"Standard" unit markings?

[Diamondback]

It occurs to me that, after seeing our Painting Showcase threads, it might be helpful if we had a database about what the "standard" special markings were for various units at various times, like Jasta 11 Dreideckers having red cowlings, struts and undercarriage or Jasta 2's white fin with split black one side/white the other tailplane.

I'll edit a list observed from the various Osprey volumes in later as a start once I've had time to compile it, but thought it might be a good idea to just open up the discussion, see if anyone else already had something similar to save on duplicate effort.

Edit: The profiles spreadsheet's at https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...Gc&usp=sharing

[gully_raker]

Thats a great Idea Diamondback!
Unfortunately I do not have anything on file as I just go back into my Ospreys when I need info.

[Biggles downunder]

On a similar vein:

I have been thinking about going through my various Osprey 'Aces' publications and listing the colour plates details in each one.

Maybe we could start a thread for WW1 and another for WW2 and everyone could chip in to 'spread the load'.

I'll try and get an example up and see what everyone thinks in terms of usefulness.

[Diamondback]

Biggles, I actually have an Excel spreadsheet cataloging profiles already under construction. I'll post it on Google Docs tonight and post the link here for thoughts on refinement, along with the list of books I don't yet have access to.

[john snelling]

There could be different markings for different types of aircrat in the same Jasta. I earlier posted the markings for Albatros aircraft.

[john snelling]

for Albatros aircraft

Jasta 1 = black fin, white rudder
Jasta 2 = white tailplanes
Jasta 3 =
Jasta 4 = black spiral band around fuselage
Jasta 5 = green tailplanes with red outline
Jasta 6 = white tailplane with 2 longitudinal black stripes
Jasta 7 = all black fuselage and tailplane
Jasta 8 = white tailplane and fin with red latitudinal stripes
Jasta 9 =
Jasta 10 = yellow nose
Jasta 11 = red fuselage front
Jasta 12 = black rear fuselage and tailplane
Jasta 13 = green nose;blue rear fuselage + tailplane; white fin + rudder
Jasta 14 = black+white longitudinal stripe on fuselage sides
Jasta 15 = red nose part; Prussian blue fuselage and tailplane
Jasta 16 = black tailplane
Jasta 17 = white tailplane + fin; black rudder
Jasta 18 (1917) = red forward fuselage; Prussian blue rear fuselage + tailplane
Jasta 18 (1918) = Vermillion red forward fuselage; white rear fuselage + tailplane
Jasta 19 = dark green rudder
Jasta 21 = dark green spinner and fuselage back; black+white fuselage band
Jasta 22 = olive green fin, white rudder
Jasta 23 = black tailplane with white latitudinal band
Jasta 24 = white forward fuselage
Jasta 26 = black+white striped fuselage ("Zebras")
Jasta 27 = yellow spinner and tailplane; black fuselage
Jasta 28 = yellow tailplane with 2 longitudinal black stripes
Jasta 29 = ?
Jasta 32 = black tailplane, white spinner
Jasta 34 = white fuselages
Jasta 35 = white chevron on the top of the top wing and a black chevron on the under side of the bottom wing
Jasta 36 = blue forward fuselage
Jasta 37 = white tailplane with black diagonal stripes
Jasta 40 (1917) = med green + white tailplanes
Jasta 40 (1918) = black fuselage, white tailplane
Jasta 50 = white tailplane with 2 black chevrons
Jasta 64 = black tailplanes with 2 longitudinal red stripes
Jasta 65 (1917) = deep red forward fuselage
Jasta 65 (1918) = Deep red forward fuselage; Prussian blue rear fuselage; white fin + rudder
Jasta 69 = yellow forward fuselage, black mid fuselage; yellow tailplane; white fin + rudder
Jasta 70 = deep red nose and tailplane; white rudder and elevator
Jasta 71 = white tailplane with 3 longitudinal stripes; red fin
Jasta 72 = Saxon green nose and hood; white tailplane, fin + rudder
Jasta 73 = black spiral band around fuselage, Zebra tailplane, white rudder
Jasta 74 = dark blue nose section
Jasta 75 = grey tailplane with 3 white longitudinal stripes; white fin, elevator + rudder
Jasta 76 = dark blue rudder and tailplane with 2 longitudinal white stripes
Jasta 77 = lilac spinner, tailplane, fin and rudder
Jasta 78 = ?
Jasta 79 = dark blue tailplane with 3 longitudinal light blue stripes; white spinner
Jasta 80 = black tailplane with two longitudinal white stripes; black fin, white rudder

Naval Units
MFJ-1 = yellow spinner, hood and rudder
MFJ-2 = yellow nose; white rudder
Seefrosta 1 = yellow nose and tail section; white rudder
Seefrosta 2 = white nose; yellow tail section

[Diamondback]

And I also had an idea for Jasta 11's trans-red overdopes where you can see the original finish underneath. Would applying a topcoat of trans-red like larger-scale modelers use for nav lights work?

