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Thread: Preferred Table Type?

  1. #1

    Jack Hooligan
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    Default Preferred Table Type?

    Do you guys prefer playing WoG on mats similar to the old Nexus and upcoming Ares where buildings, trees, etc are printed on and all is flat in 2-d, or do you prefer to have small model (3-6mm) buildings, trees, etc so the ground is 3-d?

  2. #2

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    My preference would be to have a bunch of 3d terrain, but the reality is that I don't have the time nor the money at the moment to spare on doing it up right. When playing at the game store we use printed mats when we can.

  3. #3

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    3d is pretty but too much of a bother while gaming, so flat mats work.

  4. #4

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    2D for aerial games

  5. #5

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    2D for our group - 3D just means more things to unbalance the models when they are several pegs high

  6. #6

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    I have to go with Al, David and Brian on this one - 3D terrain is pretty to look at but not conducive to quick and efficient game play.

  7. #7

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    I use 2d for serious games but add some 3d for solo games just for the bling factor and because it can be adjusted by me and not some part time gamer.

    Having said that, I may use a specific target like my ship for a Convention game just to draw the punters, but use the old trick of having it on a card under the model for the times when a plane has to cross it.
    Rob.

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by Flying Officer Kyte View Post
    I use 2d for serious games but add some 3d for solo games just for the bling factor and because it can be adjusted by me and not some part time gamer.

    Having said that, I may use a specific target like my ship for a Convention game just to draw the punters, but use the old trick of having it on a card under the model for the times when a plane has to cross it.
    Rob.
    This is my preferred method as well... but 99.9% of the time its 2D for me and my games.

  9. #9

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    What I have considered in the past (discarding the idea due to lack of funds and ability to do the project) is to do a table with 3d modelling using model railroad materials and skills, then place a clear plexiglass sheet about 4 or 6 inches over the table to actually game on. This would give the best of both worlds. Unfortunately out of my price and skill level.

    The problem with 3d is that it works gaming wise with ground tactical units, using aerial units in canyons of rock or masonry leads to losses due to pilot error rather than enemy action, and that is no fun.

    As far as actual mechanics, the 3d leads to tipping models, tiny aircraft pushing towering buildings out of their way, doing things even tanks have problems doing.

    Just not really doable with current technology - again we need holographic projectors and futuristic systems so that you can effect the air to air combat in a simplistic way so that it remains fun while giving the appearance of you in the cockpit burning to death. (Of course it is you, obviously it won't be me!)

  10. #10

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    If i could i would have a 3D modeled gaming table and would put a glass plate above it in such a way that it won't crush the 3D terrain.

    Ha silly. Just the moment i type this i look up the last posting and see that wargamer has posted the very same idea

  11. #11

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    There was a thread around here once upon a time in which someone posted a pic of that very thing, though I seem to recall it was just being used as a train layout and not a gaming surface.

  12. #12

    Jack Hooligan
    Guest


    Default

    Thanks for all of the responses.

    I should have clarified that I only game Wings of W/G with minis and altitude rules so I'm already willing to accept levels of efficiency loss in play. To me, as a long time minis-gamer, it's part of the draw of the game.

    I agree with others that simply moving the tree/house/hill/ etc out of the way while flying over isn't a bother. It would seem to be a big deal if most of your table is covered in terrain. I'm thinking if you're playing on a pretty much open field but a few trees and a small town/village in one corner, it'd really be no hassle but just having those small bits of 3-d models would add a lot of bang to the game.
    Last edited by Jack Hooligan; 11-27-2012 at 10:43.

  13. #13

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    To me it's all about surface size. I use a 6' x 6' setup in my game room. It seems to work really well to allow for some nice maneuvers.

  14. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hooligan View Post
    Thanks for all of the responses.

    I'm thinking if you're playing on a pretty much open field but a few trees and a small town/village in one corner, it'd really be no hassle but just having those small bits of 3-d models would add a lot of bang to the game.
    Here you go Jeff. Is that the sort of thing that you mean?




    Rob.

  15. #15

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    Here are some photos of a Canvas Eagles game played at the Millennium Convention in Round Rock (Austin), Texas this month. I didn't play in the game but took some photos of the table. The table even has flashing lights representing shell explosions but it does not show in the photos.

