name
    Dom
    Location
    People's Republic of South Yorkshire
    Sorties Flown
    2,081
    Join Date
    Jun 2010

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Jager View Post
    Why did you find it so; that is, what combination of stats made this a lethal combination?
    Karl
    The D.VII's an all-round beast at the best of times, while the SSW's tight turns mean even the Camel's agility in a knife fight is no edge. Chuck in the SSW's exceptional cimb rate, and you struggle to beat them, and can't escape from them....

  21. #21

    Default

    SE5a at least can escape

  22. #22

    Default

    I missed out on the WOW minis, what is an SE5

  23. #23

    Default

    For WWI I have just the RDS so of course Camel and S.XIII for the Allies and Albatross D.Va and Fokker Dr.I for the Central Power. With cards (Famous Aces and Crossfire) i think a Camel and one of those Saml.S2 is very good. Dont know. Have some time since I dont play it.
    For WWII a pair of Hurricanes or D.520 can be very deadly.
    Thanks


    Nick

  24. #24

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Dom S View Post
    The D.VII's an all-round beast at the best of times, while the SSW's tight turns mean even the Camel's agility in a knife fight is no edge. Chuck in the SSW's exceptional cimb rate, and you struggle to beat them, and can't escape from them....
    Interesting assessment; I've flown both, of course, but generally don't fly more than 1 plane at a time.
    I didn't notice the symmetry between the two. I'll remember this
    Karl
    It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus

  25. #25

    Default

    I paint flights/squadrons, so like to fly pairs of the same model against their opponents.

    In recent 4 vs 4 games, SE5a s beat Alb DVas 4:0, but Fokker DVIIs beat SE5a s 3:0 (and the last SE5a escaped by the skin of its teeth - AAR to follow shortly!)

    I find that the DVII can match both the sharp turns and the climb rate of the SS DIII, so I'm afraid I don't see what it brings to the table over the DVII (except being available a month or so earlier in 1918).

  26. #26

    Default

    I think in game terms, the SSW's pretty similar to the D.VII, but in real life they were known for being better performers at high altitude. One of the natural limitations of our simple game system is that it doesn't differentiate performance by altitude the way planes did in real life.

  27. #27

    Default

    Some planes mentioned that I have not seen before, is there a site or post with a picture for each mini that has been released for WOWF and WOGF so far?
    just so I get to know all the planes mentioned in the forums.

  28. #28

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by bmwrider View Post
    Some planes mentioned that I have not seen before, is there a site or post with a picture for each mini that has been released for WOWF and WOGF so far?
    just so I get to know all the planes mentioned in the forums.
    Try this file:
    http://www.wingsofwar.org/forums/dow...do=file&id=723

    Karl
    It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus

  29. #29

    Exclamation

    Quote Originally Posted by bmwrider View Post
    I missed out on the WOW minis, what is an SE5
    Just one of the best British fighters from WW1.
    Strong, fast & good for getting in & out. Has a couple of nice side slips too.

    Unfortunately cant get the minis for love or an awful lot of Money.
    However if you are into painting them yourself then you can grab then from Shapeways. They use the N deck.

    Name:  Se5a Dallas avitar.png
Views: 320
Size:  19.8 KBName:  WW1 SE 5a Shuttleworth 2.jpg
Views: 324
Size:  81.9 KB

  30. #30

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by bmwrider View Post
    I missed out on the WOW minis, what is an SE5
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_A..._Factory_S.E.5

    One of my favourite planes!

  31. #31

    Default

    Never get the chance to grab a SE5, but historically seeing it seems very good. Hopefully im going to get some more planes in the end of this year, so more chance of combination.
    Thanks


    Nick

  32. #32

    Default

    It suits me well. Fast, robust, good climber.

  33. #33

  34. #34

    Default

    Two HD.1s, one each A and B deck. Or a Breguet 14.B2 and HD.1, if I'm having to do recon work. Still waiting on a Pup and 1&1/2-Strutter combo.

  35. #35

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by gully_raker View Post
    Just one of the best British fighters from WW1.
    Strong, fast & good for getting in & out. Has a couple of nice side slips too.