[Biggles downunder]

Biggles, I actually have an Excel spreadsheet cataloging profiles already under construction. I'll post it on Google Docs tonight and post the link here for thoughts on refinement, along with the list of books I don't yet have access to.

Ok - I'll wait and then see if I (or anyone else) can plug the gaps.

[Biggles downunder]

Wow John, that is a very comprehensive list!!

[Diamondback]

Okay, so here's the inventory re books, WWI only...

	Do Have	Do NOT Have
Aviation Elite Units	#16 'Richthofen's Circus' Jagdgeschwader nr I #17 SPA124 Lafayette Escadrille #18 Groue de Combat 12, Les Cicognes (not yet indexed) #19 Jagdgeschwader nr II 'Berthold' #26 Jaagdstaffel 2 'Boelcke' #28 USAS 1st Pursuit Group #33 No 56 Squadron RAF/RFC	#40 Jasta 18 - The Red Noses #41 No 60 Squadron RFC/RAF
Aircraft of the Aces	#32 Albatros Aces of WWI #33 Nieuport Aces of WWI #39 SPAD VII Aces of WWI #40 Fokker Dr.I Aces of WWI #42 American Aces of WWI #45 British & Empire Aces of WWI #46 Austro-Hungarian Aces of WWI #47 SPAD XII/XIII Aces of WWI #48 Dolphin & Snipe Aces of WWI #52 Sopwith Camel Aces of WWI #53 Fokker D.VII Aces of WWI, Part 1 #62 Sopwith Triplane Aces of WWI #63 Fokker D.VII Aces of WWI, Part 2 #66 Balloon-Busting Aces of WWI #67 Sopwith Pup Aces of WWI #71 Pfalz Scout Aces of WWI	#73 Early German Aces of WWI #77 Albatros Aces of WWI, Part 2 #78 SE5/5a Aces of WWI #79 Bristol F2 Fighter Aces of WWI #88 Pusher Aces of WWI #89 Italian Aces of WWI #97 Naval Aces of WWI, Part 1 #104 Naval Aces of WWI, Part 2 #110 Austro-Hungarian Albatros Aces of WWI #111 Russian Aces of WWI #118 Aces of Jagdstaffel 17

I also need to check and catalog some of my other favorite references, like the Specialty Press Warbird Tech Series and Squadron/Signal's Aircraft in Action and Walk Around series.

[Biggles downunder]

I'm at work at the moment but from memory I have Aircraft of the Aces Nos. 73, 77, 79, 88, 97, 104, 110. So give me some time and I should be able to fill those gaps.

[Diamondback]

Thanks--it was a belated thought that I should have added the profile numbers too--I'll fix that next revision, I guess... If anybody else has any thoughts for refinements, I'd appreciate that as well.

[Biggles downunder]

Maybe include a column for 'contributor' so that you have some way of checking back if there appears to be an error or inconsistency.

[Diamondback]

Good idea, Biggles. If you PM me your email, I'll add you as an Approved Editor. (Same with anybody else who feels like chipping in a cross-check. )

[john snelling]

The unit marking list for the Fokker D.VII can be found Kagero published book "Fokker D.VII - the lethal weapon". Also for "Pflaz - fighter aircraft from Rhineland the Wine country" another Kagero book. For Fokker triplanes aircraft there is a website with alot of info google paperwarbirds triplanes and it should show up.

A man called Dan-Sam whom recently passed away was a fountain of info. Some of his work can be found at the aerodrome site.

Sorry to ruin all your fun.

[john snelling]

The unit marking list for the Fokker D.VII can be found Kagero published book "Fokker D.VII - the lethal weapon". Also for "Pflaz - fighter aircraft from Rhineland the Wine country" another Kagero book. For Fokker triplanes aircraft there is a website with alot of info google paperwarbirds triplanes and it should show up.