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  16. #16

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    3d looks good but practically I prefer 2d

  17. #17

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    3D looks cool, but for me I'd stick with the 2D no matter what. The game is designed around 2D and 3D just doesn't seem practical in most applications. Plus I really like the mats that WOW and WOG have produced.

  18. #18

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    2D for me!!! But 3D is always good eye candy when attracting attention to the game!!!

  19. #19

    Default

    I would prefer 2D because as others have said, the models would get in the way of moving the aircraft. However, that table in Austin Texas looks amazing! I suppose that one day we may have a tabletop, which is a giant computer tablet and then we could display whatever we liked in 2D or 3D and freely move the models.

  20. #20

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hooligan View Post
    Do you guys prefer playing WoG on mats similar to the old Nexus and upcoming Ares where buildings, trees, etc are printed on and all is flat in 2-d, or do you prefer to have small model (3-6mm) buildings, trees, etc so the ground is 3-d?
    I paint my own custom 2d mats on poster board. Everything is flat, but I like to use 3d models for targets and objectives: 6mm scale works pretty well and instead of expensive resin terrain pieces, I use painted buildings from a Monopoly game bought for pennies at a yard sale. Name:  100_0226.jpg
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  21. #21

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    I prefer 2D-mats.

    3D objects look nice, but you get often problems to place the minis near to the objects. So most of the targets and objects are 2D, too.

  22. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by Albert Ross View Post
    I paint my own custom 2d mats on poster board. Everything is flat, but I like to use 3d models for targets and objectives: 6mm scale works pretty well and instead of expensive resin terrain pieces, I use painted buildings from a Monopoly game bought for pennies at a yard sale.

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    Nice terrain Stuart. I have that train and big gun too.

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    I must start collecting some of those village units you have made, as soon as I get the other things on my workbench done. I must hire in some Elves like Clipper. I hear that there will be some seeking work after the Christmas rush concludes.
    Rob.
    Last edited by Flying Officer Kyte; 11-28-2012 at 02:11.

  23. #23

    Exclamation

    I mostly play on a 2D mat (Nexus or other) but do like 3D for certain missions like Balloon busting where I add the Balloons with the card beneath plus Winch trucks, AAtrucks & Flack markers.
    One scenario that does lend itself to 3D is Flash's Aerodrome Attack. For that one 3D is absolutely necessary & does not impede play. See Pics.

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  24. #24

    Question

    Quote Originally Posted by Albert Ross View Post
    I paint my own custom 2d mats on poster board. Everything is flat, but I like to use 3d models for targets and objectives: 6mm scale works pretty well and instead of expensive resin terrain pieces, I use painted buildings from a Monopoly game bought for pennies at a yard sale.
    G'day Stuart! Great to hear from you again. How is your wife travelling after her problems?

  25. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by gully_raker View Post
    G'day Stuart! Great to hear from you again. How is your wife travelling after her problems?
    Hi Barry, thanks for asking it's been a long road to recovery, but she is doing much better now and was even able to get airborne in the new Gotha recently! Let me tell you, those things are hard to knock down....you need two scouts at least to concentrate on it and more of there is any escort.

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  26. #26

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    Good to hear Stuart.
    Please pass on my best wishes to your Good Lady.
    Rob.

  27. #27

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    WOW those are really great photos. Coog someone has to much time their hands for the outstanding work done on that. Reminds me of a WWII naval game I saw years ago where the U-Boats were under the plexiglass on extending pointers to show depth. All these are all great photos and insperation to all on gaming tables.

  28. #28

    Jack Hooligan
    Guest


    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Flying Officer Kyte View Post
    Here you go Jeff. Is that the sort of thing that you mean?




    Rob.
    This is close to the idea. Perhaps the buildings would be a little smaller.

    How'd you make that mat?

  29. #29

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hooligan View Post
    This is close to the idea. Perhaps the buildings would be a little smaller.

    How'd you make that mat?
    Hi Jack.
    The buildings are 15mm ACW. which fit in well with the low level ground attack scenario. As you can see they are placed as eye candy and do not impinge on the playing area.
    For altitude games 6mm buildings are better.
    I got the mat from Terrain mats. However, Ares are about to release a series of new mats which compare well pricewise with the one I bought and which will be more adaptable.

    http://www.terrainmat.com/MicroMatWesternFront1.1.html

    Hope this helps.
    Rob.