    Unfortunately cant get the minis for love or an awful lot of Money.
    However if you are into painting them yourself then you can grab then from Shapeways. They use the N deck.

    Name:  Se5a Dallas avitar.png
Views: 320
Size:  19.8 KBName:  WW1 SE 5a Shuttleworth 2.jpg
Views: 324
Size:  81.9 KB
    is SE5 the full name it was sold as in WOW?

  36. #36

    Default

    Fokker Dr I (Manfred von Richtofen)
    Sopwith camel (Barker)
    Fokker D VIII (Stark)
    Spad XIII (Rickenbaker)
    Snipe (gift unknown pilot)
    Albatross D. Va (Udit)
    Siemens Schuckert D. III (Lange)
    Airco DH 4 (Barlett)(Naylor)
    Sopwith triplane (Collishaw)
    Gotha G.V (Von Korrff)

    This my list so far.
    Which of these planes should I get a second copy of to fly as a matched pair.

  37. #37

    Default

    Todd,

    I'm not sure, try RAF SE5a. But it's mainly referred as SE5a only.

    RAF stands for Royal Aircraft Factory.

  38. #38

    Default

    Here is the full SP on the SE5.



    The Scout Experimental 5 (S.E.5.) was designed by H.P.Folland, J. Kenworthy and Major Gooden of the Royal Aircraft Factory.

    The S.E.5. was developed around the Hispano-Suiza 8a engine, which produced 150 hp, and proved to have excellent performance but tended to be unreliable.

    The first prototype was flown on the 22nd of November 1916 with a second being manufactured to the same specification which tragically proved to have a design fault in the wing.

    Both of the prototypes were destroyed in crashes, with Chief test pilot Major Gooden being killed in the first prototype on 28th of January 1917.

    A third prototype was produced with the wing weakness strengthend which led to the S.E.5. to be a very strong aircraft allowing it to be dived at very high speed.

    The S.E.5. was extremely stable, manoeverable, relatively easy to fly and could reach a speed of 138 mph making it safer to fly especially for novice pilots.

    Armed with a synchronised 0.303" Vickers machine gun to shoot through the propeller and a 0.303" Lewis machine gun 'Foster mounted' on the top wing, the pilot could fire from below an enemy aircraft as well as with two guns firing forward.

    After producing 77 S.E.5's attention was turned to the improved S.E.5.a which had an improved Hispano-Suiza 8b engine, producing 200 hp, with 5,265 being built.

    The Hispano-Suiza 8b engine proved to be unreliable. due to gear reduction problems. and so was replaced by the Wolseley Viper engine producing 200 hp solving the engine problem.

    A further prototype variant of the S.E.5 was manufactured in April 1918, namely the S.E.5.b. It had a streamlined nose, spinner and wings of an unequal span. The reduced drag from the streamlined nose was negated by the extra drag from the larger upper wing and as there was no real benefit from the design it was not persued as a replacement for the S.E.5.a.


    Specifications: -
    Crew: 1
    Wing Type: Bi-plane
    Length: 20ft 11in (6.38m)
    Wingspan: 26ft 11in (8.11m)
    Height: 9ft 6in (2.89m)
    Empty Weight: 1,531lb (694kg)
    Max. Weight: 2,048lb (929kg)
    Engine: Hispano-Suiza 8B or Wolseley W.4A Viper.
    Max. Speed: 120mph (193km/h)
    Range: 300 miles (483km)
    Armament: -
    Machine Guns: 1 x 0.303" Vickers (sync.)
    1 x 0.303" Lewis
    Bombs: 4 x 25lb Cooper Bombs
    Variants: -

    SE5
    Single seat fighter powered by Hispano Suiza 8a engine producing 150 hp.

    SE5a
    Improved version of SE5 powered by Hispano Suiza 8a or Wolseley Viper engine both producing 200 hp.

    SE5b
    Experimental prototype, with semi-sesquiplane wings, streamlined nose and retractable radiator.

    SE5e
    United States assembled SE5a powered by Wright-Hispano E engine producing 180 hp and with plywood skinned fuselage.



    Rob.
    "Courage is the art of being the only one who knows you're scared to death."

  39. #39

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Flying Officer Kyte View Post
    Here is the full SP on the SE5.