A man called Dan-Sam whom recently passed away was a fountain of info. Some of his work can be found at the aerodrome site.

http://www.rafweb.org/SqnMark001.htm for British aircraft

http://albindenis.free.fr/Site_escad...es_1_a_500.htm for french

For any A-H fliks ask me.

Sorry to ruin all your fun.

[Biggles downunder]

The unit marking list for the Fokker D.VII can be found Kagero published book "Fokker D.VII - the lethal weapon"....snip

I have this one on my bookshelf.

[Flying Officer Kyte]

Of the missing books on the list I have:-

#40 Jasta 18 - The Red Noses
#41 No 60 Squadron RFC/RAF

#73 Early German Aces of WWI
#77 Albatros Aces of WWI, Part 2
#78 SE5/5a Aces of WWI
#79 Bristol F2 Fighter Aces of WWI
#73 Early German Aces of WWI
#77 Albatros Aces of WWI, Part 2
#78 SE5/5a Aces of WWI
#79 Bristol F2 Fighter Aces of WWI
#88 Pusher Aces of WWI
#89 Italian Aces of WWI
#97 Naval Aces of WWI, Part 1
#104 Naval Aces of WWI, Part 2
#110 Austro-Hungarian Albatros Aces of WWI
#111 Russian Aces of WWI.

So that just leaves #118 Aces of Jagdstaffel 17 for someone to find.
Rob.

[Diamondback]

I'm not sure AOA#118's even out yet... I have an Osprey spreadsheet I update every time they announce new releases.

[Pseudotheist]

A man called Dan-Sam whom recently passed away was a fountain of info. Some of his work can be found at the aerodrome site.

You mean Dan-San Abbott?

Maybe include a column for 'contributor' so that you have some way of checking back if there appears to be an error or inconsistency.

The column you'll want is 'source'. It matters less who updated the spreadsheet than where they got their info.

[Diamondback]

Todd, having both can't hurt... that way if I missed some subtle detail difference between the same plane in two different books, someone can call me on it.

[gully_raker]

Okay, so here's the inventory re books, WWI only...

	Do Have	Do NOT Have
Aviation Elite Units	#16 'Richthofen's Circus' Jagdgeschwader nr I #17 SPA124 Lafayette Escadrille #18 Groue de Combat 12, Les Cicognes (not yet indexed) #19 Jagdgeschwader nr II 'Berthold' #26 Jaagdstaffel 2 'Boelcke' #28 USAS 1st Pursuit Group #33 No 56 Squadron RAF/RFC	#40 Jasta 18 - The Red Noses #41 No 60 Squadron RFC/RAF
Aircraft of the Aces	#32 Albatros Aces of WWI #33 Nieuport Aces of WWI #39 SPAD VII Aces of WWI #40 Fokker Dr.I Aces of WWI #42 American Aces of WWI #45 British & Empire Aces of WWI #46 Austro-Hungarian Aces of WWI #47 SPAD XII/XIII Aces of WWI #48 Dolphin & Snipe Aces of WWI #52 Sopwith Camel Aces of WWI #53 Fokker D.VII Aces of WWI, Part 1 #62 Sopwith Triplane Aces of WWI #63 Fokker D.VII Aces of WWI, Part 2 #66 Balloon-Busting Aces of WWI #67 Sopwith Pup Aces of WWI #71 Pfalz Scout Aces of WWI	#73 Early German Aces of WWI #77 Albatros Aces of WWI, Part 2 #78 SE5/5a Aces of WWI #79 Bristol F2 Fighter Aces of WWI #88 Pusher Aces of WWI #89 Italian Aces of WWI #97 Naval Aces of WWI, Part 1 #104 Naval Aces of WWI, Part 2 #110 Austro-Hungarian Albatros Aces of WWI #111 Russian Aces of WWI #118 Aces of Jagdstaffel 17

I also need to check and catalog some of my other favorite references, like the Specialty Press Warbird Tech Series and Squadron/Signal's Aircraft in Action and Walk Around series.

I have the 2 Elite Unit Ospreys you are missing plus Albartoss Aces P2, SE 5 & 5a, Pusher Aces plus the two Naval Aces ones.

If you need images I can scan them & post.

[gully_raker]

I'm not sure AOA#118's even out yet... I have an Osprey spreadsheet I update every time they announce new releases.

If memory serves this is one by Greg van Wyndgarden & is due out around Christmas.

[Biggles downunder]

Good idea, Biggles. If you PM me your email, I'll add you as an Approved Editor. (Same with anybody else who feels like chipping in a cross-check. )

PM sent.