  30. #30

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    I have tried 10mm, 6mm and 2mm but when all said and done like the rest of you I belive cards are the best, if there is an objective terain peice need for I will use a 3d model.

  31. #31

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    Oooh! Just noticed terrain mat do custom sizes (after looking at the link). I have only ever played 2d, but i'm adding 2 AA gun trucks to add a more 3d element to the AA cards.

    So I guess for objective pieces, I would say yes providing there is a suitable card in play to replace it with when things get 'busy'.

  32. #32

    Jack Hooligan
    Guest


    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Flying Officer Kyte View Post
    Hi Jack.
    The buildings are 15mm ACW. which fit in well with the low level ground attack scenario. As you can see they are placed as eye candy and do not impinge on the playing area.
    For altitude games 6mm buildings are better.
    I got the mat from Terrain mats. However, Ares are about to release a series of new mats which compare well pricewise with the one I bought and which will be more adaptable.

    http://www.terrainmat.com/MicroMatWesternFront1.1.html

    Hope this helps.
    Rob.
    Wow, that mat from terrainmat looks perfect! Higher price though for sure. I've seen the upcoming Ares mats and they look good too, but for me they feel a little to 'high up'. I like how your terrain mat looks like the game takes places at a lower altitude/right above the battlefield as opposed to up in near space.

    I also like the idea of getting a Hotz mat with the trench on one side and enhanced euro fields on the other. Any experience with the Hotz mat?
    Last edited by Jack Hooligan; 11-29-2012 at 13:19.

  33. #33

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    Haven't heard of Terrain Mats so have to check them out. I use a Hotz mat for my playing surface.

  34. #34

    Default

    I prefer a 2D surface coupled with 3D markers for flak, AA guns, tanks, ground observers, and plane crashes. The observers and tanks are made by micromachine, the AA guns are from Axis & Allies, and flak/flaming wreckage are supplied by Litko. I got some winch trucks to sit near the base of the balloons as well.

    As for clouds, I just picked up these from EBay. They're 3" in diameter, with a slightly bigger outer ring (as seen in the lower left of the photo). They haven't arrived yet, but I think they will work nicely as clouds for blocking line of sight. When a plane base overlaps the circle, just remove the middle bit (leaving a relatively flat ring):


    http://item.mobileweb.ebay.com/viewi...d=271103136095

    Figure I will hit the upper "gray" area with a spritz of white primer to lighten it up just a bit (although it makes for a nice storm cloud aesthetic)

  35. #35

    Default

    Hi Keegan.
    Nice to hear from you again.
    I use Litco for my splash markers and ground burst markers, also wit a bit of paint wash applied and a bit of hot air gun to deform them from the 2D into something a bit more organic looking.
    Rob.

  36. #36

    Default

    I prefer any table where a cat can be easily removed.

  37. #37

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by csadn View Post
    I prefer any table where a cat can be easily removed.
    lol...when you find such a magical table, please let us know.

  38. #38

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    Quote Originally Posted by sparty View Post
    lol...when you find such a magical table, please let us know.
    The card table we normally use is quite effective -- the cat's claws cannot easily penetrate the top cover.

    A typical wooden table would also work. The important part is having a surface which a "velcro cat" cannot attach itself to.

  39. #39

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    HA! I've found the damage is done by the time kitty comes to rest. A cat is the ultimate wind drift rule in my experience with Wings of War and my old cat.

  40. #40

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by wargamer View Post
    3d is pretty but too much of a bother while gaming, so flat mats work.
    Ditto!

  41. #41

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    Quote Originally Posted by Carl_Brisgamer View Post
    I have to go with Al, David and Brian on this one - 3D terrain is pretty to look at but not conducive to quick and efficient game play.
    Ditto

  42. #42

    Default

    2d for me also. Some of my friends have 4 thumbs and one finger.

  43. #43

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    Quote Originally Posted by sparty View Post
    HA! I've found the damage is done by the time kitty comes to rest. A cat is the ultimate wind drift rule in my experience with Wings of War and my old cat.
    The cat who likes to interfere with games is remarkably deft about it -- he hurls himself onto the table, yet can land without touching anything. This does make it easier to remove him from the table.



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