    The Scout Experimental 5 (S.E.5.) was designed by H.P.Folland, J. Kenworthy and Major Gooden of the Royal Aircraft Factory.

    The S.E.5. was developed around the Hispano-Suiza 8a engine, which produced 150 hp, and proved to have excellent performance but tended to be unreliable.

    The first prototype was flown on the 22nd of November 1916 with a second being manufactured to the same specification which tragically proved to have a design fault in the wing.

    Both of the prototypes were destroyed in crashes, with Chief test pilot Major Gooden being killed in the first prototype on 28th of January 1917.

    A third prototype was produced with the wing weakness strengthend which led to the S.E.5. to be a very strong aircraft allowing it to be dived at very high speed.

    The S.E.5. was extremely stable, manoeverable, relatively easy to fly and could reach a speed of 138 mph making it safer to fly especially for novice pilots.

    Armed with a synchronised 0.303" Vickers machine gun to shoot through the propeller and a 0.303" Lewis machine gun 'Foster mounted' on the top wing, the pilot could fire from below an enemy aircraft as well as with two guns firing forward.

    After producing 77 S.E.5's attention was turned to the improved S.E.5.a which had an improved Hispano-Suiza 8b engine, producing 200 hp, with 5,265 being built.

    The Hispano-Suiza 8b engine proved to be unreliable. due to gear reduction problems. and so was replaced by the Wolseley Viper engine producing 200 hp solving the engine problem.

    A further prototype variant of the S.E.5 was manufactured in April 1918, namely the S.E.5.b. It had a streamlined nose, spinner and wings of an unequal span. The reduced drag from the streamlined nose was negated by the extra drag from the larger upper wing and as there was no real benefit from the design it was not persued as a replacement for the S.E.5.a.


    Specifications: -
    Crew: 1
    Wing Type: Bi-plane
    Length: 20ft 11in (6.38m)
    Wingspan: 26ft 11in (8.11m)
    Height: 9ft 6in (2.89m)
    Empty Weight: 1,531lb (694kg)
    Max. Weight: 2,048lb (929kg)
    Engine: Hispano-Suiza 8B or Wolseley W.4A Viper.
    Max. Speed: 120mph (193km/h)
    Range: 300 miles (483km)
    Armament: -
    Machine Guns: 1 x 0.303" Vickers (sync.)
    1 x 0.303" Lewis
    Bombs: 4 x 25lb Cooper Bombs
    Variants: -

    SE5
    Single seat fighter powered by Hispano Suiza 8a engine producing 150 hp.

    SE5a
    Improved version of SE5 powered by Hispano Suiza 8a or Wolseley Viper engine both producing 200 hp.

    SE5b
    Experimental prototype, with semi-sesquiplane wings, streamlined nose and retractable radiator.

    SE5e
    United States assembled SE5a powered by Wright-Hispano E engine producing 180 hp and with plywood skinned fuselage.



    Rob.
    A very good overview of the SE5a but just a clarification - the maximum speed listed is for level flight. For an extended steep dive, it's maximum speed after a steep dive is a lot more. Exactly how much more is not certain - but at least 200mph is not an exaggeration and maybe even more - a lot more.

    "Now, I want you to do some fast diving with your engine full on, and diving vertically. You can get up to nearly 300 m.p.h..." !

    http://www.southsearepublic.org/arti..._dive_an_se5a/

    The one thing the SE5a did extremely well was dive.

  40. #40

    Default

    Very entertaining Nicola.
    However, on trying this experiment I seem unable to get a ridge in the plastic of my wing.
    Kyte.
    "Courage is the art of being the only one who knows you're scared to death."

  41. #41

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Flying Officer Kyte View Post
    The S.E.5. was extremely stable, manoeverable,
    I wonder how that worked, since one of the factors contributing to good maneuverability is inherent *in*stability....

  42. #42

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by csadn View Post
    I wonder how that worked, since one of the factors contributing to good maneuverability is inherent *in*stability....
    The SE5a (like the Spad XIII) was not a classic dogfighter relying on turns in the horizontal plane (like the Camel) but instead on diving into attack and using the speed of the dive to zoom away. It was the reason why pilots were taught how to dive the plane an extreme speed.

    The following clip with original SE5a's and Fokker DVII's posted by surfimp gives a good idea of this type of combat
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=l8wmyCcbnX0

    It was manoeuvrable but in the vertical plane but not the horizontal plane.

  43. #43

    Default

    So just for fun I started with the two planes from the duel sets fokker and albatros vs. The camel and spad.
    I flew the Germans of course.
    I was able to keep two of them together and combine firing arcs.
    I used the albatros's wide turns and side slips to keep it just in front of the fokker.so I could double up on one plane.
    It worked very well.
    The first set tried worked very well, I need to pick another pair of planes to try.
    I am just doing this for fun, I want to figure out if I prefer 2 different maneuver decks or the same deck.
    using the same deck means the same turning radius making it hard to keep them together due to the need to keep the outside radius larger.
    While flying 2 of the same plane would be easy just start on the same space and use the same card each move, one plane under the other, but what fun is that?
    please give it a try and post your results
    Last edited by bmwrider; 10-30-2014 at 12:19.

  44. #44

    Default

    Using same deck for formation flying is completely O.K. while you use worse maneuver of two to keep the planes together.

  45. #45

    Default

    A pair of SPAD XIII could be hard to beat, if the opponent is using DR.1s.

    I find an Immelman doesn't hurt, to make the SPAD deadlier.
    When using DR.1s, try and get to the centre of the table (if it's safe lol) and let them whirl around whilst you pick them off. Some may disagree, but it works for me...most of the time

  46. #46

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by HTRAINo View Post
    A pair of SPAD XIII could be hard to beat, if the opponent is using DR.1s.

    I find an Immelman doesn't hurt, to make the SPAD deadlier.
    When using DR.1s, try and get to the centre of the table (if it's safe lol) and let them whirl around whilst you pick them off. Some may disagree, but it works for me...most of the time
    Keeping in mind that I am new...
    How does two spads do so well against a pair of dr1's without any tight turns?
    I have not yet learned to use these wide turns

  47. #47

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by bmwrider View Post
    Keeping in mind that I am new...
    How does two spads do so well against a pair of dr1's without any tight turns?
    I have not yet learned to use these wide turns
    The SPAD.XIII is what we call a "zoom and boom" fighter. That is, it has a high (relative) speed, which, usually, means that it's turning is not as good as others. The tactics for Zoom and Boom planes is to utilize the Immelmann (or reversal) card to change your direction. You zoom at the enemy, shoot (boom), and then zoom away, faster than he can catch you. Then you Immelmann, to reverse back at him, and repeat.
    Obviously, this is simplified, and turns and side slips are needed, and there are counters that opponents can use, but that's the gist of it.
    Karl
    It is impossible for a man to begin to learn what he thinks he knows. -- Epictetus

  48. #48

    Default

    Very nice summary! I would recommend familiarizing yourself with all of your available planes speed & maneuvers.

    Some are fast & due to the speed, do not turn well.

    Some are mid-range speed, and turn tighter.

    SPADs are good pursuit fighters, and very handy vs 2 seaters.
    If you mess up, you can be back in the fight in a jiffy!

    Everyone is different, and for me personally the SE5a is a thinking man's plane.
    I tend not to play it, due to the amount of steep moves in the deck.

  49. #49

    Default

    Hmmm!
    I have not tried to use speed to win a fight.
    I know in the real world speed was a very big part of the fight, but it seemed to me that it does not have a very big effect in this game.
    I will have to try fast planes against slow planes with tight turns and see what they can do.

  50. #50

    Default

    I do think that speed is important in the game too. With high speed planes you can simply renounce the fight or get away. Slower planes can use maneuverability to get in better position, etc, etc.
    Thanks


    Nick

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast


Similar Missions

  1. WSF Pair of Ponniers!
    By clipper1801 in forum Shapeways Models
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 08-19-2012, 17:32
  2. Pair of Brit Bullets
    By flash in forum Hobby Room
    Replies: 15
    Last Post: 08-18-2012, 22:55
  3. WSF Nice Pair of Bristols
    By flash in forum Shapeways Models
    Replies: 20
    Last Post: 03-16-2012, 04:49

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •